NFL 2019 Season Thread

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

albion, would love to hear your thoughts on Sunday's game.

Wife's birthday weekend, so just now getting around to seeing this.

But my post-game thoughts:

Kittle is a fucking monster. If that dude stays healthy, he'll be carrying y'all for years.

Eli Apple goes from "the Saints should let that dude walk; he's totally replaceable" to "He's a really good #2 corner and they need to make sure they keep him" on a week to week basis. Unfortunately, this week was bad Apple.

Felt like the 2010-2015 Saints: great offense; sieve defense.

If this were a video game, Jimmy G. would get a +10 boost in confidence based on that game. That was the sort of "Holy shit, I really can do this" game that young QBs need.

Before the game, I would have predicted the Saints winning by about a touchdown b/c they were at home after a long week of rest and y'all were coming off a tough game at Baltimore.

But that's why they play the games. Good job. Here's hoping we can repay the favor at y'all's place in the NFC Championship.

[NobodyHere]

Bengals: NFL investigating if Patriots filmed sideline - NFL.com

[cuervo72]

No hid GoPro.

[EagleFan]

The Eagles suck... there I said it.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Bengals: NFL investigating if Patriots filmed sideline - NFL.com

Everyone does it

Of course the pats are worse at cheating than everyone else so they keep getting caught.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

The Eagles suck... there I said it.

I'll bite: how did it get THIS bad?

This is Falcons-esque, except with the Falcons you could kinda see that SB being their peak. Guys declined or regressed to the mean after career years.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I'll bite: how did it get THIS bad?

This is Falcons-esque, except with the Falcons you could kinda see that SB being their peak. Guys declined or regressed to the mean after career years.

They lost some of their players that had the heart of champions. I know that sounds cliche but it seemed to make a difference in their attitude. They also got lazy after winning, or seem to have.

I also think Frank Reich deserves a hell of a lot of credit for the super bowl season. Pederson falls in love with the pass, even when running the ball is working and is what you should be doing at that point in the game he will go away from it for series at a time. Next thing you know they have had consecutive 3 and outs and have given up more points.

Wentz has shown nothing, overthrows, fumbles, holding the ball too long, throws too many receivers into big hits. The fans don't need all the preaching, we need on field performance. His apologists will point to the dropped passes but there is much more to it than that.

I am just so uninterested in this version of the team right now. Even last year when they were basically in this position and then played their way into the playoffs I still had hope each week. At this point I feel hollow watching them. Maybe a little over dramatic but that is the closest way to describe it.

[bhlloy]

Wentz just looks so incredibly tentative. The receivers don’t help, but his confidence looks completely shot. Is he playing with injuries still?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

They lost some of their players that had the heart of champions. I know that sounds cliche but it seemed to make a difference in their attitude.

Funny enough, "no heart at all" is exactly what a Philly native FB friend of mine posted about them tonight.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Wife's birthday weekend, so just now getting around to seeing this.

But my post-game thoughts:

Kittle is a fucking monster. If that dude stays healthy, he'll be carrying y'all for years.

Eli Apple goes from "the Saints should let that dude walk; he's totally replaceable" to "He's a really good #2 corner and they need to make sure they keep him" on a week to week basis. Unfortunately, this week was bad Apple.

Felt like the 2010-2015 Saints: great offense; sieve defense.

If this were a video game, Jimmy G. would get a +10 boost in confidence based on that game. That was the sort of "Holy shit, I really can do this" game that young QBs need.

Before the game, I would have predicted the Saints winning by about a touchdown b/c they were at home after a long week of rest and y'all were coming off a tough game at Baltimore.

But that's why they play the games. Good job. Here's hoping we can repay the favor at y'all's place in the NFC Championship.

This was a hell of a game. Pre-game, I was definitely hoping for the “Brees is a pocket passer and the 49ers pass rush eats that sort of QB alive” narrative to take hold, especially because Brees has looked mortal (old?) quite a bit this year. I was also extremely worried that a team that utilizes a TON of the play clock regularly and has trouble burning timeouts early because they can’t beat that clock would have a lot of trouble in the harsh noise environment of the Dome; I figured if the defense flinched against the Saints offense, they were in major trouble because the offense just wasn’t reliable enough to keep up.

