2020 Democratic Primaries/General Election Thread

[Lathum]

Trumps head legal strategist was just on FOX News embarrassing herself and the entire Trump team.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Bernie couldn't get his voters out for the primary yet he was going to get 70+ million in the general?

Trump would have gotten his landslide against Bernie and I was a Warren supporter as well. The socialism stuff was sticking on a career moderate, it would have destroyed Bernie's campaign.

And, for the record, I don't think that "running the moderate" every time is a good idea for the Dems. I just think in this election it was because of Trump. This was always going to be about Trump and Trump's ability to get whoever he's against down in the mud with him and very few of those things were able to stick on Biden. Of course the "always R" will view any Dem as a socialist and it appears to have worked with Hispanics, especially Cubans. But we saw county after county where Biden was able to shave 2-5% off of Trump's numbers in places that mattered the most in the EC (Rust Belt, Sun Belt, Deep South).

I don't think it's the right answer for the Dems going forward. But I do think it was the right answer for 2020. And I think a lot of us thought that if we lost this battle, we were going to lose the war for a long time. That's still a possibility: 4 years of Mitch blocking Biden and then President Tom Cotton or whatever may still walk us down a really nasty path. But I think we all know that Trump unrestrained in his second term would do even more irreparable damage that would have taken generations to walk back.

SI

[JPhillips]

This is Antietam, not Appomattox. A loss would have been catastrophic, but the fight is going to continue for a long time ahead.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

This is Antietam, not Appomattox. A loss would have been catastrophic, but the fight is going to continue for a long time ahead.

I like this analogy a lot

SI

[timmynausea]

CNN now calling Nevada for Biden as well.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Trumps head legal strategist was just on FOX News embarrassing herself and the entire Trump team.

What was said?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Danny

What was said?

More nonsense about the evidence being out there but the courts will reveal it, etc...

[Maple Leafs]

Got to say, going back today and reading the election night portion of this thread for the first time sure is interesting.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Danny

What was said?

Anything other than "Wow, this was an amazingly cleanly run election. Congratulations to President-Elect Biden." would be embarrassing at this point.

[JPhillips]

This is interesting. Pressure from business groups could make a big difference in a relief/virus bill.

⁦@USChamber⁩ Congratulates President-Elect Biden: “We stand ready to help break through the gridlock and help get things done through collaboration and good governance. Job number one must be pandemic relief....” https://t.co/UETYI03t66

— John G. Murphy (@JGodiasMurphy) November 7, 2020

[Ksyrup]

The machine rolls on regardless of the size of the diapers worn by the current WH occupant that need to be changed.

[ISiddiqui]

I'm not happy about all the people out there celebrating in close proximity. I get the impulse, but we still have a pandemic people!! Just having masks outside isn't going to be enough if you are 1 foot away from others for a long time.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I'm not happy about all the people out there celebrating in close proximity. I get the impulse, but we still have a pandemic people!! Just having masks outside isn't going to be enough if you are 1 foot away from others for a long time.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Yup. Sigh

SI

[GrantDawg]

Agreed. Also, DC might be safe but places like Atlanta is a perfect target.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Trumps head legal strategist was just on FOX News embarrassing herself and the entire Trump team.

cliffs pls

[Jukeman]

So apparently it’s a conspiracy that real ballots were water marked.

Can this also please be a defeat of Qanon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I know a ton of Never Trumpers and not a single one of us would have voted for Bernie. I would have gone Libertarian like the last 3 elections.

i still find this attitude totally bizarre. FOr years he was one of the very few who spoke positive messages and clear plans for help[ing the american people. He and Warren the only two really.

[Ksyrup]

First of all, he's the political grumpy old man version of Gilbert Gottfried when he speaks. Just an awful presence. And that doesn't even get to the extreme substance. I'd prefer a moderate, center-left attempt at helping people before we go full Bernie. No thanks.

[Ksyrup]

They're down to "pressuring electors" as the last gasp.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Jukeman

So apparently it’s a conspiracy that real ballots were water marked.

Can this also please be a defeat of Qanon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Aubrey Huff is already saying Q was a Democratic plant.

[Ben E Lou]

I actually laughed out loud.

71,000,000 Legal Votes. The most EVER for a sitting President!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) November 7, 2020

[CrimsonFox]

did you notice that if Pennsylvania and Georgia fell red, that Biden would still EXACTLY win thanks to Nebraska's second district?

The more you know...

[molson]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Bernie couldn't get his voters out for the primary yet he was going to get 70+ million in the general?

Trump would have gotten his landslide against Bernie and I was a Warren supporter as well. The socialism stuff was sticking on a career moderate, it would have destroyed Bernie's campaign.

Just like with Trump, anything that doesn't go Bernie's way was rigged. Didn't you know?

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I actually laughed out loud.




They can put that on his tombstone

[BYU 14]

so just now on fox. "There may be irregularities there, we just haven't been allowed to look for them"

so that's the talking point now? It's like me saying, "There may be oil in my backyard, the HOA just won't let me dig for it." And I could have been rich!

