Ray Rice Video Released

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by nol

Hell, if the first video hadn't come out (four days after the assault), would there have been any suspension at all? It would have been super easy to throw out the old "Welp, it says she assaulted him too, so it wasn't domestic assault" justification and let the peanut gallery run with it ("Just another golddigging ho trying to ruin an NFL player's reputation SMH").

I chuckled at the thought that this is even a question.

[Logan]

TMZ claims that tomorrow they will show proof that the league knew about the video and did nothing about it.

[mckerney]

Chris Berman on Ray Rice: "The Ravens acted right away." Dilfer: "They acted quickly and decisively." WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?

— SportsPickle (@sportspickle) September 9, 2014

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Matthean

No. It was a customer complaint. I don't see why it would need to be legal for both of them to be there when both could be interviewed separately. The Police interview people separately as well. Again, I don't see why in this case they had to be in the same room. If it's two strangers, that's one thing, but we are talking about people who are planning to marry each other. How open do you really expect them to be?

Sorry that you went through that but it's apples to oranges in this case. One is directly related to your job so they have to look into it. The other is not related to the job.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Sorry that you went through that but it's apples to oranges in this case. One is directly related to your job so they have to look into it. The other is not related to the job.

Bullshit.

It's absolutely related to the job insofar as the players can explicitly face disciplinary action for actions that harm the image of the league (or whatever the actual language is).

Keep trying.

[EagleFan]

Look, it's an awful thing that he did and he should have been held accountable for it.

The NFL comes off looking bad here (obviously Rice already has). Not one thing has changed since the original suspension. If what I have been hearing/reading is true and that Rice already told them exactly what happened and the tape verifies that, the release of this tape should not change a thing.

If I have heard incorrectly and he didn't tell them everything, then all bets are off.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Look, it's an awful thing that he did and he should have been held accountable for it.

The NFL comes off looking bad here (obviously Rice already has). Not one thing has changed since the original suspension. If what I have been hearing/reading is true and that Rice already told them exactly what happened and the tape verifies that, the release of this tape should not change a thing.

If I have heard incorrectly and he didn't tell them everything, then all bets are off.

I agree with you. Not sure what you're arguing.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

If what I have been hearing/reading is true and that Rice already told them exactly what happened and the tape verifies that, the release of this tape should not change a thing.

But what changed is that this (and by "this" I mean the release & the suspension) has nothing to do with domestic violence, it has to do with image. This is marketing, not rules or policy or social responsibility or anything else.

It's imaging.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Bullshit.

It's absolutely related to the job insofar as the players can explicitly face disciplinary action for actions that harm the image of the league (or whatever the actual language is).

Keep trying.

Keep trying... It's fairly straight forward logic.

One is directly job related. Customer complaints always have to be looked into as the issue happened on the job (or didn't as in this case).

To make this apples to apples... have someone accuse you of something, go through the legal system, have nothing happen to you. Then go to work and find out that your boss has decided to launch his own investigation and is talking to your accuser. The only thing your boss needs to know is that you were convicted of nothing and what is your side of the story. Is it something that is going to affect your performance? Anything beyond that becomes a witch hunt.

(hell of a catch by Fitzgerald even though he was out of bounds)

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I agree with you. Not sure what you're arguing.

Not arguing anything with that one, just making a statement. Sometimes I don't argue.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Keep trying... It's fairly straight forward logic.

One is directly job related. Customer complaints always have to be looked into as the issue happened on the job (or didn't as in this case).

To make this apples to apples... have someone accuse you of something, go through the legal system, have nothing happen to you. Then go to work and find out that your boss has decided to launch his own investigation and is talking to your accuser. The only thing your boss needs to know is that you were convicted of nothing and what is your side of the story. Is it something that is going to affect your performance? Anything beyond that becomes a witch hunt.

(hell of a catch by Fitzgerald even though he was out of bounds)

You didn't read what I wrote. As I said, as long as there's a "morals" or "image of the league" or whatever conduct policy in my contract with my employer, then yes, I'd expect that, and I'd expect my employer's result to perhaps differ substantially from the legal system's result, particularly the larger and more PR-sensitive they are.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

But what changed is that this (and by "this" I mean the release & the suspension) has nothing to do with domestic violence, it has to do with image. This is marketing, not rules or policy or social responsibility or anything else.

