WW XCIII - Mine Wars - Battle of Blair Mountain - SYMPATHIZERS WIN!!!

[jeheinz72]

I had to, it was too easy. JK, EF!

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

I should just be 72.

I'm sure we can just whittle everyone down to two letters. Hoops could be HO. I like that.

We could make like a Table of Elements, only it'd be a Table of WW (!) players.

HAHAHAHAHA That's actaully the funniest thing I've seen in WW for a while.

[EagleFan]

Looking back I see that Poli and Jackal were standing out in my mind. The other instances don't mention the fate of the targets. We can safely remove my theory.

That wasn't so difficult now was it?

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

I had to, it was too easy. JK, EF!

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

We're TWO for THREE! We were going to lynch Jackal even before he was outed by Norm. Discussing and focused voting has served us well thus far. Paranoia is what has caused the problems.

We're not truly 2 for 3. We only got Pass because of BK's hunch and duking.

The same people that are so certain of everything else were also so certain that dubb was a sympathizer.

[Glengoyne]

I'm not liking Clap as the target today.

NTN and DT. I went into today believing that one of them would be a wolf. Simply because I doubt all of the wolves were concentrated on Dubb on day 5. I'm holding this view even in light of both of their apparent good indicators. Earlier I leaned toward NTN...now I think the balance of wolfiness moves to DT.

So I'm not getting any traction on voting for this pair on the above day 5 vote logic. From my point of view, we are 50/50(?) of finding a wolf voting for DT or NTN. Does that point of view hold no water?


If this pair isn't getting any traction, then I say we lynch Danny or PB. My preference would be Danny, as he was the one moving around at the end.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

We're not truly 2 for 3. We only got Pass because of BK's hunch and duking.

The same people that are so certain of everything else were also so certain that dubb was a sympathizer.

Ok, 1 for 2 (since we were going to lynch Jackal that day anyhow).

[Glengoyne]

I'm like a dog clinging to the day five voting record like a bone. It just seems to be the only thing we have to go by.

Anybody think Day 3 tells us anything?

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

I'm not liking Clap as the target today.

NTN and DT. I went into today believing that one of them would be a wolf. Simply because I doubt all of the wolves were concentrated on Dubb on day 5. I'm holding this view even in light of both of their apparent good indicators. Earlier I leaned toward NTN...now I think the balance of wolfiness moves to DT.

So I'm not getting any traction on voting for this pair on the above day 5 vote logic. From my point of view, we are 50/50(?) of finding a wolf voting for DT or NTN. Does that point of view hold no water?


If this pair isn't getting any traction, then I say we lynch Danny or PB. My preference would be Danny, as he was the one moving around at the end.

Danny did make the valid point though that it wouldn't make sense for him to move his vote if he was a wolf and PB was a villager.

[jeheinz72]

Originally Posted by Glengoyne

I'm like a dog clinging to the day five voting record like a bone. It just seems to be the only thing we have to go by.

Anybody think Day 3 tells us anything?

Do you have it handy to re-post?

[EagleFan]

I would lean more towards ntn than towards DT at this point. Just because ntn passed BK the explosive that doesn't make him a good roled player. It seems that only a certain person can use the explosive and that would most likley be known by ntn. Since BK's role was revealed as duke the chances of him having the other role were slim. This would make for a good way to try to earn favor by a wolf, passing an object to someone who can't use it against you (and that sounds as if there is just as much chance of a bad result, based on what DT tells us).

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Do you have it handy to re-post?

I had what I thought was the final voting at one point but that was ripped from Jackal and I have since been told it wasn't accurate. I do think that Lathum posted it about 4 or 5 pages back (hard to keep track any more).

[EagleFan]

Post 311 as a response to Glen's 306 post. I could have sworn I quoted. Must have just hit reply. I think I am getting old and losing my mind. People will start calling me Bucc soon.

[EagleFan]

lol, that was supposed to be 3011 and 3006.

[Glengoyne]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

Do you have it handy to re-post?

I qouted Lathum's version in 2716.

[jeheinz72]