[molson]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

They can put that on his tombstone

Haha, that reminds me of Dan Duquette bragging that the Red Sox spent more days in first place one year than any other team (they just weren't in first place on the last day.)

[sovereignstar v2]

https://twitter.com/brianklaas/statu...074608128?s=19

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by molson

Haha, that reminds me of Dan Duquette bragging that the Red Sox spent more days in first place one year than any other team (they just weren't in first place on the last day.)

Haha yeah remember that (sorry Red Sox fans)

[Jukeman]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Aubrey Huff is already saying Q was a Democratic plant.

Wow...

[Atocep]

Does Lindey Graham plan on running in 2024? Does he really think he has a legit shot at pulling the Trump base? That's the only thing that makes sense.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Aubrey Huff is already saying Q was a Democratic plant.

Did he ever play without wearing a batting helmet?

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Does Lindey Graham plan on running in 2024? Does he really think he has a legit shot at pulling the Trump base? That's the only thing that makes sense.

I don't know think that is a smart move, considering all the fuckery that will come out over the next couple of years from the Trump admin. It is a risky wire to walk with no net and he certainly can't flip back to his pre-2016 opinion on Trump.

[Drake]

Just FYI, expect to hear a ton about Hammer and Scorecard over the next few days/weeks.

A stupid link for the curious: https://www.rebelnews.com/breaking_s...are_was_hacked

[Ksyrup]

I feel like the "most votes ever" talking point for ANYONE is pretty stupid. It's like the 90s/00s Yankees having the most games played/AB/IP in post-season history, when up until 1969, there was just a WS. You don't think Ruth, Mantle, Ford, etc., wouldn't still own all those records if they played as many playoff games back in the day? US population just 30 years ago was like 85M less than it is now.

[Ksyrup]

I've pretty much given up at this point, but in case anyone needs a running list for discussion purposes:

It's actually pretty wild to compare the progression of false information from Election Day 1 to Election Day 4: https://t.co/tMMh9u3Wyn pic.twitter.com/iy5y5Pzd55

— Jane Lytvynenko (@JaneLytv) November 6, 2020

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

so just now on fox. "There may be irregularities there, we just haven't been allowed to look for them"

so that's the talking point now? It's like me saying, "There may be oil in my backyard, the HOA just won't let me dig for it." And I could have been rich!

Fucking HOA's! Always ruining OUR lives! Amirite!?

[Ironhead]

Serious, non-snarky question - I don't really have any sources of rational viewpoints from the Republican side. Just as I am shocked that almost half of the country actually voted for Trump I would imagine they are just as shocked that Biden won. Does anyone have any good sources of rational Republican debate/articles that don't veer into clear Fox News talking points or batshit QAnon stuff?

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I feel like the "most votes ever" talking point for ANYONE is pretty stupid. It's like the 90s/00s Yankees having the most games played/AB/IP in post-season history, when up until 1969, there was just a WS. You don't think Ruth, Mantle, Ford, etc., wouldn't still own all those records if they played as many playoff games back in the day? US population just 30 years ago was like 85M less than it is now.

I agree somewhat. The overall turnout was impressive. And 2012 and 2016 didn't deliver bigger vote totals than 08 despite increased population. The total votes are impressive for both campaigns, even when you factor in increased population.

[Butter]

I'm not trying to be a dick, but to those who were saying "it doesn't matter if the media calls the election or not," might I just refer you to the last 7 hours or so.

It matters

[ISiddiqui]

It's not like they never were going to call the race. It didn't matter one whit that they called on Saturday (or even Monday) as opposed to Friday. My evidence.. the last 7 hours.

It may have actually been better to call it on Saturday. Most people were out of work.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

I actually laughed out loud.

71,000,000 Legal Votes. The most EVER for a sitting President!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) November 7, 2020

That probably came because of this.

President Donald Trump has received more popular votes than any of his predecessors, with over 70 million and counting as of Friday afternoon, breaking the previous record set by Barack Obama in 2008 by over 500,000. https://t.co/wDKiaeP0GE

— Breitbart News (@BreitbartNews) November 7, 2020

You're the bestest Daddy!

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I feel like the "most votes ever" talking point for ANYONE is pretty stupid. It's like the 90s/00s Yankees having the most games played/AB/IP in post-season history, when up until 1969, there was just a WS. You don't think Ruth, Mantle, Ford, etc., wouldn't still own all those records if they played as many playoff games back in the day? US population just 30 years ago was like 85M less than it is now.

FWIW, this post inspired my nerdy side, so I normalized the total popular vote from previous elections according to 2020 eligible voter population. Here were the 10 most impressive performances...

1964 Lyndon Johnson - 90,437,576
1936 Franklin Roosevelt 82,816,659
1952 Dwight Eisenhower 81,582,667
1956 Dwight Eisenhower 81,444,946
1972 Richard Nixon 80,162,107
1940 Franklin Roosevelt 77,126,621
2020 Joe Biden 75,010,459
1984 Ronald Reagan 74,877,544
1960 John F. Kennedy 74,652,363
2008 Barack Obama 72,310,005

[Ksyrup]

But what was LBJ's WAR that year?

