2014-15 NFL Offseason Thread (Non Draft Edition)

[miami_fan]

The missing pieces: How many players away from the Super Bowl was each team?

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I get it, and like I said, he's not one that deserves sympathy from anyone. I even understand that a guy with substance abuse problems should probably be avoiding alcohol. But to suspend him an entire season for having something to drink? That seems absurd.

How else do you try and keep him under control besides such harsh penalties that threaten his livelihood? He's not going to jail for drinking. He just won't be an NFL player. Normal checks and balances clearly don't work for this idiot.

eta: A reminder that Matt Prater got suspended for alcohol earlier this season as well.

[Logan]

I should also clarify...if he has actual addiction issues, he's an idiot for not getting the help he needs. This isn't a guy who is staring at a bottle across the room and can't keep his hands off it. This is a guy who can't stop partying. Not going to Johnny Manziel parties should be step 1.

[Buccaneer]

The NFL should not be enabling such persons and should provide the help in a substance abuse center until cured. They can't do it on their own and if you keep throwing temptations in their way, they are going to fail.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I get it, and like I said, he's not one that deserves sympathy from anyone. I even understand that a guy with substance abuse problems should probably be avoiding alcohol. But to suspend him an entire season for having something to drink? That seems absurd.

The sheer number of people I work with on a daily capacity that have used, abused, and ignored the dangers of drinking would stagger a mule. The vast number of things i have witnessed, worked with, and more, trust me, alcohol is very much a drug which sometimes needs to be contained and removed from many individuals. Don't underestimate what it can do. Ever. Not even one drink.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

The NFL should not be enabling such persons and should provide the help in a substance abuse center until cured. They can't do it on their own and if you keep throwing temptations in their way, they are going to fail.

How do we know they don't offer help? Or that the Browns don't offer the help? Heck, it's massively in their interest to do so, with a guy with Gordon's talent.

Keep in mind, sometimes help can be offered, but simply not taken. Consider the NFL's much publicized driving program where drivers will drive players around who expect to be drinking (or who will go out to pick up drunk players). How often is that service even used by players?

[Kodos]

Maybe they should do the Dez Bryant bodyguard thing.

[Buccaneer]

I would think it would be a condition of further employment, falling under FMLA for example.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

The sheer number of people I work with on a daily capacity that have used, abused, and ignored the dangers of drinking would stagger a mule. The vast number of things i have witnessed, worked with, and more, trust me, alcohol is very much a drug which sometimes needs to be contained and removed from many individuals. Don't underestimate what it can do. Ever. Not even one drink.

I think what I'm trying to say is less about "alcohol" and more about "perfectly legal substance." My outrage is that these players (include Prater if you'd like) are being banned from something that they are well within their rights to do.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I think what I'm trying to say is less about "alcohol" and more about "perfectly legal substance." My outrage is that these players (include Prater if you'd like) are being banned from something that they are well within their rights to do.

They have no god given right to be an NFL player.

If I had the wrap sheet he has my employer would cut bait with me, as I'm sure yours would also.

[miked]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I think what I'm trying to say is less about "alcohol" and more about "perfectly legal substance." My outrage is that these players (include Prater if you'd like) are being banned from something that they are well within their rights to do.

There are plenty of legal substances banned by the NFL (including things like Adderall and the such). It's not that any player can't drink alcohol, it's that players in stage X (I think it's 3 or something) of the substance abuse program can't do it. Dude has not only had substance problems but DUIs. If you are convicted of drunk driving, I believe a condition of your probation can be alcohol tests. Once again, it's not that he's had a legal substance, it's that he's had a banned substance under the conditions of the program he's in (and should know better).

[Vince, Pt. II]

Was he drinking on the job? Then what right at all does his employer have to take away his personal freedom? Sure Adderall is banned. For performance enhancing purposes. I take no issue with that.

I get it that he's under contract and subject to said contract. It's the contract I'm talking about that I take issue with.

Yes, if I had his rap sheet I'd be out of a job. But if my employer tried to take money out of my pocket for doing something on my own personal time that isn't illegal, I'd have a major issue with it.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

Was he drinking on the job? Then what right at all does his employer have to take away his personal freedom? Sure Adderall is banned. For performance enhancing purposes. I take no issue with that.