914 EF Votes PB (1-0)
986 Pass votes Poli
989 Pass unvotes Poli
991 Pass votes Poli (1-1)
998 Poli votes Pass (1-1-1)
1063 Heinze votes Autumn (1-1-1-1)
1116 Clap votes Pass (2-1-1-1)
1134 Lathum votes Render (2-1-1-1-1)
1149 Poli unvotes pass (1-1-1-1-1)
1154 Pass unvotes Poli (1-1-1-1)
1154 Pass votes Clap (1-1-1-1-1)
1166 Danny votes Jackal (1-1-1-1-1-1)
1190 Autumn votes Render (2-1-1-1-1-1)
1202 Poli votes the Jackal (2-2-1-1-1-1)
1205 The Jackal votes Render (3-2-1-1-1-1)
1209 Dubb votes Render (4-2-1-1-1-1
1216 Heinze unvotes Autumn (4-2-1-1-1)
1216 Heinze votes Jackal (4-3-1-1-1)
1250 Dubb unvotes render (3-3-1-1-1)
1250 Dubb votes BK (3-3-1-1-1-1)
1255 CR votes Autumn (3-3-1x5)
1300 Dubb unvotes BK (3-3-1x4)
1304 Dubb votes Jackal (4-3-1x4)
1312 BK votes Jackal (5-3-1x4)
1331 Pass unvotes Clap (5-3-1-1-1)
1331 Pass votes Render (5-4-1-1-1)
1334 PB votes Jackal (6-4-1-1-1)
1340 EF unvotes PB (6-4-1-1)
1340 EF votes Jackal (7-4-1-1)
1341 Dubb unvotes JAckal (6-4-1-1)
1341 Dubb votes Render (6-5-1-1)
1354 Render votes Jackal (7-5-1-1)
1358 USFL votes Schmidty (7-5-1-1-1)
1361 Dubb unvotes render (7-4-1-1-1)
1361 Dubb votes Schmidty (7-4-1x4)
1370 TheNorm votes no lynch
1372 The Jackal unvotes Render (7-3-1x4)
1372 The Jackal votes Schmidty (7-4-2-1-1-1)
1372- EF unvotes Jackal (6-4-2-1-1-1)
1372- EF votes PB (6-4-2-1x4)
1377 The Jackal unvotes Schmidty
1377 The JAckal votes Render 6-5-2-1x4)

[ntndeacon]

Vote PB

[jeheinz72]

So we have

Clap voting early for a wolf and not changing (not bad not good, imo)

DT not voting
NTN not voting

Danny votes Jackal early and never changes (dunno if he was back on)

PB with a pretty late vote to put Jackal up 6-4

Render ditto to make it 7-5 (but also a self defense vote)

Glen/Schmidty not voting as well

Did I miss anyone?

[Glengoyne]

Are the early votes essentially votes for no lynch, or are they evidence of a wolf not providing a trail? I guess neither would be a valid response.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

I'll be selfish since my skills aren't useful today. If we decide my labor will help then I will switch.

go on mission

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Fine, I'll switch and go to where we most need people. For the record, I still think Danny's reasoning about the mission isn't necessarily bad.

unvote mission

work on organization

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Apparently my work has been requested elsewhere. ROTATE.

unwork organizing

work food

Originally Posted by The Jackal

hey just came around and caught up

i think since i'm a searcher i should definitely go on the mission - but i'll be checking in beforehands to make sure it's not necessary for me to stay back and work on the camps

GO ON MISSION

I finally decided to go back and look at what is being used as evidence against me. EF continues to say that I got off this mission once another wolf got on it. IF you look at these posts AND their timestamps (couldn't figure out how to bring that over in the quote but these are on pages 10-11, 50 pages ago I might add!) I am off the mission for 54 minutes before Jackal gets on it. This is a twisting of facts on the part of EF IMO. Go back and look for yourself and I said upfront that I would do labor if that is ultimately where I was needed.

As for the other thing that appears in his COT against me, "questionable votes." Ummm, yeah, voted the wolf two days in a row and voted dubb who, as half the village seemed to agree, was questionable. I'm not driving a charge against EF yet, I just think he's thrown a lot of stuff out there, some about me, that isn't necessarily fact. Hell, I actually assumed that he was right when he said I got off the mission AFTER Jackal got on it.

Look, you don't lose crap if you lynch me, just a semi-vanilla (race, not role) villager and of course the one person that could clear me died last night before he could scan me or, interestingly enough, start re-scanning people.

I see no value in a wolf keeping me around, which is why Danny won't get my vote, even in self-defense. As for the rest, yeah, not really sure where my vote will end up. I had thought DT but this arrest keeps him from being lynched I assume since Norm wasn't allowed to scan arrested people.

[PurdueBrad]

EF, if you could look back, I *think* you'll see things the way I laid them out but maybe not.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

Vote PB

You made several posts prior to this but no reasoning anywhere. So, yeah?