It's imaging.

I can still call BS on the league. If they had all the information they should know what would happen if the tape came out and dealt with it then. If he described it just at the tape shows, deal with it then.

If not, what next, steroid suspensions will be increased if a video of the player shooting up comes out? Vick gets retro banned if actual video of him killing dogs comes out? A couple SB rings get taken away from Charles Haley if a video of him whacking off in the locker room comes out?

Actions are no more worse if seen than if not seen.

We already know Rice is a dirt bag in all of this but he is no more of a dirt bag today than he was a week ago.

If everything came out exactly like he said, I would think that he has legal grounds to overturn this.


I'll say it again, this is based on my understanding that he came clean with everything already. If that is the case, he is getting screwed by this (hard to feel bad for someone but he had already taken the PR hit for this and a bit of a financial hit).


If he lied and didn't previously come clean, than what I said is moot and I say F' him.

[Julio Riddols]

if TMZ does come out with proof of this, I hope it ends Goodell. Fuck, bring back Tagliabue.

[Julio Riddols]

Also, saw the video tonight at work during half time of the game. Wow. Not only did he hit her, he hit her twice and it definitely appears he also spit in her face. And after he knocks her ass out, he just stands there. I feel like he is getting off easy only getting kicked out of the league and losing his job.

[mrtourette]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

He can't interview her alone. It is not a police investigation, it is an employer. How would you like it if your employer had a discussion with someone accusing you of something without you in the room and based their decision on that?

It's a perfectly reasonable course of action in that situation as an employer. If you're investigating a complaint by one party against another then you interview them seperately, with witnesses if they wish, and record the discussions and base your decision on that. As part of a formal process it would be madness to put the two in the room together and expect an honest account of events.

However this situation is different because the league holds no sway over Rice's wife, she's under no obligation to talk the league. I'd imagine that one of the stipulations of her doing so was that Rice was present. Why would she want that, or why would she want to help protect him? I'm sure we can all come to our own conclusions about that.

[Blackadar]

I said the two game suspension for Ray Rice was complete bullshit. Some tried to defend it then. Well, please defend it now, I'm all ears. I said Goodell had gotten it wrong (again!).

You know what? Goodell STILL has it wrong. This permanent suspension is wrong too. It's an overreaction and mob justice which is not supposed to be the actions of the commish.

By the way, the DA who didn't prosecute this - that has no bearing on the NFL's action so don't confuse the two - should be fired. Ray Rice should have gone to jail. No doubt.

1. I think that the NFL's excuse that they didn't see the video is bull. There's no way that the NFL, with all of its power and money and links into law enforcement, couldn't get their hands on it. They did, or they could have. TMZ did, but the NFL couldn't? Yeah, right. Personally, I think they probably did see it.

2. Even taking the NFL's position that they didn't see the tape at face value (bullshit, cough cough), the video only confirms what everyone already knew. We knew Ray Rice knocked his fiancee cold and dragged her out of the elevator. This video shows no new facts whatsoever.

3. Goodell puts out a domestic violence policy and in his first action, he doesn't follow it. Hey Roger, what's the point of having a policy if you're not going to abide by it?

4. The Harbaugh/Ravens press conference last night was the most self-serving thing I've heard from an NFL team in a long while. He refused to answer any of the tough questions like "what did you guys think happened", instead trying to cover up all of the difficult questions with "anyone who has a heart saw what the video showed". Great job trying to shame the reporters who are asking why your organization seems to be morally bankrupt! The whole organization should be ashamed of itself.

5. I'm rolling my eyes at all of these TV heads talking about how it's "never ok to hit a woman". What a bunch of misogynists. That thinking comes directly from "women are the weaker sex, must be protected, can't control their own emotions" hur hur hur caveman way of thinking. It's never ok to instigate the physical confrontation but it is ok to defend yourself even (gasp!) against a woman. It's a matter of treating someone as an equal and not as some weaker creature. Not to mention that it covers up all of the domestic violence cases where the man is the one abused. I'm not getting too deep into this point and if you want to argue with me on this start a new thread (because this isn't a Men's Rights' Movement thing), but I'm laughing all of these guys trying to appear gallant on TV and revealing themselves to be a bunch of misogynists by doing so.

