2014 NFL Playoffs Thread

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

how much the halftime show sucked.

SI

Sadly, the halftime show was the highlight for me. I can't ever remember a Super Bowl where one time looked so much faster in every phase of the game. Everyone on Seattle's defense can tackle. As much as they over analyze the stats in this game, there has to be a record for fewest YAC yards and I am sure Seattle broke it, they just stoned pretty much everything on first contact. It was impressive.

[Kodos]

The chicken wings were pretty much the only highlight for me.

[Logan]

I've been at my office for two hours and haven't heard a single word mentioned about the game yet. I don't exactly have sports-obsessed co-workers but we would usually talk about big events. This was clearly a dud.

And BTW, we really were just about 12 hours from this game being played in near blizzard conditions. I can barely see out of my window.

[Galaril]

Pretty much every team will try to do what Seattle did so the gravy days for the Broncos is over at least the offense rolling people plus they are lossing one starting guard, decker and Moreno along with Roers Cromartie n D. Good luck. I stll think Manning's body at least has a 2 maybe even three more years in it if he wants. But, Elway has to take a long look at what he has built which is a ridiculously soft team. Thye need to bring wth FA, trades and the drat some hardnosed players on both sides of the ball. I mean this is niot the first time teams have mugged the Broncos recievers but you got to fight thru that when you are 6'3 and 225 pounds.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

So, the Broncos suck today? Just checking.

[Sun Tzu]

"You don't know what it is. I mean, even when people say what it is, you don't know that's what it is. It's this thrown out or it's that. But that's usually the agents or the players themselves saying, for example, Adderall. The NFL doesn't release what it actually is. You have no idea. You're taking somebody at their word and I'm not sure you can take them at their word, understanding the circumstances. It has no place in an athlete's body. Play by the rules and you always want to be above reproach, especially when you're good because you don't want people to come back and say, 'They're winning because they're cheating.' That's always going to be a knee-jerk reaction from people I've found in my experience every since I was a little kid. So we want to be above reproach in everything and do everything by the rules. Because if you cheat to win, you've already lost."

[dawgfan]

I think we have a new clubhouse leader in "sorest loser" here at FOFC...

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

I find all the Peyton apologists funny. Game meant to cement his legacy and he lays a duck. Sure, the rest of the team didn't show up either but it starts with him. He got some yards but must have set a record for meaningless five yard gains in that game.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Sadly, the halftime show was the highlight for me. I can't ever remember a Super Bowl where one time looked so much faster in every phase of the game. Everyone on Seattle's defense can tackle. As much as they over analyze the stats in this game, there has to be a record for fewest YAC yards and I am sure Seattle broke it, they just stoned pretty much everything on first contact. It was impressive.

I have nothing against the halftime show. I actually enjoyed it, even if it's somewhat forgettable. It's just what people do on this day: complain about the halftime show and then laugh about the commercials that you thought were the stupidest ones shown.

SI

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

The Seattle offense, with a healthy Percy Harvin (does that even exist?) is a scary, scary thought. Wilson was no great shakes down the stretch of the season though, and by the time he was lighting up the Denver secondary the Denver defense had been on the field for what seemed like 90 minutes.

As a 49er fan, I'm worried as hell that he really is this good. As an objective football fan, I'm not quite as sold on him being all-world yet.

The biggest thing he did in this game was not make any mistakes. I remember one play late where there was a guy pretty open deep but Wilson chose not to risk the INT and took a short gain instead. Contrast that with some of the ducks that got thrown up under intense pressure by Manning.

[Sun Tzu]

One of my good friends (a Seahawks fan, by the way) has always referred to Russell Wilson as the shorter, blacker Alex Smith. I couldn't agree more.

[Sun Tzu]

So, now for those who are familiar with Pete Carroll's past, and who are also familiar with the intense amount of scrutiny that comes with being a Super Bowl champion...