[EagleFan]

Day 3 vote:

(914) EagleFan votes PB (PB 1)
(986) Pass votes Poli (PB 1, Poli 1)
(988) Pass unvotes Poli (PB 1)
(991) Pass votes Poli (PB 1, Poli 1)
(998) Poli votes Pass (PB 1, Poli 1, Pass 1)
(1063) jeneiz votes Autumn (PB 1, Poli 1, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1116) clap votes Pass (Pass 2, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1)
(1134) Lathum votes RendeR (Pass 2, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1)
(1149) Poli unvotes Pass (Pass 1, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1)
(1154) Pass unvotes Poli, votes clap (Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1, clap 1)
(1166) Danny votes Jackal (Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1, clap 1, Jackal 1)
(1190) Autumn votes RendeR (RendeR 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1, Jackal 1)
(1202) Poli votes Jackal (RendeR 2, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1205) Jackal votes RendeR (RendeR 3, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1209) dubb votes RendeR (RendeR 4, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1216) jeheinz unvotes Autumn, votes Jackal (RendeR 4, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1)
(1250) dubb unvotes Render, votes BK (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, BK 1)
(1255) CR votes Autumn (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, BK 1, Autumn 1)
(1300) dubb unvotes BK (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1304) dubb votes Jackal (Jackal 4, RendeR 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1312) BK votes Jackal (Jackal 5, RendeR 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1331) Pass unvotes clap, votes RendeR (Jackal 5, RendeR 4, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1)
(1334) PB votes Jackal (Jackal 6, RendeR 4, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1)
(1340) EF unvoted PB, voted Jackal (Jackal 7, RendeR 4, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1341) dubb unvotes Jackal, votes RendeR (Jackal 6, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1354) RendeR votes Jackal (Jackal 7, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1358) USFLTecmo votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1, Schmidty 1)
(1361) dubb unvoted RendeR, votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 4, Schmidty 2, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1372) Jackal unvotes RendeR, votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 3, Schmidty 3, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1373) EF unvotes Jackal, votes PB (Jackal 6, RendeR 3, Schmidty 3, Pass 1, Autumn 1, PB 1)
(1377) Jackal unvoted Schmidty, votes RendeR (Jackal 6, RendeR 4, Schmidty 2, Pass 1, Autumn 1, PB 1)

[EagleFan]

With this Danny does not look as good as he claims for his Jackal vote. It looked like a throw away vote at the time.

Also PB looks good based on this with his Jackal vote.


Notable: no votes from DT or ntn. I thought I was incorrect with an earlier posting of final vote totals that didn't have them as voting (one of the two responded to my post that they had vote that day).

[EagleFan]

What sucks about that day is that now I see why we went after dubb. His votes were pretty damning once Jackal was shown to be a wolf.

[EagleFan]

jeheinz looks solid to me with that Jackal vote, bringing him back into the running. I don't think the cunning would do that to a fellow wolf when he wasn't exactly in danger at the time. That says that only conversion would be a negative for jeheinz and I can't see that happening as it would have needed to take place last night which would mean conversion, "kill" and arrest on the same day.

[EagleFan]

I don't understand CR's Autumn vote, seems like a throw away vote.

[EagleFan]

USFL also stands out with his Schmidty vote. It sounds like a good "cause vote" with no Schmidty work action that day but there was something like 3 minutes until the deadline at that point, there was no way that was going to happen in that short of time.

[EagleFan]

My unvote of Jackal looks bad but I was not sold on the vote at that point and received a complaint that my vote made it a runaway so I went back to PB. Plus one thing that is a certain is that I was good at the time of that vote (still am but for the sake of this discussion we can only focus on the snapshot of that day) as that night is when Poli blocked the attack on me.

[EagleFan]

I think my Lathum vote has at least shaken enough loose for now.


unvote Lathum

vote ntn

[PurdueBrad]

Can someone tell me what the case is on ntn? I'm tempted just to vote him because he voted me, but didn't he supply us the dyn-o-mite! (couldn't resist)?

[EagleFan]

One thing I can say for certain tonight. PB will not be getting my vote.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

One thing I can say for certain tonight. PB will not be getting my vote.

You know, that seems ominous and scary to me and I AM PB.

I'll likely be in and out most of the night, still fighting some sort of flu/head cold bug and ended up taking tomorrow off.

[jeheinz72]

I still don't get the NTN issue.

[jeheinz72]

if someone could please explain to me WHY we're voting for him, I might consider following suit

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Can someone tell me what the case is on ntn? I'm tempted just to vote him because he voted me, but didn't he supply us the dyn-o-mite! (couldn't resist)?

I am not sold on the supply the dynamite act. He gave the dynamite to the duke. It seems like it is clear that only a certain role can use it, based on BK's account of having it and not knowing what to do with it until DT used his initial supply. This could very easily be a ploy of trying to gain trust of aknown villager by giving them an item, especially if it looks like the person they are giving it to can't use it. I doubt that multiple roles would be given to the same person, just seems too powerful.

I am still not sold on DT either but his actions seem to benefit us moreso than ntn's.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

You know, that seems ominous and scary to me and I AM PB.

I'll likely be in and out most of the night, still fighting some sort of flu/head cold bug and ended up taking tomorrow off.

I didn't realize when your Jackal vote came on day 3. So much was being made of when we voted out dubb that I overlooked day 3 (with it being a duking).

I kept hearing Danny talking about how his vote of Jackal should make him look better so I was confusing his vote with yours that day. You vote actually looks good. His vote really doesn't mean much (see my earlier explanation).

