Console Discussion/E3/Tokyo Game Show Thread

[Groundhog]

Oh hey look Mizzou B-ball fan thinks PS4 is better than the Xbox one. What an interesting turn of events, glad I checked this thread.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

The two devices are practically the same. Trying to pretend that one is dramatically better than the other is comical. Just pick the one that has a controller you like better.

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

One has sold 2X the number of consoles that the other has sold. Pretending that won't affect the game options on one console vs. the other (in addition to the other differences) is ridiculous. It will have a direct impact on exclusives/timed exclusives.

Which isn't what RainMaker was talking about. He was talking about how technically similar the two systems are. Sony got to market first and Microsoft released too closely behind them. If those had been reversed, it may be Microsoft with a huge lead.

[jeff061]

Well that, a hundred dollars of useless hardware, weaker gpu, the combination of which seemed to lead to the perception of the One being a living room media box and the PS4 being a gaming machine. Seems that was Microsofts goal at the time, they misjudged their audience about as bad as they possibly could have.

Not to mention the prerelease fiasco around physical discs being locked to consoles and what not. MS did a lot of dumb to earn their current position.

[RainMaker]

The hardware is really not that big of a deal. Still pretty similar and both will be horribly outdated in a year or two anyway.

[Groundhog]

Yeah for the first time in a long time it's relatively affordable to have a PC that looks better than the current gen consoles. These days I'm down to pretty much just buying console games if they aren't being released on PC.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Yeah for the first time in a long time it's relatively affordable to have a PC that looks better than the current gen consoles. These days I'm down to pretty much just buying console games if they aren't being released on PC.

Probably cheaper long term when you factor in games can be had on sale for much less and you don't need to pay $50 a year to play online for some reason.

Have to hand it to Sony and Microsoft, they found a way to revive PC gaming.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Yeah for the first time in a long time it's relatively affordable to have a PC that looks better than the current gen consoles. These days I'm down to pretty much just buying console games if they aren't being released on PC.

I don't know is that really true? Last time Imchecked a decent gaming pc was close to $1200-$1800 with the most recent graphics cards required for most top games.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I don't know is that really true? Last time Imchecked a decent gaming pc was close to $1200-$1800 with the most recent graphics cards required for most top games.

Agreed. You really need to spend $1000-1200 every 3-4 years to have a good gaming experience on a PC. That's fine, but it's still WAY cheaper to play those games on a $300-400 console in your living room. And for the $50/year that Rainmaker mentioned, I'm getting 60-70 games free a year. That's more than worth it. That's Steam-like prices.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I don't know is that really true? Last time Imchecked a decent gaming pc was close to $1200-$1800 with the most recent graphics cards required for most top games.

Definately true. A Radeon 380 can be had for about $220 and it's going to play all but a small handful of games at the highest settings and those games not on the highest settings are still going to blow away the console version. Motherboard $80ish, psu $60, hdd $50 ram $70, cpu $160, case $50.

That's a system for under $700 that would be considered pretty high end. Use steam sales wisely and you end up with way more value than a console. That build still leaves some room to trim in places if needed as well.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Agreed. You really need to spend $1000-1200 every 3-4 years to have a good gaming experience on a PC. That's fine, but it's still WAY cheaper to play those games on a $300-400 console in your living room. And for the $50/year that Rainmaker mentioned, I'm getting 60-70 games free a year. That's more than worth it. That's Steam-like prices.

It absolutely does not cost that much for a good pc. You can also upgrade a pc piece by piece rather than buy a full system.

You pay $50 a year for free games huh?

[cartman]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Have to hand it to Sony and Microsoft, they found a way to revive PC gaming.

I'd say it would be due more to moving back to an Intel platform for the consoles, rather than trying to blaze new trails with custom built CPUs. Makes it whole lot easier to use the same code for both consoles and PCs.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Atocep

It absolutely does not cost that much for a good pc. You can also upgrade a pc piece by piece rather than buy a full system.

You pay $50 a year for free games huh?

We're mincing words here. Less than $1/game for 60-70 games is a great value.

[jeff061]

If I bought a $1200 PC in 2012 it would be a better gaming platform than a PS4 in 2018.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I agree at some level. It's an exec promoting his console regardless of how accurate his statements are. Your statement is spot on.

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

We're mincing words here. Less than $1/game for 60-70 games is a great value.

So it's you supporting your position regardless of how accurate your statements are.

You can't, can't, can't, can not be this tone deaf.
You are the greatest troll in the history of the universe.
Have to be.

When others spin facts it is a DAMN LIE.
But when I spin them we are just mincing words are arguing over minutia.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

You are the greatest troll in the history of the universe.