The countdown begins. How long until something Spygate-esque is uncovered within the Seahawks organization? With the PED violations that have been coming in droves in Seattle, I've always felt that was just the tip of the iceberg. If the Seahawks were a baseball team, their SS, 1B, Catcher, LF, two Starting Pitchers, and Closer would all have at one point or another tested positive for steroids, and their star 3B would have a DUI that he'd been running from for years. Now, imagine that team wins a World Series. If you win on the ultimate stage with a "bad boy" image, it's only a matter of time until the shit hits the fan.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

I think we have a new clubhouse leader in "sorest loser" here at FOFC...

He's trying to cement his lead as well

[Logan]

Maybe you should just take a break. You're making all Niners fans look like pricks.

[Sun Tzu]

Meh. I think most people here know I'm right. Let's just fast forward 3 years from now. What's the likelihood that this thread is bumped after Pete makes national news with some scandal?

Pretty daggum high, ya'll.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

I find all the Peyton apologists funny. Game meant to cement his legacy and he lays a duck. Sure, the rest of the team didn't show up either but it starts with him. He got some yards but must have set a record for meaningless five yard gains in that game.

Unless it's 3rd or 4th and more than 5, I'll take a 5 yard completion on every play.

How much can you actually blame Peyton for this? I mean, on the INT where Avril hit his arm as he threw, is that his fault? He moved around in the pocket much better than I expected him to. His other INT was tipped as well, I believe.

He could have done better, but he DID set the Superbowl record for completions, and his offensive line was terrible all game. Combine that with some dropped passes and receivers multiple times losing yards after the catch...I don't know that this was a "duck" by Peyton so much as it was an incredible defense taking advantage of the Broncos' weaknesses.

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

Maybe I'm just coming from the "Brady is a mediocre playoff QB" conversation that was a couple weeks back. I think Manning is a fantastic QB, but what's good for the goose is good for the gander; the GOAT QB would have to do more than that. He's got the best weapons in the game, the weather worked out for him, and he did next to nothing until the game was already well out of reach.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Meh. I think most people here know I'm right. Let's just fast forward 3 years from now. What's the likelihood that this thread is bumped after Pete makes national news with some scandal?

Pretty daggum high, ya'll.

It must be pretty painfull to be so bitter all the time.

The Seahawks would have been 2 TDs better last night if they were all taking Ambien.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Re: Ronnie Dobbs:

Yeah, my heart's not really in it to say "OMG YOU'RE WRONG" because to a point I agree with you. I just don't know how much more he really could have done.

By the end of the game, he was looking like Jeff Garcia in the pocket there with the happy feet, bouncing all over the place.

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

Also those 5 yard gains seem great as an average until you realize you're down 30+ points and time is running out and the defense is giving them to you.

[Sun Tzu]

Originally Posted by Lathum

It must be pretty painfull to be so bitter all the time.

The Seahawks would have been 2 TDs better last night if they were all taking Ambien.

Why would you assume that I actually have any emotional investment in this? I'm just looking at things from a holistic point of view. I could care less who wins the Super Bowl if it isn't the 49ers. I didn't even watch the game last night. In fact, I don't even know what time the game started.

Seriously...I'm being completely sincere here. If you read what I post and think I'm sitting in my office steaming over it, I'd recommend looking inward. It sounds like your projecting your own feelings onto strangers on the interwebs.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Why would you assume that I actually have any emotional investment in this? I'm just looking at things from a holistic point of view. I could care less who wins the Super Bowl if it isn't the 49ers. I didn't even watch the game last night. In fact, I don't even know what time the game started.

Seriously...I'm being completely sincere here. If you read what I post and think I'm sitting in my office steaming over it, I'd recommend looking inward. It sounds like your projecting your own feelings onto strangers on the interwebs.

uh huh

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Lathum

uh huh

Don't feed the troll.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Don't feed the troll.

True, there is a reason he has been banned twice.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Why would you assume that I actually have any emotional investment in this? I'm just looking at things from a holistic point of view. I could care less who wins the Super Bowl if it isn't the 49ers. I didn't even watch the game last night. In fact, I don't even know what time the game started.

You're coming across as being obsessed with the Seahawks. A team has won, and their fans are happy about it, and you don't like that so you're trying to bring them down.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Why would you assume that I actually have any emotional investment in this? I'm just looking at things from a holistic point of view. I could care less who wins the Super Bowl if it isn't the 49ers. I didn't even watch the game last night. In fact, I don't even know what time the game started.

