The Trump Presidency – 2016

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Traditionally, this is how the Republicans have run things. Their side groups run the utterly horrific ads so the candidates can 'keep their hands clean' to an extent. Now, this doesn't apply with Trump of course.

There have been plenty of groups running ads for Democrats as well. Moveon.org comes to mind and well as the Dem candidate's superpac. Living in an Ohio TV market I get subject to plenty of them every 4 years.

They just weren't very effective ads.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Glad Dems are finally embracing this playbook

Well, they have no choice - it's not them, it's a bunch of anti-Trump Republicans. They are just content to sit back and let them do the dirty work.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Well, they have no choice - it's not them, it's a bunch of anti-Trump Republicans. They are just content to sit back and let them do the dirty work.

Yes, but in the past they would have still found a way to botch the opportunity to run a positive, unifying campaign and let the outside players shovel the dirt

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Yes, but in the past they would have still found a way to botch the opportunity to run a positive, unifying campaign and let the outside players shovel the dirt

If the somehow actually coordinated, they'd also be dumb enough to get caught doing it.

SI

[albionmoonlight]

Trump Blames Losing Campaign on Listening to ‘Woke Jared’

This article kind of makes fun of Trump's doubling down strategy.

But it kind of sort of makes sense, right? What does Trump have to gain by moderating on racial issues at this point? Isn't the only play he has left to keep his base ultra motivated?

Or, to use an analogy near and dear to FOFC, once you've doubled your bet 9 times in a row at the blackjack table and lost, isn't the only play left to double it one more time?

[JPhillips]

Looks like the GOP is going to keep several hundred thousand potential voters off the rolls in WI and FL.

[JPhillips]

dola

Trump, today:

"I think we're going to be very good with the coronavirus. I think at some point that's going to, sort of, just disappear, I hope."

[albionmoonlight]

If this were a business, Trump would have declared bankruptcy by now. We’re in uncharted territory right now. We’ve never seen him have to ride something all the way to the bottom.

[kingfc22]

Hopefully he can take the biggest L in the electoral college ever. Go in the history books as the best loss ever.

[Brian Swartz]

That's unlikely. All 50 states going for Biden is nearly unthinkable. It's be nice to have that sort of national unity but I don't see it happening.

[Ksyrup]

You know the old joke, when it's your time to go, it's your time to go - well what if it's the pilot's time to go? We're all flying on Trump Airlines and he's the captain without a single hour in the cockpit. He's gonna die on his terms and unfortunately take us all with him. At this point, it's just a matter of whether he rides it out another 4 years or nosedives in November.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Traditionally, this is how the Republicans have run things. Their side groups run the utterly horrific ads so the candidates can 'keep their hands clean' to an extent. Now, this doesn't apply with Trump of course.

You don't have to run a mean attack ad. Just say "hey, they are trying to get rid of your health care and strip the pre-existing conditions clause, just thought you should know".

Like how many people actually know this is happening right now in the courts? There is nothing wrong about being aggressive in letting people know what is happening to them.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

That's unlikely. All 50 states going for Biden is nearly unthinkable. It's be nice to have that sort of national unity but I don't see it happening.

Off the top of my head I'm not sure what the biggest defeat was but I know Nixon won like 49 states in 72.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Off the top of my head I'm not sure what the biggest defeat was but I know Nixon won like 49 states in 72.

It was Reagan over Mondale in '84. Only Minnesota and DC went to Mondale.

edit: that was most number of electoral votes. If you go by percentage of electoral votes, Washington got 100% each time, James Monroe won 231-1 and in '36 FDR won 523-8

[Kodos]

Without looking it up, I think Reagan-Mondale was the biggest electoral college defeat, with Mondale only carrying his home state (Minnesota?).

Edit: Alright, I was close.

[Ryche]

Potential biggest for an incumbent though

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Ryche

Potential biggest for an incumbent though

I still think that may be difficult. Carter won 6 states and DC in 1980. That's 49 Electoral votes.

Trump could piss on the American flag, and I think he wins still wins South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, Tennessee, West Virginia, Arkansas, and Oklahoma (and Wyoming, North Dakota, etc).

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I still think that may be difficult. Carter won 6 states and DC in 1980. That's 49 Electoral votes.

Trump could piss on the American flag, and I think he wins still wins South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, Tennessee, West Virginia, Arkansas, and Oklahoma (and Wyoming, North Dakota, etc).

He could probably piss on the confederate flag and still get Alabama.

[Vegas Vic]

This is interesting, and something that I hadn't really considered. I thought the top issue in the 2020 presidential campaign might be race relations, healthcare, the economy or taxes.

Apparently, the number one issue in this election may turn out to be which candidate is more senile.

Trump vs. Biden: Senility becomes 2020 flashpoint

[Brian Swartz]

I need to learn to read before I post.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I still think that may be difficult. Carter won 6 states and DC in 1980. That's 49 Electoral votes.

