2016-2017 College Basketball Thread

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

There's more information coming out about the coaching search at Mizzou. Sounds like Crean's interview with our AD last weekend couldn't have gone any worse. Crean was giving all the wrong answers and the AD came away from the interview with Crean not being an option for the program.

And if IU fans didn't like Crean, they're not going to like Marshall either. They're extremely similar.

[Kodos]

According to Indiana board insiders, Crean reportedly didn't like the Mizzou AD and withdrew. So who knows which version is true?

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Kodos

According to Indiana board insiders, Crean reportedly didn't like the Mizzou AD and withdrew. So who knows which version is true?

Probably both - Crean probably realized after meeting the Mizzou AD that he didn't want to work for him, and the Mizzou AD realized he didn't like Crean.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by Kodos

According to Indiana board insiders, Crean reportedly didn't like the Mizzou AD and withdrew. So who knows which version is true?

Its all rumors and bs. Someone told me this morning that Crean asked for top 10 coaches' money and Missouri laughed him out of the room.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Probably both - Crean probably realized after meeting the Mizzou AD that he didn't want to work for him, and the Mizzou AD realized he didn't like Crean.

That's probably pretty close to the truth.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Kodos

According to Indiana board insiders, Crean reportedly didn't like the Mizzou AD and withdrew. So who knows which version is true?

Mizzou's AD is a pretty easy-going guy. He's very well liked both inside and outside the program. My guess is that Crean wanted control of certain things that Mizzou wasn't going to allow. That's the usual scenario in a coach hire where they decide that it's just not going to work out. But given that Crean was fired, that sounds a lot more like him saving face than a situation where Mizzou was the reason for the poor interview.

[Kodos]

Welp, it was reported before he was fired. FWIW.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Mizzou's AD is a pretty easy-going guy. He's very well liked both inside and outside the program. My guess is that Crean wanted control of certain things that Mizzou wasn't going to allow. That's the usual scenario in a coach hire where they decide that it's just not going to work out. But given that Crean was fired, that sounds a lot more like him saving face than a situation where Mizzou was the reason for the poor interview.

Sterk gave Ken Bone 7 years, which is all I need to known about him.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Sterk gave Ken Bone 7 years, which is all I need to known about him.

He also hired Paul Wulff.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Kodos

I give him all the credit in the world for coming when nobody else wanted to. I hate that it didn't work out for him like he dreamed. IU b-ball fans are hard to please. He knew that coming in, and came anyway. He took the shot. God bless him for it. I'm sure there must be some relief for him to be out of the pressure cooker. I hope he finds a long run of success somewhere. Someone mentioned that he might have a good job as a broadcaster.

On the ground here in Bloomington (I work for IU), this really seems to sum up the feelings of the folks I've talked to. The work Crean did to rehab the program, his stress on academics, and his positive contributions to the community as a whole makes the whole thing really bittersweet. People who know Crean can't say enough about his character, decency, and likeability.

People at IU just don't know how to break up with a coach before the relationship has turned completely dysfunctional and toxic.

[dawgfan]

So Richard Pitino's name is being floated in connection with the Washington job by CoachingChanges.com (not sure how credible they are). Assuming for a moment that there's something to this - can someone explain why he's a hot name other than he's the son of Rick Pitino? Yeah, his lone season with FIU using only six scholarship players was reasonably impressive, but I'm trying to understand why I should be excited about what he's done at Minnesota. What's the story with his 2nd and 3rd seasons there?

[tarcone]

He went from 2 conference wins to 2nd in the conference. 8 wins to 24.

Not sure why he only won 8 last season. but it was bad.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by tarcone

He went from 2 conference wins to 2nd in the conference. 8 wins to 24.

Not sure why he only won 8 last season. but it was bad.

That's the question. He went from 8-10 to 6-12 to 2-16 to this year's 11-7 breakthrough. But it looks like Tubby Smith had a fair amount of success prior to Pitino being hired, so I'm not really sure why I should be particularly impressed by Pitino Jr.

Kevin Keatts also comes from the Louisville coaching tree and his results look a lot more impressive...

[sovereignstar v2]

Don't sweat it, he's not going to make a lateral move to UDub.