In short, the right punishment from the NFL here would be for them to adhere to the new domestic violence policy and suspend Rice for 8 games. The Ravens would still then cut him, making his suspension effectively a season or longer. Goodell gets it wrong again. Hopefully, he gets fired over this (though I doubt it) and they can bring in someone who is consistent and less self-serving.

[mrtourette]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

1. I think that the NFL's excuse that they didn't see the video is bull. There's no way that the NFL, with all of its power and money and links into law enforcement, couldn't get their hands on it. They did, or they could have. TMZ did, but the NFL couldn't? Yeah, right. Personally, I think they probably did see it.

It would be interesting to know the chain of events here. If TMZ (or someone else) had the video did they offer it to the NFL? If not why not, if so then why didn't the NFL accept the offer of watching it (allegedly)?

Originally Posted by Blackadar

4. The Harbaugh/Ravens press conference last night was the most self-serving thing I've heard from an NFL team in a long while. He refused to answer any of the tough questions like "what did you guys think happened", instead trying to cover up all of the difficult questions with "anyone who has a heart saw what the video showed". Great job trying to shame the reporters who are asking why your organization seems to be morally bankrupt! The whole organization should be ashamed of itself.

Absolutely, the same point above applies to the Ravens. Why weren't they searching out the video that they (again allegedly) hadn't seen?


If either the Ravens or the NFL hadn't seen the video then they are guilty of deliberately avoiding the situation and hoping the video wouldn't surface.

If they had then obviosuly they're guilty of being lying shitbags and being caught out.

[Ben E Lou]

Wouldn't the NFL simply not WANT to see the video? My guess is that at most they gave a cursory "can we see it?"

"No. You need a subpoena."

"Oh well. Guess we can't see it."

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Wouldn't the NFL simply not WANT to see the video? My guess is that at most they gave a cursory "can we see it?"

"No. You need a subpoena."

"Oh well. Guess we can't see it."

I'm in agreement with Ben. NFL brass is populated by a lot of lawyers. They would have known, quite clearly, that once they actually saw the video they'd lose their plausible deniability and find themselves in a very difficult situation. It would not be surprising to me to find that the NFL had the opportunity to see the video outside of "official channels", and declined to take that opportunity.

It also wouldn't surprise me to learn that some mid-level NFL staff watched it anyway, being idiots.

Of course, if the rumors turn out to be true and upper-level management did see it, and then said they didn't, that wouldn't surprise me either.

[Toddzilla]

That's a lie, though. The NFL DID see the video. So "why didn't they?" is moot.

[Ben E Lou]

Too lazy to go digging: is the new prescribed punishment "6 weeks" or "a minimum of 6 weeks."

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

That's a lie, though. The NFL DID see the video. So "why didn't they?" is moot.

Has this been established? (And yeah on what flere said: I wonder if the decision-makers never saw it but some lower-level guys went off the reservation and watched it, but if so, it's very likely that they wouldn't have reported it to higher-ups.)

[Ben E Lou]

Well, there ya go. TMZ has reported, and the NFL has appeared to confirm, that they didn't ask the casino to see the tape. It's sad to say that I'm not remotely surprised by that revelation. *shurg*

Ray Rice Video -- NFL Commish in the Dark ... By Choice? | TMZ.com

NFL Statement Says League Never Asked Casino For Ray Rice Video

[Ben E Lou]

Double Dola:

And Janay is standing by her man...

"I woke up this morning feeling like I had a horrible nightmare, feeling like I'm mourning the death of my closest friend. But to have to accept the fact that it's reality is a nightmare in itself. No one knows the pain that the media & unwanted options from the public has caused my family. To make us relive a moment in our lives that we regret every day is a horrible thing. To take something away from the man I love that he has worked his ass of for all his life just to gain ratings is horrific. THIS IS OUR LIFE! What don't you all get. If your intentions were to hurt us, embarrass us, make us feel alone, take all happiness away, you've succeeded on so many levels. Just know we will continue to grow & show the world what real love is! Ravensnation we love you!"

Janay Rice Releases Statement: "This Is Our Life"

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Double Dola:

And Janay is standing by her man...