I get it that he's under contract and subject to said contract. It's the contract I'm talking about that I take issue with.

Yes, if I had his rap sheet I'd be out of a job. But if my employer tried to take money out of my pocket for doing something on my own personal time that isn't illegal, I'd have a major issue with it.

he is under contract, he has no personal time

[miked]

Once again, if you get pulled over for DUI, they can test you for alcohol as part of your probation. This is no different. He had a DUI after already being in a program. It's not like everyone in the league can't drink, it's reserved for people in an advanced stage of a substance abuse program. I'm sure if the NFLPA wanted it out of the CBA, they may lose other things in relation to the process that they like.

[Logan]

Not to mention that part of the condition of his reinstatement (the first time and the second time) was him complying with the program outlined for him.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

Was he drinking on the job? Then what right at all does his employer have to take away his personal freedom? Sure Adderall is banned. For performance enhancing purposes. I take no issue with that.

I get it that he's under contract and subject to said contract. It's the contract I'm talking about that I take issue with.

Yes, if I had his rap sheet I'd be out of a job. But if my employer tried to take money out of my pocket for doing something on my own personal time that isn't illegal, I'd have a major issue with it.

He can drink all he wants. He would just need to find another line of work.

[Galaril]

Rumors circulating in town that Wade Phillips and his 3-4 will be announced as the Broncos DC. I like it though it appears there first choice was the Bengals Secondary coach Vance Joseph but the Browns blocked them from pursuing him as he is under contract. Anyways, with the Broncos depth at the front 7 and especially at LB would love to see a 3-4.

[Ryche]

Originally Posted by Galaril

Rumors circulating in town that Wade Phillips and his 3-4 will be announced as the Broncos DC. I like it though it appears there first choice was the Bengals Secondary coach Vance Joseph but the Browns blocked them from pursuing him as he is under contract. Anyways, with the Broncos depth at the front 7 and especially at LB would love to see a 3-4.

Agreed. Always felt that Von Miller was a more natural 3-4 outside linebacker type. And while Phillips is a bad head coach, he's one of the better defensive coordinators.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Ryche

Agreed. Always felt that Von Miller was a more natural 3-4 outside linebacker type. And while Phillips is a bad head coach, he's one of the better defensive coordinators.

I would think they move Marshall inside with Nate Irving as I believe they resign him. On the outside, that means Danny Trevathon with Von Miller. I expect them to make a ahrd run at the Pats McCourty FS spot but am fine drafting early for that in round 2 or 3 also. The bigger questions is do they give Potroast the money or go after Dan Williams in AZ who is a FA backed up by Sylvester Williams and at DE I guess we have Ware and Malik Jackson with backups of Wolfe and ? again would like to see an addition here via the draft or FA. I think on offense we will see some major changes with a new offensive scheme under Kubiak so we will be saving some money letting Julius Thomas walk and Demarius Thomas also perhaps drafting a TE maybe 1st round or a center. Also hope we try to sign a guy like Owen Daniels. Maybe we brink a WR in too from FA but Latimer has been looking good in practice I guess so he should be given the other WR spot next to Sanders. Overall, even when Manning hangs it up after this 2015 season likely if not sooner we are going to be in very decent shape and not rebuilding at all. The team overall is very young 5th youngest in the league. Sure we will need to figure out QB but we got the right group to make a young guy successful who ever it is. Maybe we got him on the roster already in Dysert or Osweiler.

[BishopMVP]

Where are the Broncos going to get the money to go after McCourty? Letting Welker/Tamme walk saves about $9 mil, but you've got both Thomas's and Knighton, any of whom will take up most of that, plus Trevathan and Carter as RFA's. I think letting Demaryius walk and using Latimer makes the most sense, but IMO they'd be crazy to let Julius walk.

[stevew]

The Broncos have been cap cheeters before. I'm sure they'll have no issue cheating the cap again.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Where are the Broncos going to get the money to go after McCourty? Letting Welker/Tamme walk saves about $9 mil, but you've got both Thomas's and Knighton, any of whom will take up most of that, plus Trevathan and Carter as RFA's. I think letting Demaryius walk and using Latimer makes the most sense, but IMO they'd be crazy to let Julius walk.