[hoopsguy]

I think Martin has a chance to be pretty good at Mizzou. I had mixed feelings about him as a potential Illinois coach (lots of talk about that over past 1-2 months, long before axe fell on Groce) but I expect that he'll bring in some elite talent from St Louis and Chicago. Will be interesting to see his results ... don't expect him to be departing that job three years from now, since it is so close to his roots.

[tarcone]

A friend told me an Illinois stud recruit de-committed from the Illini and is looking at Mizzou because of Martin. A 6'11" stud?
Can anyone confirm?

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I think Martin has a chance to be pretty good at Mizzou. I had mixed feelings about him as a potential Illinois coach (lots of talk about that over past 1-2 months, long before axe fell on Groce) but I expect that he'll bring in some elite talent from St Louis and Chicago. Will be interesting to see his results ... don't expect him to be departing that job three years from now, since it is so close to his roots.

I think his career will mirror former Nevada, Stanford, LSU, and TCU coach, Trent Johnson.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by tarcone

A friend told me an Illinois stud recruit de-committed from the Illini and is looking at Mizzou because of Martin. A 6'11" stud?
Can anyone confirm?

Assuming you're talking about Jeremiah Tilman. Yes, he's another one of those players from East St. Louis that you can expect Martin will be trying to lure in with the coaching change at Illinois. I believe he was only a verbal, so he doesn't have to hang around to talk with the future coach like someone with a LOI might. Mizzou has absolutely nothing in the middle, so this would be a huge upgrade.

Rivals.com - Jeremiah Tilman

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Just an add-on to the previous post. Jamall Walker is the big key to Tilman. If Walker is hired by Mizzou (Walker will either stay at Illinois or go to Mizzou), Tilman will likely go to Mizzou.

[dawgfan]

A poster on the UW Scout boards that is the father of a current Pac-12 player had this to say about his interactions with Martin when his son was being recruited:

"Yes, that is true. Out of the 3 dozen coaches we had contacts with he was the one i disliked the most.

What told me a lot about him was that when (redacted) decided Cal wasnt going to be a good fit they went with the "(redacted) isnt good enough to be a Pac12 player" coming out of their camp when they talked with other coaches. Could never understand why they would do that to a kid

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

A poster on the UW Scout boards that is the father of a current Pac-12 player had this to say about his interactions with Martin when his son was being recruited:

"Yes, that is true. Out of the 3 dozen coaches we had contacts with he was the one i disliked the most.

What told me a lot about him was that when (redacted) decided Cal wasnt going to be a good fit they went with the "(redacted) isnt good enough to be a Pac12 player" coming out of their camp when they talked with other coaches. Could never understand why they would do that to a kid

I hate to tell that father, but that's relatively common. Coaches play up or play down the abilities of a kid all the time behind closed doors. I'd agree with the father, but that's not just Martin. That's the brutal sport of recruiting.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I hate to tell that father, but that's relatively common. Coaches play up or play down the abilities of a kid all the time behind closed doors. I'd agree with the father, but that's not just Martin. That's the brutal sport of recruiting.

Relatively common and not just Martin, yes. But don't skip over the part about interacting with several dozen coaches and coming away from the experience disliking Martin the most.

Different strokes for different folks of course, and he could be an outlier. But this guy is a straight-shooter on our boards, and I would figure Mizzou fans would want to know as much as they can about their new guy.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Relatively common and not just Martin, yes. But don't skip over the part about interacting with several dozen coaches and coming away from the experience disliking Martin the most.

Different strokes for different folks of course, and he could be an outlier. But this guy is a straight-shooter on our boards, and I would figure Mizzou fans would want to know as much as they can about their new guy.

Mizzou fans know plenty about Martin. He grew up in STL, coached in our state for three years and in our conference for three years. His three year stint on the west coast didn't change much of that.

Also, we had as nice a coach as you can have for the last three years. We saw how that worked out.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Jontay Porter has decommitted from Washington. One more domino falls, likely for Mizzou.

Jontay Porter‏ @JontayPorter

Due to the recent turn of events I've decided to reopen my recruitment!

[corbes]

Keatts to N.C. State

[wade moore]

As a CAA fan I have mixed feelings on this. Rising tides rise all ships and all, but Keats was making UNCW into quite the powerhouse.

The one thing I'd say is... I wonder if he could have held out for a better job.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by wade moore

As a CAA fan I have mixed feelings on this. Rising tides rise all ships and all, but Keats was making UNCW into quite the powerhouse.