Janay Rice Releases Statement: "This Is Our Life"

Feel sorry for her.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I said the two game suspension for Ray Rice was complete bullshit. Some tried to defend it then. Well, please defend it now, I'm all ears. I said Goodell had gotten it wrong (again!).

You know what? Goodell STILL has it wrong. This permanent suspension is wrong too. It's an overreaction and mob justice which is not supposed to be the actions of the commish.

By the way, the DA who didn't prosecute this - that has no bearing on the NFL's action so don't confuse the two - should be fired. Ray Rice should have gone to jail. No doubt.

1. I think that the NFL's excuse that they didn't see the video is bull. There's no way that the NFL, with all of its power and money and links into law enforcement, couldn't get their hands on it. They did, or they could have. TMZ did, but the NFL couldn't? Yeah, right. Personally, I think they probably did see it.

2. Even taking the NFL's position that they didn't see the tape at face value (bullshit, cough cough), the video only confirms what everyone already knew. We knew Ray Rice knocked his fiancee cold and dragged her out of the elevator. This video shows no new facts whatsoever.

3. Goodell puts out a domestic violence policy and in his first action, he doesn't follow it. Hey Roger, what's the point of having a policy if you're not going to abide by it?

4. The Harbaugh/Ravens press conference last night was the most self-serving thing I've heard from an NFL team in a long while. He refused to answer any of the tough questions like "what did you guys think happened", instead trying to cover up all of the difficult questions with "anyone who has a heart saw what the video showed". Great job trying to shame the reporters who are asking why your organization seems to be morally bankrupt! The whole organization should be ashamed of itself.

5. I'm rolling my eyes at all of these TV heads talking about how it's "never ok to hit a woman". What a bunch of misogynists. That thinking comes directly from "women are the weaker sex, must be protected, can't control their own emotions" hur hur hur caveman way of thinking. It's never ok to instigate the physical confrontation but it is ok to defend yourself even (gasp!) against a woman. It's a matter of treating someone as an equal and not as some weaker creature. Not to mention that it covers up all of the domestic violence cases where the man is the one abused. I'm not getting too deep into this point and if you want to argue with me on this start a new thread (because this isn't a Men's Rights' Movement thing), but I'm laughing all of these guys trying to appear gallant on TV and revealing themselves to be a bunch of misogynists by doing so.

In short, the right punishment from the NFL here would be for them to adhere to the new domestic violence policy and suspend Rice for 8 games. The Ravens would still then cut him, making his suspension effectively a season or longer. Goodell gets it wrong again. Hopefully, he gets fired over this (though I doubt it) and they can bring in someone who is consistent and less self-serving.

I feel like I'm in F'ing bizzaro world. I agree with most of what Olberman says and now you? What the hell is wrong with me?

FWIW, I've said it multiple times in this thread, the prosecutor is what really, really bothers me in this case. The Ravens front office does not care about morals, we get that. The NFL doesn't care about morals, we all get that. How can a public prosecutor trying to defend the laws of the land see that video (and there is NO question they saw the video) and not put this guy behind bars for at least 90 days?

Hell, I don't even think you need an investigation into that.l Look at the tape, look at what the grand jury said, then look at how he was prosecuted. Everyone associated with that decision, take a seat over there. Buh Bye.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Well, there ya go. TMZ has reported, and the NFL has appeared to confirm, that they didn't ask the casino to see the tape. It's sad to say that I'm not remotely surprised by that revelation. *shurg*

Ray Rice Video -- NFL Commish in the Dark ... By Choice? | TMZ.com

NFL Statement Says League Never Asked Casino For Ray Rice Video

Grossly incompetent. Commissioner Goodell should resign today.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Grossly incompetent. Commissioner Goodell should resign today.

Absolutely.

[Ben E Lou]

I agree that he should resign. I disagree that it's "gross incompetence." Sounds like he handled it how upper leadership in most organizations in America would handle it: do whatever pr demands, because the full story will probably never see the light of day.

[Toddzilla]

THAT IS gross incompetence

[Kodos]

Yep. Goodell, everyone in power in the Ravens organization, tons of people should be fired or resign.