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Ironhead

Does anyone have any good sources of rational Republican debate/articles that don't veer into clear Fox News talking points or batshit QAnon stuff?

Depends on what you are looking for really. I don't consume Fox so I don't know what their talking points even are - the question is a little general/vague for me to really answer. If you mean about the election, it's basically Trump lost but there was no blue wave (in other words, what everyone else is also saying), recounts are pointless it's over, country is divided, election was a warning to both parties, etc. Basically a half-victory in that while Trump lost, progressivism didn't really win either. Some are peeved at general media bias, polls being inaccurate and possibly suppressing turnout, the overall negative coverage of Trump during his presidency - the usual hobbyhorses.

A couple excerpts from Kevin Williamson at National Review might be worth noting in terms of the current state of the electorate:

Originally Posted by Kevin H Williamson

the evidence suggests that Americans do not actually want revolution: They like the entitlement system the way it is and strongly resist changes to it; they famously hate Congress but like their own representatives well enough; in this election, 98 percent of House incumbents will be returned to Washington; proposals for radical social change ranging from government-monopoly health care to categorical prohibition of abortion reliably fail to command the support of even a bare majority, much less a transformative popular groundswell; the big tax-cut bill of 2017 reduced the top income-tax rate from 39.6 percent to 37 percent, a whoop-dee-doo moment if ever there was one; if you ask Americans about Trump’s trade policies, you get partisan polarization, but if you ask them about trade in general, you get a strikingly broad bipartisan consensus

Later ...

Originally Posted by Kevin H Williamson

Our politics is not about philosophy or the grand sweep of history: It’s about free false teeth and the social pecking order. ... Democrats may talk about socialism and “democratizing” the economy, but what real-life progressives walking the street actually demand is that somebody else pay their medical bills and their college loans, and that the state maybe provide them with an allowance, in loco parentis, in the form of wage subsidies and employer mandates. ... most Americans do not have any real interior sense of self and are instead almost purely exterior in their orientation, getting their sense of status and personal meaning from the evaluation and approval of others. That’s the evil genius behind Facebook and Twitter, the genesis of the selfie, and the reason you now have to honk your horn after every red light to rouse the driver in front of you from his Instagram immersion. For such people, status is an absolutely zero-sum calculation: If one person moves up a few notches, then everybody now below him has been diminished. It’s a thoroughly puerile way of thinking about the world, but it is what drives American life — especially American political life. This kind of status-gaming is why our politics is driven by tribe rather than policy and why the president has become a ceremonial tribal totem instead of a chief executive. That’s what we’re fighting over.

[JPhillips]

Hard to take the second part seriously without an acknowledgement that college used to cost a fraction of what it does today, and lots of reliably conservative voters get free healthcare from Medicare, Medicaid, and the V.A.

[Ksyrup]

This was always the back-up plan - if I lose, I'll screw up as much as possible as leverage for extricating myself and others from legal issues. I guarantee it. This is the way he does business. Attempts to turn a bad situation into an advantage by being a bully/whiner/litigant and then trade for concessions.

"Fox News has learned that under some conditions Trump would consider an appropriate transfer of power."https://t.co/MUYowwAFm4 pic.twitter.com/Y2JVG6rp7S

— Brad Heath (@bradheath) November 7, 2020

[rjolley]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

That probably came because of this.

President Donald Trump has received more popular votes than any of his predecessors, with over 70 million and counting as of Friday afternoon, breaking the previous record set by Barack Obama in 2008 by over 500,000. https://t.co/wDKiaeP0GE

— Breitbart News (@BreitbartNews) November 7, 2020

You're the bestest Daddy!

Love how they left out the fact that Biden passed that record by Wednesday morning. They could point out he has the most votes to lose the election, beating Hilary Clinton....again. That might make him feel better.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

My brother pretty much nailed it. Even down to the margins in FL and OH.

Biden is done. AZ means nothing without a PA/GA/NC/FL/OH to go with it, even if you assume he gets MN/WI/MI.

I guess that would make NV the state he needs to go with AZ as his only path.

man i'm reading election night coverage here and getting super stressed out. YOu guys stress me out! Also this is the ONE post I happen to see on election night then promptly closed my browser and proceeded to cry in a corner

i hate you for doing that to me ksyrup

[GrantDawg]

It is all Ksyrup's fault. LET'S GET HIM!!!!

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

This was always the back-up plan - if I lose, I'll screw up as much as possible as leverage for extricating myself and others from legal issues. I guarantee it. This is the way he does business. Attempts to turn a bad situation into an advantage by being a bully/whiner/litigant and then trade for concessions.

"Fox News has learned that under some conditions Trump would consider an appropriate transfer of power."https://t.co/MUYowwAFm4 pic.twitter.com/Y2JVG6rp7S

— Brad Heath (@bradheath) November 7, 2020

I am no legal expert.

It would piss me off to let him get with potential crimes

Butttt...

"If I lose to him, I don't know what I'm going to do. I will never speak to you again," Trump told supporters at a rally in North Carolina.

If we can make this legally binding and force anyone else involved in his administration who would like to avoid prosecution to the same conditions, I would be willing to talk.