NFL Week 10 discussion - Page 7

bhlloy · 11-16-2009, 08:29 PM

Holy crap. I know it's a pretty subjective stat but still, that is absolutely incredible when you consider how advanced the game is offensively in the last 20 years (the last team to score as few TD's as the Browns have in their last 14 games were the 32/33 St. Louis Browns, who were so bad they folded after that season)

Oh, and why does Steven Hauschka still have a job in this league? If the Ravens lose this by less than 6 that's three games he's cost them this year already. Leg doesn't matter if you aren't accurate from 40 on in.

DataKing · 11-16-2009, 08:52 PM

stevew · 11-16-2009, 09:01 PM

I can't believe they are booth reviewing this touchback. When Cleveland is going to kneel it out.

BishopMVP · 11-16-2009, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

There's nothing wrong with the decision to go for it on 4th and 2. If they make it, they win. That's a high percentage chance with Tom Brady.

The problem is (as has been pointed out above) that they didn't leave themselves any time on the clock. Now I don't agree that you let them score from the 30. But they tackled Addai twice at or near the 1 yard line.

It's sort of the reverse of the situation I described earlier with Maurice-Jones Drew. Here you are weighing your chances of stopping the Colts three straight times when they only need one yard versus giving Tom Brady 1 minute or so to get into FG range. I think almost anyone would take the latter. Once Addai got inside the 5, the only defense they should have been playing was to try and strip the ball.

Part of the reason they may not have was the 2003? game where Willie McGinest stuffed Addai on the goal line to win 38-34. If they were up 2 points or less they certainly should (and would imo) have let him score, but up 6 I can see the argument that a goal-line stand is possible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubby

hahaha what a shithead, trying to be a "genius" cost him the game

Hmmmm.... playing the percentages rather than acceding to conservative NFL groupthink is a bad thing? Ironic coming from a message board centered around FOF. (And like others said last page, there were a number of bad decisions on that drive - going for it on 4th and 2 probably wasn't one of them.)

bhlloy · 11-16-2009, 09:43 PM

Wow, the Browns offense has actually made me stop hating Brady Quinn with every fiber of my being and made me just feel sorry for him. Can the Browns blow the team up and ask to be entered into the Expansion Draft again? Other than Joe Thomas is there anybody on the entire team you would actually want to be starting on your favorite franchise?

larrymcg421 · 11-16-2009, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Part of the reason they may not have was the 2003? game where Willie McGinest stuffed Addai on the goal line to win 38-34. If they were up 2 points or less they certainly should (and would imo) have let him score, but up 6 I can see the argument that a goal-line stand is possible.

I don't remember the circumstances of that game, but this required several stops. They ended up with 1st and goal from the 1. Also is the fact that if Belichik doesn't have the confidence that his team could prevent Manning from going 80 yards, why would he have the confidence they could prevent them from going 1 yard in 4 plays?

Lathum · 11-16-2009, 09:45 PM

Anyone else get the feeling Gruden wants the Browns to throw the ball down the field?

jbergey22 · 11-16-2009, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

I don't remember the circumstances of that game, but this required several stops. They ended up with 1st and goal from the 1. Also is the fact that if Belichik doesn't have the confidence that his team could prevent Manning from going 80 yards, why would he have the confidence they could prevent them from going 1 yard in 4 plays?

Just to add after the Pats didnt make the 4th down ALL the momentum was on the Colts side. If they had punted they still had lost the momentum however a couple of big plays and they could have gotten some back. The game was lost as soon as the Pats came up a half yard short IMO.

NFL games follow momentum just like any other professional sport and once its lost its hard to recover.

Who knows Bellichek knows his team and maybe he thought the only way to win that game at that point was with his offense and he may have been right.

stevew · 11-16-2009, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Wow, the Browns offense has actually made me stop hating Brady Quinn with every fiber of my being and made me just feel sorry for him. Can the Browns blow the team up and ask to be entered into the Expansion Draft again? Other than Joe Thomas is there anybody on the entire team you would actually want to be starting on your favorite franchise?

Cribbs, Rogers, Mack, Steinbach. But that's about it.

bhlloy · 11-16-2009, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

I don't remember the circumstances of that game, but this required several stops. They ended up with 1st and goal from the 1. Also is the fact that if Belichik doesn't have the confidence that his team could prevent Manning from going 80 yards, why would he have the confidence they could prevent them from going 1 yard in 4 plays?

Exactly. If you are playing the percentages that the 4th and 2 gives you a better shot than giving Manning the ball back that's fine (and I'm coming around to the board's thinking on that even though I think the odds are closer to a wash than people are stating), you can't then turn around and ignore the huge likelihood of a team scoring on 1st and goal from inside the 2 yard line.