The one thing I'd say is... I wonder if he could have held out for a better job.

Is it that bad of a job? I always thought Gottfried was horrible and he had 20+ win for 4 seasons.

[INDalltheway]

Cuonzo to Mizzou is a great fit. He's an awesome recruiter who was responsible for all of Purdue's best classes while an assistant. Several years back when Painter was flirting with the Mizzou job many would have been OK with it because Martin would have been the guy to take over. Obviously that didn't materialize, and I don't hate where the Boilermakers are currently.

[wade moore]

Exactly on Gottfried. 4 twenty win seasons in a row. Sweet Sixteen last year. Fired this year. It is a job with completely unrealistic expectations and a delusional fan base.

[wustin]

NCSU was 16-17 last year. I commend him on his first four years at state but he didn't do a good job at keeping up that level of consistency the last two years while being an amazing recruiter.

48-58 in conference play, all 6 years NC State was one of the worst defensive teams in the conference. This past season Gottfried rounded up the most talented group of guys NCSU has ever had since 2012. Ended up being one of the worst defenses in the nation (324th of 351 teams). Their best shot blocker in school history (with a 7'9 wingspan) puting on 50 lbs over the summer certainly did not help.

For the record NC State is my alma mater, you can call me delusional if you want. Dennis Smith was probably the most talented player the school has ever had since David Thompson and the team still somehow performed worse than last year.

edit: on the hire of Keatts, I don't really have an opinion. He was on the Louisville coaching staff when they won the championship and Pitino is one of the greatest defensive coaches in NCAA history. But that defense didn't seem to translate with UNCW so....

[JonInMiddleGA]

Happy to see that whiny bitch Boeheim finished for another year.
Even happier that it was Ole Miss that did it.

Not as much fun as it being UNCG would have been under the circumstances but still.

[Atocep]

Underwood to Illinois. Sounds like Oklahoma State is all in on football and wouldn't budge on his pay. Illinois more than doubled his salary.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Underwood to Illinois. Sounds like Oklahoma State is all in on football and wouldn't budge on his pay. Illinois more than doubled his salary.

This hire was really important to avoid losing their main recruit to Mizzou. Jamall Walker knows Underwood very well. This hire will likely keep Walker on the staff as an assistant and Tilman on board with Illinois rather than jumping to Mizzou.

[MrBug708]

Plus Underwood is a better coach

[muns]

Washington tabs Mike Hopkins from Syracuse to be their new head coach.

Washington Huskies hires Syracuse Orange assistant coach Mike Hopkins to replace Lorenzo Romar

Kind of surprised by this hire. When Jim was on suspension the cuse looked different.

Kirk how you feeling about this?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

This hire was really important to avoid losing their main recruit to Mizzou. Jamall Walker knows Underwood very well. This hire will likely keep Walker on the staff as an assistant and Tilman on board with Illinois rather than jumping to Mizzou.

Tilman had already signed his LOI. He wasn't going anywhere.

[molson]

I'm kind of glad Syracuse can open up their coaching search post-Boeheim and not be tied to this one guy with no head coaching experience. And hey, if Boeheim now sticks around another 4 years and Hopkins is the right guy maybe they can just get him back then.

Edit: It is very surprising though, it seemed like the peak time to lose Hopkins was 4-5 years ago when he was very well-regarded and there was no end in sight for Boeheim. Now though, Boeheim had a retirement date and Hopkins had that flat run as stand-in head coach.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Tilman had already signed his LOI. He wasn't going anywhere.

A LOI is almost never enforced when a coach is fired. Most universities ask all LOI signers to not look around until after they meet the head coach as a courtesy to the university, but as long as they do that, they are almost always released if they still want to go elsewhere after that. As I mentioned before the hiring, Tilman was going where Coach Walker went. If Walker wasn't retained as he was, he and Tilman were both going to Mizzou.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by muns

Washington tabs Mike Hopkins from Syracuse to be their new head coach.

Washington Huskies hires Syracuse Orange assistant coach Mike Hopkins to replace Lorenzo Romar

Kind of surprised by this hire. When Jim was on suspension the cuse looked different.

Kirk how you feeling about this?

He's not a splashy hire, that's for sure.