[Ben E Lou]

Ehhhh...ultimately it's semantics, but "gross incompetence" and "gross selfishness" are two entirely different things. *shurg*

[stevew]

Trying to understand the cap here. Baltimore couldn't cut him pre-June 1 cause of an overwhelming amount of dead money. This happened in February. Most likely they knew he was done from a skills standpoint but they had already given him so much cash as it is, that rolling the dice for 3M was a worthwhile option? He basically had one of the worst YPC seasons for a starting back last year. He'll never play another down now, but the likelihood of playing in 2015 wasn't really a given anyways. Old RB that can't play special teams are pretty much worthless.

[Buccaneer]

Yet another video I will not watch, just like any of the ferguson or beheadings or even serious sports injuries. I know what's going on in the world but it still makes me sick to see violent acts perpetrated against others and perhaps the defense or excuse of it all.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Ehhhh...ultimately it's semantics, but "gross incompetence" and "gross selfishness" are two entirely different things. *shurg*

Arguably it's both.

Avoiding exposure to the video to retain plausible deniability and just hope that it all blows over is the selfishness (i.e. "protect myself at all costs").

Believing that in today's world such a video won't eventually make it to the public is... something. Naivete? Wishful thinking?

Combining the two while in charge of large and very public organization that has a whole industry built to put it under a microscope (for good and bad), is almost certainly incompetence.

[molson]

I'm starting to have mixed feelings on some of this. I'm not sure I want the NFL to be attempting criminal investigations on off-the-field stuff and making too many discretionary calls about that stuff. They'd just be opening themselves up to claims of bias and incompetence, and to misunderstandings about what they have the power to really do. But I understand the limits of tying things to the criminal justice system too. Still, I think that'd be a good first level from the top - if you're charged with a violent crime, you're indefinitely suspended until the resolution of the case. If you admit guilt or are found guilty, you're gone from the league.

There wouldn't be too many loopholes there, but this Ray Rice case would be one. Under a system like that, he'd be suspended by the NFL until and if he completed the diversion program and the charges were dismissed (which may not happen, Rice may very well end up killing this woman and there's a good chance the physical abuse happened before the elevator situation and continues today, it's just a matter of getting caught again).

I'd like to see the franchises step up and fill the gaps on those loopholes, and other situations where there's violent conduct but no criminal convictions that stick. I mean, the franchises are the ones who are inspiring this tolerance for criminals. Goodell and the NFL don't really gain anything by suspending Rice for only 2 games. Rice is not some icon or integral part of the league and its brand. Goodell is working for the owners. I would hope any loopholes like Rice would be covered by the teams. And if a team like the Ravens still wants to use Rice, then, I'd think the backlash would maybe create a net plus for societal intolerance of criminal behavior and awareness of domestic violence issues. Of course that backlash would suck for the NFL

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Combining the two while in charge of large and very public organization that has a whole industry built to put it under a microscope (for good and bad), is almost certainly incompetence.

See. this is where we disagree. I suspect that cover-up/plausible-deniability stuff like this happens fairly routinely in the NFL and in many (most?) organizations and that most of it never sees the light of day.

[stevew]

Ravens offering a Jersey exchange program

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by stevew

Ravens offering a Jersey exchange program

I'd exchange Jersey for North Carolina.

[stevew]

Also will be deleted from Madden.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by nol

Hell, if the first video hadn't come out (four days after the assault), would there have been any suspension at all? It would have been super easy to throw out the old "Welp, it says she assaulted him too, so it wasn't domestic assault" justification and let the peanut gallery run with it ("Just another golddigging ho trying to ruin an NFL player's reputation SMH").

See James Harrison...no video, no suspension. I think you make a good point.

Here's how the NFL really feels about domestic violence

[mrtourette]

Originally Posted by molson

I'm starting to have mixed feelings on some of this. I'm not sure I want the NFL to be attempting criminal investigations on off-the-field stuff and making too many discretionary calls about that stuff. They'd just be opening themselves up to claims of bias and incompetence, and to misunderstandings about what they have the power to really do. But I understand the limits of tying things to the criminal justice system too. Still, I think that'd be a good first level from the top - if you're charged with a violent crime, you're indefinitely suspended until the resolution of the case. If you admit guilt or are found guilty, you're gone from the league.