BishopMVP · 11-16-2009, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

I don't remember the circumstances of that game, but this required several stops. They ended up with 1st and goal from the 1. Also is the fact that if Belichik doesn't have the confidence that his team could prevent Manning from going 80 yards, why would he have the confidence they could prevent them from going 1 yard in 4 plays?

Almost the same circumstance. Colts drive starting at the NE 47 down 38-34 with 2:57 to go.

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/01/sports/pro-football-the-patriots-and-mcginest-draw-a-line-in-the-turf.html

And that last stand began on a first-and-goal from the New England 2. James ran at right tackle for 1 yard. James ran up the middle for no gain. Timeout Colts. Manning threw an incomplete pass.
James meets McGinest.
Game over.
''The Colts live and die with the big play,'' Patriots cornerback Ty Law said. ''They can lose 2 yards and then hit you with 20. But as the field shortens up, when you get down in the red zone and there is only so much field left to play with, we get tougher and we get tighter. In a situation like that, 1 yard can seem like 100.''

It could go both ways - even I was saying they should have let Addai score on the 1st one when there was 1:15-1:30 left on the clock. But almost the exact same thing happened in the past, with the Pats D winning. Either way, with the Jets losing this was only huge for home-field purposes - and I think we showed we could play with them in Indy (particularly if their entire secondary is still injured.)

Kodos · 11-16-2009, 10:21 PM

Holy awkwardness, Batman.

stevew · 11-16-2009, 10:47 PM

Cribbs leaves the field on a stretcher. Hopefully he will be okay

Quinn is such a pile of shit too. Although he probably could have converted that 4th and 2 vs the colts. He throws a mean 2 yard pass.

Arles · 11-16-2009, 11:12 PM

I heard tonight's game will be replayed tomorrow on ESPN classic for those who missed it.

Groundhog · 11-16-2009, 11:16 PM

Hopefully the Lions and Browns can meet on a Monday night next season!

Samdari · 11-17-2009, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Wow, the Browns offense has actually made me stop hating Brady Quinn with every fiber of my being and made me just feel sorry for him. Can the Browns blow the team up and ask to be entered into the Expansion Draft again? Other than Joe Thomas is there anybody on the entire team you would actually want to be starting on your favorite franchise?

Shaun Rogers is an elite caliber NT, a tough position to find. The other guys Stevew mentioned I'd want on my team too.

Maiva has looked good since taking over for backup caliber Eric Barton, and D'Quell Jackson is an NFL starter (albeit out for the year). David Veikune was the Browns best player during preseason, but they won't put him on the field when every other LB is injured?

Moreso even than lack of talent, the lack of effort and fight in the Browns was apparent to me. Anyone with the ball in their hand dove to the ground at first contact last night (especially Quinn). Noone fought to get off blocks, hold blocks, break tackles, get open - anything. They have absolutely quit.

RedKingGold · 11-17-2009, 07:57 AM

I thought the Browns defense was pretty good. Heck, even last night they held a pretty decent offense to low production.

That offense is just, well, offensive.

I normally don't listen to Mike & Mike, but did so this morning on an odd chance. They had a relatively humorous stat that the last NFL team who had 5 offensive touchdown in 15 games or so was the Cincinnati Reds in 1933 and they were disbanded after that season.

jbergey22 · 11-17-2009, 07:58 AM

Brady Quinn is a bust. I hate to admit it because I thought he was going to be good and actually wanted the Vikings to take him instead of AP with the 7th pick in the 07 draft sadly enough. He plays with no confidence.

And I agree with RkG that the defense is actually pretty decent. Ive seen them hold teams in check for first halves and likely get tired from being on the field the majority of the game in the 2nd half.

RendeR · 11-17-2009, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

Cribbs leaves the field on a stretcher. Hopefully he will be okay

Quinn is such a pile of shit too. Although he probably could have converted that 4th and 2 vs the colts. He throws a mean 2 yard pass.

Nevermind, I just found a writeup. I heard it wrong I guess.

stevew · 11-17-2009, 10:00 AM

Eric Wright is decent too.

cougarfreak · 11-17-2009, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Brady Quinn is a bust. I hate to admit it because I thought he was going to be good and actually wanted the Vikings to take him instead of AP with the 7th pick in the 07 draft sadly enough. He plays with no confidence.

And I agree with RkG that the defense is actually pretty decent. Ive seen them hold teams in check for first halves and likely get tired from being on the field the majority of the game in the 2nd half.

Would you play with confidence in the situation he's in?