I think JT is gone for sure as behind his flashing pass catching numbers is a softie for a TE. Shitty blocking from both him and DT throughout the season with no effort seems to be sign the Broncos will not overextend for either. Also JT and Knighton have expressed they will not give any hometown discount in the papers and that surely sinks their ships with Elway. Like I said they can bring in a cheaper option to fill the void fine like Dan Williams . Also, mock drafts are starting to appear that show us grabbing Nosetackle Malcolm Brown in the 1st round.

Carter is not going to be resigned. He is a decent safety but has been injured most of his four seasons. Danny T is injured now for the third time this past year so he is not going to break the bank to be brought back nor is Nate Irving. Also won't be shocked if Manning restructured for some relief and if not he could be released still though I doubt it.

[Galaril]

And it is official Wade Phillips is the Broncos DC.

[Buccaneer]

Just to lighten the mood from all of the contrived animosities

[Thomkal]

My beloved Cardinals sweep the AP coaching awards-Bruce Arians Coach and
Todd Bowles the new Assistant Coach of the Year Awards

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-...ns-wins-easily

[Logan]

Manziel to Rehab.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Logan

Manziel to Rehab.

Addiction is a bitch, and it spares no one.

For his sake, I hope this is an honest attempt to deal with whatever his issues are and not some agent-inspired PR thing to try and make himself look like a victim.

Good luck to him.

[Chief Rum]

I think it's legit. Day after the Super Bowl? Almost seems like they're trying to bury it. Which makes sense if you don't want everyone getting on Manziel about his partying habits. That would seem to say it's for real.

Hope it gets him right. A sober Manziel who plays like he did in college would be fun to see (assuming he could pull it off).

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Addiction is a bitch, and it spares no one.

For his sake, I hope this is an honest attempt to deal with whatever his issues are and not some agent-inspired PR thing to try and make himself look like a victim.

Good luck to him.

Hopefully his enablers deal with their issues as well.

Heisman winner Johnny Manziel's celebrity could derail the Texas Aggies season - ESPN The Magazine - ESPN

[BillJasper]

Dan Quinn to Atlanta.

After the way Brady destroyed the 'Legion of Boom', if it isn't fair to wonder if Quinn's mind wasn't already in Atlanta.

I'd almost like to see a moratorium on interviewing/hiring head coaches during the post season. Push free agency to April and the draft to May to make up for lost prep time.

[Kodos]

Well, the Seahawks did have a ton of injuries in the secondary. I think that was part of the problem.

[flere-imsaho]

They showed little ability to adjust. When your defensive strategy is based primarily around having great players and having them beat their man, it works well until it doesn't, badly.

I mean, did they do something different once Gronk & Edelman got going? I didn't see it. When Brady countered their rush by getting rid of the ball as fast as possible, did they do something different?

[Travis]

Lane going down hurt the secondary, but even then, the D got going in the second half. The injury to Avril derailed the pass rush and it was after that that Brady got back in a groove and led them to the come back.

There are only so many things you can do once injuries hit, especially in game. Thomas was not his usual self, Gronk, other than the TD catch was pretty limited until after Avril got hurt (he took over after that it seemed), but you're talking about a D missing 2 starters on the line (Mebane and Avril), a key backup at DT (Hill) and their nickle corner (Lane) while 3 other guys (Thomas, Sherman, Chancellor) were varying degrees away from 100% (Thomas more so than the other two it seemed).

And still, going into the 4th quarter, they had held the Pats to 14 points.

4th quarter sucked, I'll give you that, but a lot of that is on the offense as well (Kearse's drop, Lynch not converting a 3rd and 1, Lockette falling on what could have been an easy first down conversion).

In the end the Pats had 377 yards on 72 plays (5.2 per) with only (I think) 2 plays over 20 yards. Their D is predicated on making you work your way down the field where they only need to make you make one mistake to undo the drive (like the early Lane interception).

There's only so many adjustments that can be made when you are running out of personnel. Biggest issue (imho) was 3rd down conversions. And a lot of those were plays against Simon where they didn't have really any options to go to.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Travis

Lockette falling on what could have been an easy first down conversion).

Was that the one where he got tripped, but it wasn't called?