Seriously...I'm being completely sincere here. If you read what I post and think I'm sitting in my office steaming over it, I'd recommend looking inward. It sounds like your projecting your own feelings onto strangers on the interwebs.

You look seriously pathetic right now, though I assume you know that and you're just trying to troll seattle fans.

Also GTFO with the "I don't care who wins, I didn't even watch the game" bullshit. That shit is becoming a huge pet peeve of mine. You know what I do in threads that I'm not interested in, for events that I don't watch? I don't post in them, so that the people who are interested can enjoy themselves without having some asshole pissing in their cornflakes.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

Maybe I'm just coming from the "Brady is a mediocre playoff QB" conversation that was a couple weeks back. I think Manning is a fantastic QB, but what's good for the goose is good for the gander; the GOAT QB would have to do more than that. He's got the best weapons in the game, the weather worked out for him, and he did next to nothing until the game was already well out of reach.

Seriously, I have never heard Brady described as a mediocre playoff QB. Usually, he is described as Jesus working miracles in cleats.

[Kodos]

And, yes, Sun, you are being an embarrassment to SF fans.

[Warhammer]

My problem with Peyton is this is not an isolated incident. He lost all his big games at UT. He has lost a good many of them in the NFL.

He reminds me of John Elway minus the back to back SB wins at the end of his career. His team would not have near the success without him, but his teams more often than not lay an egg in the big game.

Is he a Hall of Fame guy? No doubt, but let's stop the GOAT talk.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Galaril

Pretty much every team will try to do what Seattle did so the gravy days for the Broncos is over

I dunno. What I saw was a Seattle D that simply outperformed and outhustled the Broncos' O. No magic bullet, just better play, more energy and better execution.

The other things you mention will probably be more of an influence, though.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

Also those 5 yard gains seem great as an average until you realize you're down 30+ points and time is running out and the defense is giving them to you.

They were chewing up the intermediate routes long before it was a blowout - they had two decent drives in the first half that were killed by turnovers (INT and going for it on 4th down). At some point you have to convert those though, and they clearly didn't.

[Lathum]

I think a lot of the blame goes to Fox, they just didnt seem ready to play. For a coach who has been to superbowls before he needed to prep them better.

[tucker rocky]

Early morning today, what could of been during the SB.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

They were chewing up the intermediate routes long before it was a blowout - they had two decent drives in the first half that were killed by turnovers (INT and going for it on 4th down). At some point you have to convert those though, and they clearly didn't.

Again, I think Peyton needed to lean more on his running game. The Seattle defense is pretty good against the run, but yards can be had.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

One of my good friends (a Seahawks fan, by the way) has always referred to Russell Wilson as the shorter, blacker Alex Smith. I couldn't agree more.

Perhaps if Alex Smith was a few years younger and was one of the better scrambling/running qbs in the NFL. Did you realize Wilson did this same thing at Wisconsin? He went to Wisconsin as a senior and turned that always very good offense into an elite offense. Give him some credit would you?

And great timing on the Percy Harvin being "years" removed from being a game changer comment. You really nailed that one.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I think a lot of the blame goes to Fox, they just didnt seem ready to play. For a coach who has been to superbowls before he needed to prep them better.

Only if we are only talking about the defensive side of the ball.

This is the thing that frustrates me about the narrative that surround Peyton Manning specifically. For this entire record breaking season, all the talk was how John Fox was not really the head coach, Peyton Manning was. Adam Gase had no real credibility as an potential head coach since Peyton Manning was the real OC for Denver. Now that the Broncos were exposed, John Fox did not get the team prepped. Fox and the other coaches get no credit when they win and most of the blame when they lose.

I understand that the quarterback gets too much of the credit when teams win and too much of the blame when they lose. But it seems to me that fans and the media are far more likely to divide the credit and the blame evenly between other QBs and their coaches then they are between Peyton Manning and his coaches. Brady and Belichick both received credit this year for the Pats success and were blamed for their failures. If Fox and Gase get no credit for the offensive success throughout the season, I can't really look at them for the failures.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Nostradamus

The Seahawks are something like 600% more likely to have defensive holding and DPI called on them outside of Seattle. This was, without question, the biggest benefit of having the NFC Championship Game played in Seattle and not San Francisco. Harvin hasn't been a game changer in years, and Wilson is basically Matt Schaub without a 100+ yard game from Lynch. The biggest factor in the Super Bowl will undoubtedly be whether the 'Hawks DB's are permitted to hold on every play.