The pocket passer narrative very, very obviously didn’t hold up, and especially when y’all had 27 points after four drives I was terrified. I was incredibly impressed with the Saints’ offensive line and Brees’s ability to release the ball so damned quickly to limit the 49ers D-Line from controlling the passing game. I absolutely wonder what would have happened had Cook not been knocked out of the game early; the 49ers defense seemed to have ZERO answer for him early. I also think Garoppolo rolled triple sevens in that game...I think even on a bad Eli Apple day he pulls that game out maybe 5 times out of 100. Before this game, even despite some of his nice recent performances, I liked Jimmy G as a slightly above average QB, but that’s about all. That being said you are absolutely right that this could be the sort of confidence-building game that propels him to believe that he IS capable of that regularly, and maybe pushes him into the conversation for top ten QB in the league.

I was a little surprised Payton didn’t go to Latavius Murray more; he seemed to be having much more success than Kamara (probably because the 49ers were scheming to stop him specifically, though I don’t know how true that is). That being said, how do you complain about the Saints offense just destroying one of the top two defenses in the league like that?

I’ll also admit that non-call on the fake punt would have been pretty hard to swallow if it happened to my team. I can easily argue that the defender simply played him like he was a gunner (which he was), but I am obviously biased so it’s hard to tell if I’m just trying to make myself feel better about benefiting from a tough-to-watch non-call.

I think at this point the Saints are clearly the class of the NFC, and I would love to see the 49ers survive to see a rematch in January.

Finally - holy cow the crew that called the game was incredibly terrible. Are there just not any good announcing crews anymore? At this point I’m starting to like Chris Collinsworth, which HAS to be a sign of the apocalypse.

Edit: I can’t believe I forgot to mention that Kittle play on 4th and 2. That might be one of the best single plays in 49er regular season history - and it’s got some big competition. I don’t remember the last time I was out of my seat shouting during a regular season game, but that was one of those moments. What a monster run after the catch.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Wentz just looks so incredibly tentative. The receivers don’t help, but his confidence looks completely shot. Is he playing with injuries still?

They say he is 100% healthy.

[Vince, Pt. II]

It’s crazy to me that the 49ers have become a team where an opponent can say “they have so many weapons on offense.” Emmanuel Sanders was such a huge get, and combined with the emergence of Deebo Samuel and the Raheem Mostert show recently have given the 49ers offense a whole new dimension to pair with Kittle.

And damn is it fun to watch Kyle Shanahan scheme up plays.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

It’s crazy to me that the 49ers have become a team where an opponent can say “they have so many weapons on offense.” Emmanuel Sanders was such a huge get, and combined with the emergence of Deebo Samuel and the Raheem Mostert show recently have given the 49ers offense a whole new dimension to pair with Kittle.

And damn is it fun to watch Kyle Shanahan scheme up plays.

That Kittle play was savage.

[bhlloy]

The Giants not being able to do anything on offense in the second half and losing this game is probably the best thing for Daniel Jones in the short term. As well as keeping them in the top 3 in the draft.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Everyone does it

Of course the pats are worse at cheating than everyone else so they keep getting caught.

According to belli-fuck, no, they don't, because its explicitly laid out in the rules. The verbal shit posting of an excuse and walk back of the situation by the Patriots is fucking laughable.

If they're so afraid of the vaunted Bengals offense *cackles, sorry I can't keep a straight face* That they need to do this its fucking pathetic.

2 main reasons their response is utter bullshit.

1: Even the "production crews" for the tv show know the NFL rules, they also know they are supposed to report in to both teams in any stadium game prep. They failed miserably at even trying.

2: and most importantly, Why would you send a tv show film crew to a random game that JUST happens to be our NEXT opponent? If you're honestly just trying to sample what a roving scout does they wouldn't send them any farther than absolutely necessary aka, NY was closer, Philly was closer, buffalo was closer but no, they CHOSE to send them to Cleveland where their next opponent was.


Fuck the Cheatriots. The unmitigated and ongoing 20 year run of playing the league like a fucking fiddle is just fucking sad.

Everything they've accomplished will end up with a huge asterisk next to it.