[Thomkal]

Well the offseason is barely a day old and its off to a bad start. First Warren Sapp gets arrested and then fired from NFL Network (see Super Bowl thread), now this:

Ex-Raven Terrence Cody indicted on animal cruelty charges | FOX Sports

[miami_fan]

I know this is Cody's agent speaking but I would have the same question.

If (police) were so worried that he mistreated the dog that died, why did they leave two others in his house," Schaffer said.

[molson]

The dog died at the vet's office, and presumably there was something about the manner of death that concerned vets enough to contact the police, who investigated, and then the prosecutors thought there was enough for felony charges, which is a pretty high threshold.

But even with that, the police can't go barge into his house now and take any dogs they find there. There's probably some city ordinance that gives animal control authority to seize and/or destroy dangerous dogs, and maybe an ordinance that gives them the authority to seize neglected/abused dogs, but even in the latter kinds of cases, I know the local authorities try to get consent rather than try to fit the ordinance to the circumstances and go down that legal route, which could take longer. (It's not like with children, animals are property). Maybe they know about some bad situation in the house and are figuring out their options to deal with it, and maybe the agent has helped bring that situation to their attention.

So, unless I hear more, I'm going to lean against this theory that the vet, officers, and prosecutor were not really being concerned about the dog and just doing this as part of some collective retributive action. I have no idea what he did or if his actions rise to the level of a felony, but his agents' playing of the conspiracy card is just an attempt to make his guy feel like he has his back, and maybe to taint potential jurors.

[molson]

Dola, and it is not easy to kill a Presa Canario. They're huge, and can be aggressive (it's the breed that killed that woman in the San Francisco hallway apartment a few years ago.) Maybe this is all a misunderstanding, but this isn't a dog that's going to be injured if it falls off a sofa, or if you kick it.

Perro de Presa Canario - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The alligator angle is interesting......

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by molson

The dog died at the vet's office, and presumably there was something about the manner of death that concerned vets enough to contact the police, who investigated, and then the prosecutors thought there was enough for felony charges, which is a pretty high threshold.

But even with that, the police can't go barge into his house now and take any dogs they find there. There's probably some city ordinance that gives animal control authority to seize and/or destroy dangerous dogs, and maybe an ordinance that gives them the authority to seize neglected/abused dogs, but even in the latter kinds of cases, I know the local authorities try to get consent rather than try to fit the ordinance to the circumstances and go down that legal route, which could take longer. (It's not like with children, animals are property). Maybe they know about some bad situation in the house and are figuring out their options to deal with it, and maybe the agent has helped bring that situation to their attention.

So, unless I hear more, I'm going to lean against this theory that the vet, officers, and prosecutor were not really being concerned about the dog and just doing this as part of some collective retributive action. I have no idea what he did or if his actions rise to the level of a felony, but his agents' playing of the conspiracy card is just an attempt to make his guy feel like he has his back, and maybe to taint potential jurors.

That is why I ask these questions

I am sure I am reacting to the Bad Newz Kennels seizure.

[stevew]

Manziel went to rehab on last Weds but it got buried until today. And not to overshadow his sister singing the anthem.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Travis

Lane going down hurt the secondary, but even then, the D got going in the second half. The injury to Avril derailed the pass rush and it was after that that Brady got back in a groove and led them to the come back.

There are only so many things you can do once injuries hit, especially in game. Thomas was not his usual self, Gronk, other than the TD catch was pretty limited until after Avril got hurt (he took over after that it seemed), but you're talking about a D missing 2 starters on the line (Mebane and Avril), a key backup at DT (Hill) and their nickle corner (Lane) while 3 other guys (Thomas, Sherman, Chancellor) were varying degrees away from 100% (Thomas more so than the other two it seemed).

And still, going into the 4th quarter, they had held the Pats to 14 points.

4th quarter sucked, I'll give you that, but a lot of that is on the offense as well (Kearse's drop, Lynch not converting a 3rd and 1, Lockette falling on what could have been an easy first down conversion).

In the end the Pats had 377 yards on 72 plays (5.2 per) with only (I think) 2 plays over 20 yards. Their D is predicated on making you work your way down the field where they only need to make you make one mistake to undo the drive (like the early Lane interception).

There's only so many adjustments that can be made when you are running out of personnel. Biggest issue (imho) was 3rd down conversions. And a lot of those were plays against Simon where they didn't have really any options to go to.