This.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

We're mincing words here. Less than $1/game for 60-70 games is a great value.

Those games sucks for the most part and you don't get to keep them forever.

You can build a decent gaming PC for $600-$800. Won't be able to play the new games on the highest settings but can still play on a setting that is considerably better than what the current consoles produce.

I have a console and I understand the appeal. But they're terrible for the consumer and create artificial competition from two companies making the same thing.

[dubb93]

The 750ti is the PS4 eqiuvilent card and it's $150. It's going to play any game that plays on the PS4 as long as the PS4 is around around the level the PS4 produces (think 1080p/720p 30 FPS on medium to low currently, low in a few years, and then min after that). It amazes me how many people simply do not understand PC gaming and pass off this nonsense about needing to buy a new rig at $1000+ every few years. If you want to game in 4k on Ultra, ok, yea sure. But the consoles aren't getting anywhere near that so I don't understand how the connection becomes that if you own a PC you must insist on gaming like that.

[RainMaker]

I think you can get a 750ti for like $120 these days actually.

[Mota]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

We're mincing words here. Less than $1/game for 60-70 games is a great value.

Yeah but you can't pick the games yourself (other than a vote for some crappy indy games this month).

Out of those 60-70 games (assuming you have equal interest in PS4, PS3 and Vita games), there's usually only 1 game a month that desirable. Most of it is indy crap. I have PS+ and I didn't download a single game the last 2 months. Most of this stuff you can get in humble bundles on your PC in packs of 10 for about $3.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by Mota

Yeah but you can't pick the games yourself (other than a vote for some crappy indy games this month).

Out of those 60-70 games (assuming you have equal interest in PS4, PS3 and Vita games), there's usually only 1 game a month that desirable. Most of it is indy crap. I have PS+ and I didn't download a single game the last 2 months. Most of this stuff you can get in humble bundles on your PC in packs of 10 for about $3.

It's just another one of his spins! 5000 free games! Too bad that 2 are only worth playing.. lol!

[dubb93]

The PS4 offerings from PS+ have been a huge disappointment so far for me. I've downloaded almost none of them. Microsoft really caught up to Sony here by stepping up the quality of their own Gold offerings and Sony dropping the quality of their PS+ from generation to generation.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Agreed. You really need to spend $1000-1200 every 3-4 years to have a good gaming experience on a PC. That's fine, but it's still WAY cheaper to play those games on a $300-400 console in your living room. And for the $50/year that Rainmaker mentioned, I'm getting 60-70 games free a year. That's more than worth it. That's Steam-like prices.

Nope, especially not the last couple of years. Maybe half that if you are upgrading. I probably build a new PC entirely every 5 years, and then I might spend that much. I do a ton more on it than just play games, though.

A new console game in Australia will generally cost $80-$100. A new game on Steam is typically $10 to $20 cheaper for A-list titles, or much less for others.

[dubb93]

hxxps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGf4SVWEw2g

This is The Witcher 3 being played on the PS4 and then right next to it is it running on the 750ti. The far right is with an OC on the 750ti. It's being ran on $100 processor as well. You could likely complete this build in the $400 dollar range if you were being thrifty.

You are looking at around $40 for the RAM, I see a motherboard on newegg with the chipset for $45, PSU will run you about $40, grab a HDD....literally any HDD....like maybe a $15 Western Digital one on newegg, and then pick your case. You can get a computer case for the $20 range if you are being thrifty. There you just built a computer that will run the most graphical intensive PC game on the market with ultra textures in 1080p at more or very similar FPS than the PS4 in most situations, for around $400. The only major difference is that you literally can not turn the number of background characters as low on the PC as they are set on the PS4 version of The Witcher 3. Low on the PC produces considerably more background characters than the PS4 version produces and you can't change the setting on the PS4. You will have to put windows on it...but there is a pretty damn good chance you already own windows if you are here on FOFC. Pop those disks in and you have an operating system.

Unless they update the version of directx on the PS4 and XBox to a version that this card won't run and it becomes completely standard across the platforms, this build should last you until the end of the PS4/Xbox One era.

[Galaril]

This is good info. I have not bought a PC since 2008 . I am not really talking about building a c myself but rather purchasing a prebuilt.t one . Also I was thinking a laptop so I guess that a desktop is a lot cheaper too. Most if the laptops I have seen can't stop from overheating when playing games which I think is why I stopped playing pc games and moved to the consoles.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Galaril

This is good info. I have not bought a PC since 2008 . I am not really talking about building a c myself but rather purchasing a prebuilt.t one . Also I was thinking a laptop so I guess that a desktop is a lot cheaper too. Most if the laptops I have seen can't stop from overheating when playing games which I think is why I stopped playing pc games and moved to the consoles.