And PLEASE lets be clear, the Bengals probably couldn't beat them if they were completely healthy on their best day because frankly, the team is a mess right now. So don't give me the booh hoo Bengals fan bullshit.

That franchise has tarnished the game as a whole while pretending to be some sort of white knights riding the wave of populism.

/end rant

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I’ll also admit that non-call on the fake punt would have been pretty hard to swallow if it happened to my team. I can easily argue that the defender simply played him like he was a gunner (which he was), but I am obviously biased so it’s hard to tell if I’m just trying to make myself feel better about benefiting from a tough-to-watch non-call.

I don't like any play call where you are pretty much depending on the refs to throw a flag for you. I mean, yeah, it was defensive holding. But the fake punt rules are weird and the officials thinking "just let the gunners and the return team get physical" isn't a crazy thing to have happened.

With Payton, you learn to live and die by his crazy playcalls. Onside kick in the Super Bowl that works? He's a genius! Fake punt that goes horribly wrong? He's being "too cute!"

I'll take the bad with the good.

The hard part for me is going from being 1 minute away from having inside track on the 1 seed to now needing help to get a first round bye. NFC is too loaded this year.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I don't like any play call where you are pretty much depending on the refs to throw a flag for you. I mean, yeah, it was defensive holding. But the fake punt rules are weird and the officials thinking "just let the gunners and the return team get physical" isn't a crazy thing to have happened.

With Payton, you learn to live and die by his crazy playcalls. Onside kick in the Super Bowl that works? He's a genius! Fake punt that goes horribly wrong? He's being "too cute!"

I'll take the bad with the good.

The hard part for me is going from being 1 minute away from having inside track on the 1 seed to now needing help to get a first round bye. NFC is too loaded this year.

Yeah, I can relate to the "take the bad with the good" with Shanahan on it side. Tons of my friends were irritated with the late sack, thinking they should have just run it again; I prefer the aggression, and will take getting burned every once in a while.

[albionmoonlight]

Vince, you might also appreciate this--apparently on the first two point conversion, Payton called it b/c he really liked the play they had drawn up. But y'all lined up "wrong" based on what you had shown on film so you ended up with an extra defender toward the playside that the Saints didn't account for.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Damn. That had to be frustrating for Payton. Would love to know if that was just happenstance for the 49ers, or there was something else involved. The crazy complexities of play calling in the NFL are fascinating to me.

[JPhillips]

If this is true it looks really bad for the Pats. From The Athletic:

According to sources who have viewed the tape, it shows about eight minutes of footage focusing on recording the Bengals’ sideline. It’s a direct view of the sideline as players run on and off the field and coaches make signals for plays. This isn’t an over-the-shoulder of the advanced scout who is doing his job stuff. This is shooting the sideline. For an extended period of time. The egregious nature of the video is why it set off the firestorm it did during the game with the Bengals executives in the press box.

[Jas_lov]

I just don't know how Bellichick is considered a lock for the HOF but those steroids ERA baseball players can't get in. They were both cheating and now the Patriots have been caught again.

[Kodos]

Cue the Patriots fans with "they just hate us because we win" defense.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Damn it, G-Men! I wanted you to win last night. JUST WIN!

[SirFozzie]

Looks like the Pats weren't cheating after all. Bad optics (especially considering the past of running right up to the line, and according to some, putting a foot over the line), but not an attempt to cheat.

(From The Athletic, behind paywall)

Bill Belichick was pressed Wednesday on one key remaining question regarding the sideline-video controversy between the Patriots and Bengals.

While Belichick stood pat with his responses, continuing to make it clear Patriots football operations had nothing to do with the actions or directions of the organization’s production crew, he didn’t go into detail about the scout’s vantage point of the video crew or whether the scout was aware of the rule that prohibits teams from videotaping opponents’ sidelines.

“He was doing his job,” Belichick said of the scout, who has not been identified. “That’s what he was doing. He was doing his job, like we all tried to do.”

The Athletic was able to connect those remaining missing dots Thursday.

If you missed it, here’s a primer on the events that led up to the Patriots sending a three-person production crew to Cleveland on Sunday for the game between the Browns and Bengals. The quick version is they were on hand to finish shooting an episode of “Do Your Job” on a week in the life of a Patriots pro scout.