On the plus side, he appears to be highly regarded in the business and you could certainly do a lot worse than to learn from Boeheim. He also has a pretty good rep as a recruiter and has already indicated he'll retain Will Conroy on the Husky staff, so he's giving himself a good chance of keeping/building a strong connection with the local talent pipeline.

On the down side, he doesn't really have a track record as a head coach. I'm a little concerned that he's 100% Syracuse-bred - who else has he learned from besides Boeheim? If the "Syracuse System" he learned there doesn't work at Washington, can he adapt? He probably doesn't move the needle much with recruits out here just on his name, so he'd better be good in person and on the phone.

Clearly Jen Cohen had him very high on her list, and he must have done a great job selling himself and his vision. He's already made a good move retaining Conroy, and there are certainly examples of assistants succeeding at bigger jobs right off the bat without proving themselves at a smaller school first, so I'll choose to be optimistic.

I'm curious what ACC/Syracuse insiders have to say about him. I can't say I'm not a little disappointed that Cohen couldn't pull a home run like Marshall or Miller, but they were going to be extreme longshots. That she chose Hopkins over going with someone like Randy Bennett, T.J. Otzelberger, Leon Rice or Russell Turner is interesting - she clearly must think he's got a higher ceiling

[molson]

And Boeheim signs an extension beyond next season.

The team is trying to paint it as a response to the Hopkins move, but it's not hard to imagine Boeheim deciding he wanted to stay longer, and Hopkins understandably, after 21 years as an assistant, deciding to strike out on his own now, after turning down offers in the past.

So now the 2 schools I root for and have connections to have both lost coaches to Washington. So I like to see them do well and I'd love to see Hopkins have success there.

[Young Drachma]

Washington hire is so strange. I mean it's good they're finally hiring assistants for jobs again and not always going after retreads, but...it just seems like a strange move for a forever east coast guy with no real roots to the west coast, but maybe he sold them on his ability to hire assistants with roots and bringing east coast kids.

Guess we'll see.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

Washington hire is so strange. I mean it's good they're finally hiring assistants for jobs again and not always going after retreads, but...it just seems like a strange move for a forever east coast guy with no real roots to the west coast, but maybe he sold them on his ability to hire assistants with roots and bringing east coast kids.

Guess we'll see.

He's already retained Will Conroy to the staff so he's taken a hugely important step in trying to keep the program connected to the local talent pipeline. Rumors are he's also bringing in Jason Hart from USC, a guy he recruited and coached at Syracuse so he'll have a pretty good point person for SoCal recruiting as well as Tim O'Toole from Cal, a guy he coached with for a few years at Syracuse (presumably more of an X's and O's coach).

[Butter]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Tilman had already signed his LOI. He wasn't going anywhere.

Is it not pretty standard for schools to let kids out of their LOIs under the circumstances? I thought it was during coaching changes.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Butter

Is it not pretty standard for schools to let kids out of their LOIs under the circumstances? I thought it was during coaching changes.

With football it is. With basketball it's not a given.

[Neuqua]

@Indalltheway

Were you the @RWheeler that was referenced on Pardon My Take calling Dan Dakich "Jock itch?"

Only making that connection because he has the same name, and was a Purdue fan and so my head made a connection.

[Kodos]

I like Dan Dakich alright when he calls a game, but his show is awful.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Atocep

With football it is. With basketball it's not a given.

Really? Seems like the same reasons to not do it in football apply in basketball as well. It's a bad look when a school fires a coach but doesn't let the commits to that coach walk if they want to.

[INDalltheway]

Originally Posted by Neuqua

@Indalltheway

Were you the @RWheeler that was referenced on Pardon My Take calling Dan Dakich "Jock itch?"

Only making that connection because he has the same name, and was a Purdue fan and so my head made a connection.

That was me

[Young Drachma]

American Athletic Conference discussing Wichita State, other expansion options, according to report - Mid-Major Madness

Apparently, the American (AAC) thinking about expanding to a non-football school since Navy doesn't play in the league except for football, one more team would be ideal. Wichita State looks like it might be the team to make the move.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

Really? Seems like the same reasons to not do it in football apply in basketball as well. It's a bad look when a school fires a coach but doesn't let the commits to that coach walk if they want to.

It is. I'm not even sure which examples he's citing because it's extremely rare in basketball as long as the kid waits to meet the new coach first.