Prebuilt is basically double the price. With how easy it is now to build (pretty much impossible to bend CPU pins, modular PSUs, ect) someone that's never built a PC could get one up and running in less than 3 hours.

Prebuilt machines are more or less the same cost they've been for years but competition has created a large number of options in every price range for self-builds.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Galaril

This is good info. I have not bought a PC since 2008 . I am not really talking about building a c myself but rather purchasing a prebuilt.t one . Also I was thinking a laptop so I guess that a desktop is a lot cheaper too. Most if the laptops I have seen can't stop from overheating when playing games which I think is why I stopped playing pc games and moved to the consoles.

My prices were an example of the system that is in the video. If I were building this myself I would spend extra on the motherboard and I would get a case with good cooling and lots of fans. I'd probably be closer to the $100 dollar range on the motherboard and the $50-80 range on the case. But again you have options. The cheaper motherboard will mean you can't OC and if you aren't going to OC then you won't need the more expensive case. Without the OC you are still looking at the performance that would be in the middle section of that video. Honestly I likely wouldn't build this system period. I like to spend a bit more and be able to run on high/max longer.

My last build was in 2011 and still to this day I am able to run The Witcher on high with ultra textures near 60 FPS and most other games on ultra. I max out the settings on Skyrim and Dragon Age: Inquistion and actually render a higher resolution than 1080p and then downconvert it to 1080p to get a sharper image. That's on a four year old build. The build above would cost you about half what my last build did, but at that same four year mark instead of running games at high/max you will be running them on low. You will definitely still be able to run them though.

Hell, I will be shocked if my 2011 build isn't still running games on low in even four/five more years. I haven't seen any of my components listed on min settings yet and even when they do start getting listed there I assume I will still get another couple of years of out them.

Personally I think now is a really great time to jump in. You can gauge the PS4/Xbox hardware as what the multiplatform games will be capable of and if you shoot your build higher than that it's likely you have future proofed yourself.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Galaril

This is good info. I have not bought a PC since 2008 . I am not really talking about building a c myself but rather purchasing a prebuilt.t one . Also I was thinking a laptop so I guess that a desktop is a lot cheaper too. Most if the laptops I have seen can't stop from overheating when playing games which I think is why I stopped playing pc games and moved to the consoles.

If you go the desktop route, I recommend building it yourself. It used to be kind of a pain back in the day but it's incredibly easy these days. There's a thousand or so YouTube videos to walk you through it and other guides online. It's also a nice skill to learn because it will allow you to easily make upgrades in the future.

As for the laptops, I think it depends on what you plan on doing with it. The people trying to play Witcher 3 on Ultra with Hairworks On are going to have a hot computer. Also going to need to spend a fortune. But if you're playing on moderate settings you shouldn't have a problem. Just go with a company like MSI that builds specifically for gaming. They handle heat much better than other manufacturers.

We should actually start a PC building thread maybe?

[Groundhog]

Building computers is easy - I'm the least handy person around, and I managed just fine. Just make sure you do your research - ie. make sure everything 'fits'

Having said that, the site where I buy my components last time had an assembly option which IIRC was only around an extra $120 AU, so it might be worth your while to go that route instead.

[Mota]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Prebuilt is basically double the price. With how easy it is now to build (pretty much impossible to bend CPU pins, modular PSUs, ect) someone that's never built a PC could get one up and running in less than 3 hours.

Prebuilt machines are more or less the same cost they've been for years but competition has created a large number of options in every price range for self-builds.

I still wouldn't recommend building a computer for about 80% of the population. If you don't know what you're doing, there's almost certainly a friend somewhere that will give you a hand. I've built many systems myself over the years and I inevitably do SOMETHING wrong, I can't imagine doing this with no idea about how the inners of the computers work.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Mota

I still wouldn't recommend building a computer for about 80% of the population. If you don't know what you're doing, there's almost certainly a friend somewhere that will give you a hand. I've built many systems myself over the years and I inevitably do SOMETHING wrong, I can't imagine doing this with no idea about how the inners of the computers work.

With the amount of easily to obtain information out there now (youtube, ect) I know several that have manged to build a system without a major problem. I wouldn't recommend just buying the parts and diving in, but take a little time to do some research and the vast majority of gamer types shouldn't have any problems.

[Groundhog]

First time I 'finished' building my own PC, I hit the power button and absolutely nothing happened. I panicked naturally, ran a quick google search, and discovered from someone else's msg board post that I'd forgot to connect the power supply up with the motherboard.....