Apathetic Lurker · 11-17-2009, 04:57 PM

And Jauron is thrown out with the bathwater

MacroGuru · 11-17-2009, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apathetic Lurker

And Jauron is thrown out with the bathwater

There will be a major overhaul here next year. I am excited for it as it has to happen...we need a coach with fire.

jbergey22 · 11-17-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

Would you play with confidence in the situation he's in?

Probably not

RainMaker · 11-17-2009, 06:02 PM

As a Bears fan, Jauron is a horrible coach. I am shocked he has been able to keep that job for so long.

rowech · 11-17-2009, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

As a Bears fan, Jauron is a horrible coach. I am shocked he has been able to keep that job for so long.

I'm continuously amazed at how many crappy coaches get 2nd, 3rd, and in some cases 4th chances to destroy a team.

jbergey22 · 11-17-2009, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rowech

I'm continuously amazed at how many crappy coaches get 2nd, 3rd, and in some cases 4th chances to destroy a team.

It does seem like bad teams just keep passing around crappy coaches. Slow learners I guess.

11-16-2009, 08:52 PM	#302
DataKing Pro Rookie Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Chicago	__________________ Current Games Diablo III (BattleTag: DataKing#1685) Allegiances: Chicago Bears - Detroit Red Wings - Kansas Jayhawks Awards: 2011 Golden Scribe - Other Sports Category (The Straight(away) and Narrow - A Forza Motorsport 3 Dynasty)

11-16-2009, 10:21 PM	#312
Kodos Resident Alien Join Date: Jun 2001	Holy awkwardness, Batman. __________________ Author of The Bill Gates Challenge, as well as other groundbreaking dynasties.

11-16-2009, 11:12 PM	#314
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	I heard tonight's game will be replayed tomorrow on ESPN classic for those who missed it. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

11-16-2009, 11:16 PM	#315
Groundhog Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia	Hopefully the Lions and Browns can meet on a Monday night next season! __________________ Politics, n. Strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. --Ambrose Bierce

11-17-2009, 07:57 AM	#317
RedKingGold College Starter Join Date: Oct 2002	I thought the Browns defense was pretty good. Heck, even last night they held a pretty decent offense to low production. That offense is just, well, offensive. I normally don't listen to Mike & Mike, but did so this morning on an odd chance. They had a relatively humorous stat that the last NFL team who had 5 offensive touchdown in 15 games or so was the Cincinnati Reds in 1933 and they were disbanded after that season. Last edited by RedKingGold : 11-17-2009 at 07:58 AM.

11-16-2009, 08:29 PM	#301
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	Holy crap. I know it's a pretty subjective stat but still, that is absolutely incredible when you consider how advanced the game is offensively in the last 20 years (the last team to score as few TD's as the Browns have in their last 14 games were the 32/33 St. Louis Browns, who were so bad they folded after that season) Oh, and why does Steven Hauschka still have a job in this league? If the Ravens lose this by less than 6 that's three games he's cost them this year already. Leg doesn't matter if you aren't accurate from 40 on in.

11-16-2009, 09:01 PM	#303
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	I can't believe they are booth reviewing this touchback. When Cleveland is going to kneel it out.

11-16-2009, 09:43 PM	#305
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	Wow, the Browns offense has actually made me stop hating Brady Quinn with every fiber of my being and made me just feel sorry for him. Can the Browns blow the team up and ask to be entered into the Expansion Draft again? Other than Joe Thomas is there anybody on the entire team you would actually want to be starting on your favorite franchise?

11-16-2009, 09:45 PM	#307
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	Anyone else get the feeling Gruden wants the Browns to throw the ball down the field?

11-16-2009, 10:47 PM	#313
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	Cribbs leaves the field on a stretcher. Hopefully he will be okay Quinn is such a pile of shit too. Although he probably could have converted that 4th and 2 vs the colts. He throws a mean 2 yard pass.

11-17-2009, 07:58 AM	#318
jbergey22 Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Minnesota	Brady Quinn is a bust. I hate to admit it because I thought he was going to be good and actually wanted the Vikings to take him instead of AP with the 7th pick in the 07 draft sadly enough. He plays with no confidence. And I agree with RkG that the defense is actually pretty decent. Ive seen them hold teams in check for first halves and likely get tired from being on the field the majority of the game in the 2nd half. Last edited by jbergey22 : 11-17-2009 at 08:00 AM.

11-17-2009, 10:00 AM	#320
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	Eric Wright is decent too.

11-17-2009, 04:57 PM	#322
Apathetic Lurker College Prospect Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Buffalo,NY	And Jauron is thrown out with the bathwater

11-17-2009, 06:02 PM	#325
RainMaker General Manager Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	As a Bears fan, Jauron is a horrible coach. I am shocked he has been able to keep that job for so long.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)