Nailed It

[sabotai]

What really stuck out to me in that game was just how bad that Denver offensive line, specifically the tackles, were. At the party I was at, people were complaining about Manning dumping it short so much, but his tackles were being tossed in his face like rag dolls within 1.5 seconds of the snap. Manning never had any time. He played poorly, but that beat down by Seattle started with their total domination of the Denver offensive line.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by sabotai

What really stuck out to me in that game was just how bad that Denver offensive line, specifically the tackles, were. At the party I was at, people were complaining about Manning dumping it short so much, but his tackles were being tossed in his face like rag dolls within 1.5 seconds of the snap. Manning never had any time. He played poorly, but that beat down by Seattle started with their total domination of the Denver offensive line.

Agree with this.

I dont think it had been mentioned but I think Manning was having issues getting loose. The few times he did throw it downfield he seemed very inaccurate and the ball wasnt coming out of his hand with much velocity. I think the cold weather factor really was a factor.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Agree with this.

I dont think it had been mentioned but I think Manning was having issues getting loose. The few times he did throw it downfield he seemed very inaccurate and the ball wasnt coming out of his hand with much velocity. I think the cold weather factor really was a factor.

49 degrees at kickoff is cold?

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Logan

49 degrees at kickoff is cold?

Perspective. I live in Minnesota so obviously no. People in Florida I would speculate would say yes to that same question.

Probably some wind included if I know anything about New York and I guess I thought Peyton didnt look very loose from the way he was throwing the ball.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by sabotai

What really stuck out to me in that game was just how bad that Denver offensive line, specifically the tackles, were. At the party I was at, people were complaining about Manning dumping it short so much, but his tackles were being tossed in his face like rag dolls within 1.5 seconds of the snap. Manning never had any time. He played poorly, but that beat down by Seattle started with their total domination of the Denver offensive line.

Yeah agreed, and to add on, I think it just further illustrates the type of team that almost always wins a SB (when they make it). A team with a high intensity defensive line can make any QB look scared, confused, and ultimately bad.

This game really reminds me of the old 80s and early 90s SBs where the NFC-brand of football (intense defense, power running, mistake-free QB play) would regularly smash the AFC winner. Teams like the Redskins, Giants, Bears, Cowboys, and even the 49ers (despite the focus on offense, their defense is why Joe was in position to make game-winning drives). I think the AFC adopted this style of team in the late 90s (Broncos, Titans, Jags under Coughlin), and generally 2000s (Pats, Steelers, Ravens) but seem to have lost that type of team in the last couple of years (at least a team that does those things extremely well). Chiefs were trying to be that, but maybe a season or 2 away imo from being exceptional (namely the defense).

I think having a handful of teams like that, which you have to play during the season and beat to make it to the SB, gives such an advantage for Seattle over Denver. It really requires you step up your intensity level (on both sides of the ball) in order to not get your doors blown off (see SF @ SEA first game). Getting a taste of a team that brings that intense play (the hitting, the tempo, the borderline late hits) in recent weeks would have prepared Denver much better for how they needed to approach this game imho. They simply tried to play the 'hawks like the Pats, and it wasn't the right style nor good enough.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Perspective. I live in Minnesota so obviously no. People in Florida I would speculate would say yes to that same question.

49 degrees in Florida is not the same as 49 in Northern climates from my first hand experience living in both without relative humidity in the equation.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

Maybe I'm just coming from the "Brady is a mediocre playoff QB" conversation that was a couple weeks back. I think Manning is a fantastic QB, but what's good for the goose is good for the gander; the GOAT QB would have to do more than that. He's got the best weapons in the game, the weather worked out for him, and he did next to nothing until the game was already well out of reach.