Trump could piss on the American flag, and I think he wins still wins South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, Tennessee, West Virginia, Arkansas, and Oklahoma (and Wyoming, North Dakota, etc).

You can add Kentucky to the guaranteed win column.

[Ksyrup]

Going back to something I posted a few days ago, I still think the GOP is going to get a bit of a bounce from possible defectors staying home over the "rewriting history" thing. And I'm not talking about the confederate statues, I'm talking Washington/Jefferson/Mt. Rushmore, etc. I just saw a new McConnell ad with an ominous vibe on this subject. I didn't watch the entire thing carefully, but I'm pretty he stuck with the non-controversial American hero-types. It's got the possibility to be a big issue.

[ISiddiqui]

C'mon this is Trump's America - we'll have 15 more scandals by this time next week

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[JPhillips]

Dilbert guy says that if Biden is elected Republicans will be hunted and killed within a year.

Big if true.

[Ksyrup]

I was never a Dilbert fan and never heard of that guy, but sheesh. I suppose if you're a fan, this is one of those "wish I didn't meet my idol" moments.

[bhlloy]

Scott Adams been going off the deep end for a while, I think I stopped reading sometime after Trump was elected because it didn't feel right supporting some of the more insane and hateful stuff he was spouting...

[Ksyrup]

Vanilla Ice throwing a July 4th concert in Texas to (potentially) thousands.

"The 90s were the best. We didn’t have coronavirus, or cell phones, or computers."

I'm not sure where to start with that statement.

[JPhillips]

Trump has a new shirt design.

OH COME ON pic.twitter.com/6divzAkVkK

— LuxuryAvenueHat (@Popehat) July 2, 2020

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

C'mon this is Trump's America - we'll have 15 more scandals by this time next week

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

And we might have one tomorrow. Trump tax return cases may finally be ruled on by the Supreme Court

[tarcone]

That cant be real

[tarcone]

And I saw an article about the shirt and then there is the $88 baseball that is black and has Trump in red letters on it. 88 is defined as the numeric equivalent to "Heil Hitler" by the White Supremacists.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by tarcone

That cant be real

I didn't think so either, but it's on the official Trump store.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

And we might have one tomorrow. Trump tax return cases may finally be ruled on by the Supreme Court

My uneducated prediction: 5-4 "narrowly scoped" case that only applies now but does not require him to turn over his tax returns at all. It's the Roberts special.

SI

[Swaggs]

That’s unreal.

I was talking to a friend about how, with other leaders or presidents that I disagreed with or disliked, I still probably approved of or could at least understand the justification for it like 75% of the time. With Trump, I can barely pick out anything he says or does that seems like a good idea (even in a concrete thinking sense).

It really does seem like he has been starring in a Sacha Baron Cohen-type performance since the 2016 GOP primary, waiting on people to call him on it and here we are 4+ years in with almost all of the elected Republicans just cool with whatever he does.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

That’s unreal.

I was talking to a friend about how, with other leaders or presidents that I disagreed with or disliked, I still probably approved of or could at least understand the justification for it like 75% of the time. With Trump, I can barely pick out anything he says or does that seems like a good idea (even in a concrete thinking sense).

It really does seem like he has been starring in a Sacha Baron Cohen-type performance since the 2016 GOP primary, waiting on people to call him on it and here we are 4+ years in with almost all of the elected Republicans just cool with whatever he does.

This is why I hate our system. These people are too worried about losing their sweetheart jobs do do anything of substance.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Trump has a new shirt design.

OH COME ON pic.twitter.com/6divzAkVkK

— LuxuryAvenueHat (@Popehat) July 2, 2020

So, is there someone on the inside that is intentionally trolling Trump here? Or is the only hope of re-election to go all-out, pedal to the metal extreme-right fascism and hope it ends in a Republic of Gilead? I mean, I would not be surprised at all if Trump saw this and didn't put two and two together, but anybody else with even a basic level of intelligence surely would.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by tarcone

This is why I hate our system. These people are too worried about losing their sweetheart jobs do do anything of substance.

And it's looking like they're going to lose anyway. Senators McSally, Tillis, Gardner, Collins, Daines, Ernst all in danger of losing, plus the two Georgia seats. All that cozying up to Trump did them no good.

[Brian Swartz]

They would have been assured of being primaried out though if they went against him, and they were doing what their constituents wanted. That's not a fault of the system, it's a fault of the electorate itself.

[Lathum]

If it’s what their constituents wanted why are they being voted out?

[Ksyrup]

Fox News in full spin/backtrack mode, wondering how over the past couple of weeks masks became a political thing.

It's good for them that their audience is so old that they probably don't remember what they heard on Fox News even a few days ago, so they can just re-format their viewers' hard drives with the latest talking points.