I agree with most of this. I do wonder if they should've dressed Burley considering all the DB injuries - you obviously couldn't predict Lane breaking his arm but there was a decent chance at least one of Sherman, Chancellor or Thomas would be unable to play the full game.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by stevew

Manziel went to rehab on last Weds but it got buried until today. And not to overshadow his sister singing the anthem.

The person who sang the national anthem was Idina Menzel, born Idina Mentzel so not his sister (who is still in High School according to Wikipedia).

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

The person who sang the national anthem was Idina Menzel, born Idina Mentzel so not his sister (who is still in High School according to Wikipedia).

I think you've been spending too much time at the bar.

[Butter]

I'm not sure who you guys are talking about... are you talking about Adele Dazeem?

Sorry, that never gets old for me.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

The person who sang the national anthem was Idina Menzel, born Idina Mentzel so not his sister (who is still in High School according to Wikipedia).

[John Travolta]

Originally Posted by Butter_of_69

I'm not sure who you guys are talking about... are you talking about Adele Dazeem?

Sorry, that never gets old for me.

Hey. That was a low blow! I was drunk!

[flere-imsaho]

I'm really going to guess steve was kidding....

[Travis]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I agree with most of this. I do wonder if they should've dressed Burley considering all the DB injuries - you obviously couldn't predict Lane breaking his arm but there was a decent chance at least one of Sherman, Chancellor or Thomas would be unable to play the full game.

Oh, for sure, they had to be regretting that decision while dressing 3 TE and not using any of them in the game plan really. I was actually quite surprised to see Burley, Daniels and Gilliam all scratched while Moeaki and Helfet both played. I could have seen reasons to dress any of the other 3 over of those two, especially given the injury concerns coming in (Burley) or the fact that Gilliam can come in and play some TE as well.

Selfishly I was hoping to see Daniels in case he could inject some life into the return game.

I also think that, if healthy, we might have seen Thomas at corner as the game went on/Simon kept getting burned.

[Chief Rum]

I think the possible issue there is that we may not be fully aware of their usage in special teams or specific formations. For instance, three tight ends might be needed in a goal line formation. They could also be part of the hands team on kickoffs. Or blockers on the kick return team, which requires bigger guys who can run a little and who know how to block.

Also, keep in mind, they chose to make active the guy that the Pats were picking on (who came in for Lane), and he didn't play so well. If those guys are worse than he is, would it have done any good to have them active?

Some irony on the three TEs of course is that in the key play, had they gone big, those TEs would probably have all been in there.

[Travis]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I think the possible issue there is that we may not be fully aware of their usage in special teams or specific formations. For instance, three tight ends might be needed in a goal line formation. They could also be part of the hands team on kickoffs. Or blockers on the kick return team, which requires bigger guys who can run a little and who know how to block.

Also, keep in mind, they chose to make active the guy that the Pats were picking on (who came in for Lane), and he didn't play so well. If those guys are worse than he is, would it have done any good to have them active?

Some irony on the three TEs of course is that in the key play, had they gone big, those TEs would probably have all been in there.

Oh, for sure, when I read the inactives I fully believed that it was game plan oriented as those are the guys who get shuffled in and out each week. That was why I probably only really surprised by Gilliam being deactivated as he's a nice OL/TE tweener while the other guys are all more receiver than blocker (seemed a tad redundant), especially Helfet.

Special team wise, none are major contributors by the snap counts done this season. That's one reason Chris Matthews kept hanging around this year as they like him on coverage teams.

As for Simon vs Burley, yeah, they seem to like Burley as a pure slot guy while Simon is an outside guy (likely insurance for Sherman) and they like Lane on the outside so they can kick Maxwell into the slot in nickel formations. That said, hindsight is 20/20 and just like the pick at the end, you're not making roster decisions thinking about guys getting hurt in the first quarter like that.

Plus they had to have the extra safeties active in case Thomas or Chancellor had to come out, and yeah, just a mess. I'd imagine that they're going to try and get a guy or two who are hybrid S/CB types to try and avoid being in that situation again in the future. Pinkins was supposed to be that last year but didn't develop quickly enough to be that guy this year.

Now I'm mostly just hoping they're all healthy to start next season.