Here are a few more details to fill in from Sunday morning and afternoon.

The Patriots advance scout arrived at FirstEnergy Stadium about three hours before the game. During the time before kickoff, the Patriots’ production crew interviewed the scout on camera. As part of the interview, the scout went through some bullet points about his normal activity on game days, including what he examines during games. A portion of his game-day studies include notes on the sideline, which is permissible by NFL rules and routine scouting activity for teams league-wide.

After the conclusion of the interview, the production crew shot B-roll – alternative video footage that airs over an interview – from the press box. The scout was assigned one seat in the third row, and the video crew was assigned one seat next to him. They shot some B-roll of the scout from next to him before the game and then into the first quarter. Because the scout was the subject of those candid shots, he was going about his business and attempting to block them out of his sightline to try to deflect the attention of having a production crew following him around in a work environment.

From there, the crew maneuvered about the press box and shot more B-roll of the scout, including some shots over his shoulder. Then the videographer relocated to the front row to an unoccupied section of the press box, with the producer stationed behind the camera.

From the scout’s location in the third row, he eventually noticed the crew had moved locations but couldn’t decipher what the crew had been shooting due to the angle between them. The scout was handling his own game-day job responsibilities.

The camera was attached to a monitor, so anyone in close proximity could see what the crew was shooting. And for eight minutes while the camera was fixed on the Bengals sideline, a Bengals employee recorded video of that monitor before reporting the activity to security.

The scout didn’t see the crew again until the two-minute warning in the second quarter when they were being interviewed about the incident.

So to answer the one remaining question, no, the scout was not in position to notice the crew was shooting video of the sideline.

[NobodyHere]

Nothing in the article changes the fact that there was video being taken of the Bengals sideline.

[Kodos]

Also, Trump did not press Ukraine to investigate Biden in exchange for military aid.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Nothing in the article changes the fact that there was video being taken of the Bengals sideline.

Yes, there was, which is why I said bad optics, but A) There was no intent to cheat, and B) The Patriots organization had NOTHING to do with it.

[Butter]

"Patriots production crew" = "Patriots organization had NOTHING to do with it"

Interesting.

[JPhillips]

I can't prove the Pats were cheating, but I can prove, a) they broke the rules, b) in the same way they broke the rules previously, c) using the same cover story they were told to use previously.

The Pats are outraged that people keep accusing them of cheating just because they've been caught cheating in the exact same way in the past.

[sabotai]

Janoris Jenkins waived by the Giants. All but 1 of the Giants CBs are now rookies or in their 2nd year (Hamilton is in his 4th year and is arguably the worst CB on the roster).

That clears $11.25M in cap space next season.

[jbergey22]

I think a year suspension for Belichik and the loss of 3 straight 1st rounders along with a million dollar fine should help them from making these "mistakes"

[SirFozzie]

*laughs*

You guys sure are bitter. Something Belichick has no control over, had no effect. Haters gonna hate.

They're living rent free in your head.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

*laughs*

You guys sure are bitter. Something Belichick has no control over, had no effect. Haters gonna hate.

They're living rent free in your head.

Well, rules are rules. And the Pats have used up their 'benefit of the doubt' excuse. At some point the hammer needs to be dropped.

They have made examples out of other cheaters in the past. Im not so sure Belichick had no control. He seems to use that excuse a lot for someone known for his great preparation and organization.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Well, rules are rules.

I was slow on the uptake but 2019 has finally convinced me that rules are NOT rules in the way I thought.

EDIT: Changed from "we" to "I"

[bhlloy]

Or let’s turn the question around - why is a production company just filming another teams sideline during a game for no reason? There’s going be enough plausible deniability that they will never track it back to anyone on the football side, but I know what I’m going to believe on this one. Each to their own.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Cue the Patriots fans with "they just hate us because we win" defense.

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

*laughs*

You guys sure are bitter. Something Belichick has no control over, had no effect. Haters gonna hate.

They're living rent free in your head.

That didn’t take long.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Or let’s turn the question around - why is a production company just filming another teams sideline during a game for no reason? There’s going be enough plausible deniability that they will never track it back to anyone on the football side, but I know what I’m going to believe on this one. Each to their own.

because they're doing a story on an advance scout, whose job is to monitor such things?