[Noop]

The fact that Trump's numbers have not completely tanked and the GOP hasn't forced him to resign tells me that we might be a failed state. America is an incredibly tribal and scary place right now.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Lathum

If it’s what their constituents wanted why are they being voted out?

Ever since I can remember, the play in American politics has been to move to the edge to win the primary, then move back toward the center to win the general.

But as the base of the GOP has continued to shift rightward, it is getting harder and harder to be as conservative as you need to win a GOP Primary while remaining palatable enough to the general electorate to win a general.

But for gerrymandering, the electoral college, and the unrepresentative nature of the Senate, you'd see this reflected in who is in power.

(Of course, if you didn't have gerrymandering, the electoral college, and an unrepresentative Senate, the GOP would have never pulled so far to the right because they would have known it was impossible to keep power that way. So there is a bit of a chicken/egg things going on).

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Lathum

If it’s what their constituents wanted why are they being voted out?

I think you know the answer to that. Public opinion is not a static thing; the situation when they were elected is not the same as the situation now. It's not as if these people were put in office by mostly Democrats. Trump's approval among Republicans, which is where most of their voters come from, has been around 85%.

They're not going to win the Democrat vote, and their supporters wanted them to stay with the president. So their only chance rises and falls with him.

Some chose another route and just quit Congress or left the party (i.e. Amash). But there's no path for Republican success by opposing Trump, that's been proved repeatedly. Before the pandemic, Trump's approval rating didn't go down for an extended period no matter what he did. That's what happens when the public - and repeated statements by regular posters on this forum shows that in general we're no different - rewards party loyalty & ideology above integrity and principled leadership.

[SirFozzie]

honestly, I'm sure that the Democrats will try to gerrymander as hard to the left as Republicans have done to the right. I really wish they wouldn't. I wish it was possible to get a truly non-partisan group together to set voting regions in a logical way.

Unfortunately these days nothing is non-partisan

[Ksyrup]

So it looks like someone is finally going on the attack against Lincoln Project - Club for Growth? Honestly, the first thought that comes to mind is Hair Club for Men. What a terrible name.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

honestly, I'm sure that the Democrats will try to gerrymander as hard to the left as Republicans have done to the right. I really wish they wouldn't. I wish it was possible to get a truly non-partisan group together to set voting regions in a logical way.

Unfortunately these days nothing is non-partisan

Personally, I'd be in favor of non-partisan redistricting in all 50 states, but given that won't happen, the only way to combat the GOP is to fight fire with fire. If they get locked out of enough seats for a decade perhaps they will moderate some. One side following norms while the other side violates them, like what we have now, is the worst possible scenario.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Personally, I'd be in favor of non-partisan redistricting in all 50 states, but given that won't happen, the only way to combat the GOP is to fight fire with fire. If they get locked out of enough seats for a decade perhaps they will moderate some. One side following norms while the other side violates them, like what we have now, is the worst possible scenario.

Here's my elegant-in-its-simplicity-but-probably-pretty-stupid solution:

You can draw districts however you want, but you are allowed a maximum of 4 lines in which to do it. So every district will be a quadrilateral or triangle or bump up against a state border.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Here's my elegant-in-its-simplicity-but-probably-pretty-stupid solution:

You can draw districts however you want, but you are allowed a maximum of 4 lines in which to do it. So every district will be a quadrilateral or triangle or bump up against a state border.

It would be a lot prettier to look at on a map, that's for sure.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

I think you know the answer to that. Public opinion is not a static thing; the situation when they were elected is not the same as the situation now. It's not as if these people were put in office by mostly Democrats. Trump's approval among Republicans, which is where most of their voters come from, has been around 85%.

They're not going to win the Democrat vote, and their supporters wanted them to stay with the president. So their only chance rises and falls with him.

Some chose another route and just quit Congress or left the party (i.e. Amash). But there's no path for Republican success by opposing Trump, that's been proved repeatedly. Before the pandemic, Trump's approval rating didn't go down for an extended period no matter what he did. That's what happens when the public - and repeated statements by regular posters on this forum shows that in general we're no different - rewards party loyalty & ideology above integrity and principled leadership.

Sure. I just hate that Trump has brought us to the extreme of only governing for those who support him as opposed to all Americans. Obama passed ACA for all, not just democrats. I don't recall a POTUS who openly attacked those who didn't vote for him. Politicians are supposed to represent all their constituents. Drives me crazy that they don't at least make a token effort to even hide the fact they don't.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

honestly, I'm sure that the Democrats will try to gerrymander as hard to the left as Republicans have done to the right. I really wish they wouldn't. I wish it was possible to get a truly non-partisan group together to set voting regions in a logical way.

Unfortunately these days nothing is non-partisan

FWIW:

Fair Districts Pledge | National Democratic Redistricting Committee

(obviously not all Democrats have signed onto this, but at least there’s an effort)