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by jeheinz72

I still don't get the NTN issue.

The more I look at things I could see a Danny vote making more sense.

Personally I am not a big fan of the no votes on day three (Schmidty, DT and ntn).

[USFLTecmo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

USFL also stands out with his Schmidty vote. It sounds like a good "cause vote" with no Schmidty work action that day but there was something like 3 minutes until the deadline at that point, there was no way that was going to happen in that short of time.

I started that post probably 10 minutes before I posted. I continually tried to find words that said "Schmidty's not a help to us at this point" without coming off like a jerk. If trying to be diplomatic gets me voted for, by all means.

[PurdueBrad]

After reading my quotation out of context, it sounds really funny and I may start ending every post with "and I AM PB."

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

After reading my quotation out of context, it sounds really funny and I may start ending every post with "and I AM PB."

lol

[EagleFan]

Think Nyquil PB, it can be your friend in times like this.

[EagleFan]

Gotta go work on getting dinner. Be back later.

[Passacaglia]

I think I would like my symbol to be A. Thanks.

[PurdueBrad]

Alright, I'm putting this in in case I take EF's suggestion of three bottles of NyQuil. This is for a hit and run as much as anything.

vote ntn

[jeheinz72]

Unvote PB
Vote USFL

Probably a throw-away vote, but so is PB. I'm no longer sold on Danny, at least not before PB since his move would be foolish to switch that late in V vs V

I'm not voting NTN for passing the dynamite to the game's most trusted player. While *maybe* he *might* have had an inkling on a better recipient, he did go with the safer plan and that's not earning my vote.

[jeheinz72]

If the goal of arrests is mainly to stop work, then it's entirely possible the wolves would arrest one of their own to prevent the same thing (and possibly gain trust).

I think it's as good of a spot as any at this point.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Day 3 vote:

(914) EagleFan votes PB (PB 1)
(986) Pass votes Poli (PB 1, Poli 1)
(988) Pass unvotes Poli (PB 1)
(991) Pass votes Poli (PB 1, Poli 1)
(998) Poli votes Pass (PB 1, Poli 1, Pass 1)
(1063) jeheinz votes Autumn (PB 1, Poli 1, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1116) clap votes Pass (Pass 2, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1)
(1134) Lathum votes RendeR (Pass 2, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1)
(1149) Poli unvotes Pass (Pass 1, PB 1, Poli 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1)
(1154) Pass unvotes Poli, votes clap (Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1, clap 1)
(1166) Danny votes Jackal (Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, RendeR 1, clap 1, Jackal 1)
(1190) Autumn votes RendeR (RendeR 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1, Jackal 1)
(1202) Poli votes Jackal (RendeR 2, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1205) Jackal votes RendeR (RendeR 3, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1209) dubb votes RendeR (RendeR 4, Jackal 2, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1, clap 1)
(1216) jeheinz unvotes Autumn, votes Jackal (RendeR 4, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1)
(1250) dubb unvotes Render, votes BK (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, BK 1)
(1255) CR votes Autumn (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, BK 1, Autumn 1)
(1300) dubb unvotes BK (RendeR 3, Jackal 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1304) dubb votes Jackal (Jackal 4, RendeR 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1312) BK votes Jackal (Jackal 5, RendeR 3, Pass 1, PB 1, clap 1, Autumn 1)
(1331) Pass unvotes clap, votes RendeR (Jackal 5, RendeR 4, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1)
(1334) PB votes Jackal (Jackal 6, RendeR 4, Pass 1, PB 1, Autumn 1)
(1340) EF unvoted PB, voted Jackal (Jackal 7, RendeR 4, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1341) dubb unvotes Jackal, votes RendeR (Jackal 6, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1354) RendeR votes Jackal (Jackal 7, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1358) USFLTecmo votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 5, Pass 1, Autumn 1, Schmidty 1)
(1361) dubb unvoted RendeR, votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 4, Schmidty 2, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1372) Jackal unvotes RendeR, votes Schmidty (Jackal 7, RendeR 3, Schmidty 3, Pass 1, Autumn 1)
(1373) EF unvotes Jackal, votes PB (Jackal 6, RendeR 3, Schmidty 3, Pass 1, Autumn 1, PB 1)
(1377) Jackal unvoted Schmidty, votes RendeR (Jackal 6, RendeR 4, Schmidty 2, Pass 1, Autumn 1, PB 1)

Let's see if this looks better.

green = 100% good at the time of the vote
red = 100% bad at the time of the vote
orange = could only be cunning at the time of the vote if not good (no chance for conversion for any) (90% good)
blue = good current feel (my feel)

[EagleFan]

Wow, that looks even worse. Sorry.

[EagleFan]

The clap vote on Pass makes him look a little better as he would be pushing a fellow wolf into the lead with that vote, though it was early.