Not sure any QB could have done anything with the piss poor protection that was being provided. I couldn't help but wonder if the Denver OL spent the night out on the town as the guests of the entire Denver defensive unit.

[Sun Tzu]

"Here's your sign."

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Warhammer

He lost all his big games at UT.

That's kinda stretching the truth a bit. 0-4 versus Florida unfortunately, but was 3-1 against Bama and 3-0 against Georgia, 3-1 in bowl games. The record against the Gators is a significant & realistic blemish but 10-5 vs ranked opponents isn't "all" either.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by SteveMax58

Yeah agreed, and to add on, I think it just further illustrates the type of team that almost always wins a SB (when they make it). A team with a high intensity defensive line can make any QB look scared, confused, and ultimately bad.

This game really reminds me of the old 80s and early 90s SBs where the NFC-brand of football (intense defense, power running, mistake-free QB play) would regularly smash the AFC winner. Teams like the Redskins, Giants, Bears, Cowboys, and even the 49ers (despite the focus on offense, their defense is why Joe was in position to make game-winning drives). I think the AFC adopted this style of team in the late 90s (Broncos, Titans, Jags under Coughlin), and generally 2000s (Pats, Steelers, Ravens) but seem to have lost that type of team in the last couple of years (at least a team that does those things extremely well). Chiefs were trying to be that, but maybe a season or 2 away imo from being exceptional (namely the defense).

I think having a handful of teams like that, which you have to play during the season and beat to make it to the SB, gives such an advantage for Seattle over Denver. It really requires you step up your intensity level (on both sides of the ball) in order to not get your doors blown off (see SF @ SEA first game). Getting a taste of a team that brings that intense play (the hitting, the tempo, the borderline late hits) in recent weeks would have prepared Denver much better for how they needed to approach this game imho. They simply tried to play the 'hawks like the Pats, and it wasn't the right style nor good enough.

The key to beating the Patriots has always been to hit them in the mouth which Baltimore and the NY Giants both do well. So did Carolina this year and Denver to some extent.

It looked like pretty much the same type of gameplan for Seattle against Denver except they also had a world class secondary backing up the pressure.

[Blackadar]

The old adage again holds true:

Great Defense > Great Offense

Seattle's defense held teams to 273 ypg - or about 30 yards less than the next closest team. That's a massive differential. Yards per play for Seattle was 4.4 - the next best team was 4.7. They also gave up the fewest points per game this year @ 14.4 and they did it against difficult competition. That's like the triple crown of defensive statistics. To see that kind of statistical dominance, you have to go back to the '08 Steelers (who won it all that year too).

I don't think Seattle would normally be 35 points better than Denver. But they are a great team, they played great *and* the ball was bouncing their way. That combination is fairly unbeatable. Kudos to them.

Finally, it's good to see a team that has never won it all get their first Super Bowl.

EDIT - though it is too bad for both Manning and John Fox. Both guys have shown nothing but class throughout their careers.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

I find all the Peyton apologists funny. Game meant to cement his legacy and he lays a duck. Sure, the rest of the team didn't show up either but it starts with him. He got some yards but must have set a record for meaningless five yard gains in that game.

Not apologists, more like realists.

The mob overreacts to one game scenarios and they say things like "choke." Some people realize that ALL athletes have off games and sometimes things dont go as planned. Last night Seattle was clearly the better team and in reality there was very little Peyton Manning could have done to change the outcome.

I have a hard time figuring out why certain people cant appreciate Peyton Manning and Tom Brady more. In 10 years we are going to miss both of them and talk about how great they were. Instead, we find reasons to discredit their greatness for whatever reason.

This isnt directed at you FYI. I have been reading this Peyton Manning crap all day as if he is the reason they lost last night. Laughable.

I guess it is easier for some people to blame Manning than it is for them to credit the Seahawks for wanting that game more.

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

He's not the reason they lost, but he's A reason they lost and he did nothing to turn the tide. Maybe it's being in Boston and hearing all week about how this is the game where Manning puts Brady in his rearview or the aforementioned Brady discussion in this thread, but I was surprised to come in this morning and see "Chin up, Peyton, it wasn't your fault" when I feel had Brady put up that performance it would have gotten a different reaction.