[Carman Bulldog]

The Patriots play best when they have a chip on their shoulder and have their us against the world, everyone hates us, is out to get us, blah, blah, blah mentality. My new theory is that this was all staged by Belichick to re-ignite this narrative and motivate his team.

[PilotMan]

It's a rare day where I'm actively cheering for the Bengals.

[bhlloy]

What was the Bears TE doing? One more pitch and that looked like a sure TD

[BishopMVP]

Unbelievable that Fox is not switching from a 44-15 game to Falcons/49ers

[BishopMVP]

Unbelievable the Rams have their starters in for that matter. I like Brandin Cooks & don't want to root for an injury, but Sean McVay would've deserved that if that was a real injury.

[jbergey22]

Props to the Pats. They were willing to do whatever it took to break their 2 game losing streak and beat the 1 win Bengals. And they did it in a big way. A statement game in a way. "We want to win so bad that we will cheat to gain an advantage over even the worst team in the league."

Haha

I wonder when the NFL will crackdown on the Pats illegal pick offense? They seem to get away with illegal picks at an unusual high level. Wes Welker and Edelman have made a career of the NFL pick and roll play.

[Butter]

Foz = Patriots organization had NOTHING to do with this.

Me - It was a Patriots production crew.

Foz - Ha, you sure are bitter!

.
.
.

Ok.

[spleen1015]

Maybe Belichick has cheated his whole career and that's why he's been so successful?

I don't believe that. I believe there is some sort of genius in there and that's why he's had the success he's had, both as Patriots HC and Giants DC. So, dude doesn't need to cheat. That's what makes it so bad IMO. You're already better than everyone else. No reason to cheat.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

What was the Bears TE doing? One more pitch and that looked like a sure TD

What Bears tight ends have done all year - nothing.

[albionmoonlight]

NFL Teams Planning for the Playoffs: Hmmm. We'll take a PR hit for it, but I wonder if it would be possible to bring in Antonio Brown. If we can keep the crazy down for just a month, he might bring us a title. Let's see what he's up to right now.

What He's Up To Right Now: Asking strangers on Twitter to commit grand theft auto for him:

Tow trucks Repo People someone anyone bring me my Bentley-it’s at this address 6154 Nw 41st drive coral springs fl 33067 police will not assist me !!!!

— AB (@AB84) December 16, 2019

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by Butter

Foz = Patriots organization had NOTHING to do with this.

Me - It was a Patriots production crew.

Foz - Ha, you sure are bitter!

.
.
.

Ok.

It wasn't a Patriots Production Crew.

You ARE bitter.

Videographer in Patriots-Bengals incident releases official statement | NBC Sports Boston

(He's hired by Kraft Sports Entertainment, the production company that does the Do Your Job series, and absolutely no connection to the Patriots. So much so, that apparently the public statement that the producer in question made caught the Pats as unaware as anyone else)

ProFootballTalk on Twitter: "Strange but true fact: The statement issued by the Patriots video producer on Sunday regarding last week's incident at the Bengals-Browns game was issued without the knowledge or involvement of the team."

[Butter]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

It wasn't a Patriots Production Crew.

Article:

"Mondillo reportedly has been suspended by the Patriots as a result of last week's actions."

Uhhhh.....

[SirFozzie]

Dola: Yes, it's bad optics. Yes, I think you can get the Pats for "failure to supervise" (after everything that's happened, you'd think the scouts say "Do not even point it towards the sidelines, considering the history"). I think they should be fined, and perhaps lose a late round draft pick.

But to try to hang this on Belichick and Kraft is just asinine.

It's known that the video crew only attended that one game, not any other. Are you saying that 13 games into the season, the Pats suddenly decided that they weren't good enough to beat the 1-12 Bengals without taping their sidelines? And to make it even MORE blatant, what the cameraman was taping was being shown to everyone in the press box who cared to look, since it was feeding to a monitor being publicly displayed right next to the cameraman?

Come on man, I know in your head that Kraft and Belichick are likely pantomine villains who go "How can we cheat the league this week! Mwahahaha!" and rub their hands in evil glee, but let's try occam's razor here.