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

First time I 'finished' building my own PC, I hit the power button and absolutely nothing happened. I panicked naturally, ran a quick google search, and discovered from someone else's msg board post that I'd forgot to connect the power supply up with the motherboard.....

Probably the most common newbie error. I remember doing that on my first build as well.

[Ironhead]

First time I built a PC about 16 years ago I did so on my living room carpet. Just threw the RAM on the carpet and everything.

To say the least - didn't go so well. Luckily I have learned some things since then.

[CU Tiger]

Question for those builders. I build a few, last one about...2005 or so.
Its certainly cheaper, except software. How is everyone getting around the cost of Windows?

Last time I looked into it I could build a cheap "office" computer for $~300ish vs $550 for a Dell etc. But the $200 cost of windows, plus office or whatever just skewed it towards buying a pre-built.

Am I just missing the cool Linux guy clique (briefly looked into that but not a "computer guy" so I gave up on it)

Or is there an alternate avenue I'm missing?

[Mota]

Can you get an OEM version of Windows? IF you buy it along with a hard drive, you should be able to do that. It's been a while since I bought one, but it was about $130.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Mota

Can you get an OEM version of Windows? IF you buy it along with a hard drive, you should be able to do that. It's been a while since I bought one, but it was about $130.

Amazon.com: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit System Builder OEM | PC Disc

Not sure if that's the cheapest price or not, just the first thing I saw.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Radii

Amazon.com: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit System Builder OEM | PC Disc

Not sure if that's the cheapest price or not, just the first thing I saw.

I think it's cheaper right now to buy windows 7 or 8 and then get the free upgrade to 10.

[dubb93]

Two options that I could see. If you have a current version of Windows on a PC that you don't plan to use and it isn't OEM....it isn't impossible to believe that it would work on the new computer. This would require a retail code, but I have used the same version of Windows on more than one PC. It will not work on more than 1 PC at the same time.

Another option that I'm not sure if it works anymore are student deals. You wouldn't need to be the student, you would just need to know one. There used to be great deals on student versions of Windows at the universities. My current version of windows is 7 Ultimate and it was a student copy. I paid around $20 for it. My girlfriend was taking a class at a community college at the time.

[Kodos]

Can we get the computer talk in a separate thread?

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Can we get the computer talk in a separate thread?

And leave this thread to MBBF to say that Sony is selling the PS4 for a profit at $400 and it will last you a decade and that in order to have that same experience on a PC it would take a $1200 investment every 3-4 years?

Honestly in 2015 it's hard to have a discussion about PS4 vs. XBox One without bringing up a $400 PC that can do the same thing.

I guess I don't understand why the computer talk should go. PC's are able to be at both E3 and the Tokyo Game Show and with the advent of the Steam Box I don't computer discussion is getting further away from consoles.

Hell one of the major new features of one of the consoles apparently involves interaction with a PC.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by mckerney

I think it's cheaper right now to buy windows 7 or 8 and then get the free upgrade to 10.

I didn't think about that. Oddly enough though, Windows 8.1 OEM on Amazon is only $8 cheaper and Windows 7 is only $5 cheaper, at least on Amazon. If I was building a new PC I'd probably spend the small bit more to be straight on Win 10 and not to have to mess with the upgrade process.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Radii

I didn't think about that. Oddly enough though, Windows 8.1 OEM on Amazon is only $8 cheaper and Windows 7 is only $5 cheaper, at least on Amazon. If I was building a new PC I'd probably spend the small bit more to be straight on Win 10 and not to have to mess with the upgrade process.

You can upgrade an old version of Windows, wipe the hard drive clean after, and install Windows 10 clean on it.

But that's probably a couple hours of your time so just buying Windows 10 outright might be easier.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Koei Tecmo has multiple unannounced PS4 exclusives in the works.

Koei Tecmo has PS4-only games in development - Gematsu

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Koei Tecmo has multiple unannounced PS4 exclusives in the works.

Koei Tecmo has PS4-only games in development - Gematsu

Yay?

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

Yay?

Only if it's a Romance of the Three Kingdoms remake.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Only if it's a Romance of the Three Kingdoms remake.

Ninja Gaiden, Fatal Frame, Kessen, and Gallop Racer are all games I'd love to have a new PS4 version to play along with a new Romance game.

[Julio Riddols]

GALLOP RACER.. I miss that game.

[Izulde]

I'd actually like to see Genghis Khan redone too.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

GALLOP RACER.. I miss that game.

They did one (sort of) for PS3, but it was a hybrid with G1 Jockey IIRC

[dubb93]

Talking about horse racing games, is there a good horse racing sim out there anywhere?