There wouldn't be too many loopholes there, but this Ray Rice case would be one. Under a system like that, he'd be suspended by the NFL until and if he completed the diversion program and the charges were dismissed (which may not happen, Rice may very well end up killing this woman and there's a good chance the physical abuse happened before the elevator situation and continues today, it's just a matter of getting caught again).

I'd like to see the franchises step up and fill the gaps on those loopholes, and other situations where there's violent conduct but no criminal convictions that stick. I mean, the franchises are the ones who are inspiring this tolerance for criminals. Goodell and the NFL don't really gain anything by suspending Rice for only 2 games. Rice is not some icon or integral part of the league and its brand. Goodell is working for the owners. I would hope any loopholes like Rice would be covered by the teams. And if a team like the Ravens still wants to use Rice, then, I'd think the backlash would maybe create a net plus for societal intolerance of criminal behavior and awareness of domestic violence issues. Of course that backlash would suck for the NFL

I think the over-reliance on reactive NFL punishments is uncomfortable. It's always struck me as alarming the amount of law-breaking shitbags that play professional football compared to other sports, is enough done to proactivly ensure that these morons are educated and monitored? I know there is the symposium and conferences and ex-pros travelling to facilities to speak on various matters, but how seriously do the actual teams take this and how much responsibility do they take for ensuring that their players are behaving correctly? Something needs to be done about this culture of 'it doesn't matter what you do off the field as long as you produce on the field' from the perspective of the teams. It seems acceptable to get what you can out of a player and then wash your hands of him when te trouble starts, and then get praised for cutting him! How about preventing him from getting into trouble in the first place.

[larrymcg421]

Even if we ignore the moral argument, I don't get the NFL's actions. This is not Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Aaron Rodgers. How much would the league's bottom line really be hurt if they had taken a more aggressive stance against Rice from the beginning? I mean, I get why the Ravens would want this swept under the rug, but not the NFL.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Even if we ignore the moral argument, I don't get the NFL's actions. This is not Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Aaron Rodgers. How much would the league's bottom line really be hurt if they had taken a more aggressive stance against Rice from the beginning? I mean, I get why the Ravens would want this swept under the rug, but not the NFL.

If Tom laid an aggressive finger on Gisele she'd leave him I don't doubt. And since she's the major breadwinner of the couple still (I think I'm right about that, right?) he'd be dumb to fuck that up.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

See. this is where we disagree. I suspect that cover-up/plausible-deniability stuff like this happens fairly routinely in the NFL and in many (most?) organizations and that most of it never sees the light of day.

I agree with you that it happens quite often. Probably the most in government, to be honest (all those hearings being the primary reason). But I've seen plenty in private industry as well.

The difference here is, as I stated before, the NFL's visibility, and the fact that because it is part of the entertainment industry, it'll always have a lot of very public focus on its actions. It's naive to think such a video, once it's known to exist, won't end up in the public domain.

[jeff061]

I'm pretty sure Gisele could kick Brady's ass.

[mrtourette]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

If Tom laid an aggressive finger on Gisele she'd leave him I don't doubt. And since she's the major breadwinner of the couple still (I think I'm right about that, right?) he'd be dumb to fuck that up.

I doubt he needs the money. There are far better reasons why he wouldn't want to fuck it up.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by jeff061

I'm pretty sure Gisele could kick Brady's ass.

True that. She's ripped.

Originally Posted by mrtourette

I doubt he needs the money. There are far better reasons why he wouldn't want to fuck it up.

LOL - very true.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

It's naive to think such a video, once it's known to exist, won't end up in the public domain.

Let me spin that back at you a different way.

Since this is apparently such an impactful video, do you believe the relatively scarcity of other examples -- violence, with video -- means that the action being captured on film is exceptionally rare?

Or that we simply don't see them? (which would mean maybe it wasn't so naive after all)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just in case anybody has missed it

ATLANTIC CITY, N.J. (AP) — Ray Rice and Janay Palmer can be heard shouting obscenities at each other, and she appears to spit in the face of the three-time Pro Bowl running back right before he throws a brutal punch in a video shown to The Associated Press by a law enforcement official.

The video, shown to the AP Monday night, includes audio and is longer than the grainy TMZ Sports video released earlier that day.