Who Should be NL MVP?

Sharpieman · 08-20-2003, 03:51 AM

Albert Pujols: HR: 34 RBI: 108 BA: .371 OBP: .438

Barry Bonds: HR: 38 RBI: 78 BA: .341 OBP: .520

After watching tonight's Giants game, I think Barry should win it. He's just amazing, the Giants lost 6 in a row and on the first night back Barry hits a home run to win the game in the 10th.

Quote of the week: "It's kinda like having an ugly girlfriend. You can put make-up on her or dress her up real nice but the fact is she's still ugly"- Patriots Offensive lineman Mike Compton when asked about the difference between astro-turf and the new field-turf.

IMetTrentGreen · 08-20-2003, 04:38 AM

having a .520 obp is obscene. he should be jailed for that. bonds, no question. st. louis can't even hold a lead in the worst division in the league

tucker342 · 08-20-2003, 06:34 AM

Tough choice... But that .520 obp puts Barry over the top, that's incredible. Of course if Pujols wins or even comes close to the triple crown than he would have to win(and he would deserve it).

oykib · 08-20-2003, 07:40 AM

The triple crown is nice. But Barry had a much more impressive triple last year: Batting Average, On Base Percentage, and Slugging Percentage.

The problem with giving Pujols the MVP based on the triple crown is that he still won't come close to Barry's OPS. I'd guess that every other triple crown winner was his league's leader in OPS. That would usually be the by-product of leading those three categories.

But Bonds is clearly the most valuable player in the league again this season. As great a season as Pujols is having, he's not even close. If Pujols were in the AL he'd be running away with the prize, though.

cuervo72 · 08-20-2003, 07:43 AM

The voters like stats like RBI and AVG though.

Katon · 08-20-2003, 08:00 AM

The Triple Crown has a nice reputation, but two of the stats (average and RBI's) are distinctly overrated. SLG and OBP (both of which Bonds is beating Pujols in) are more important. Anyway, the only way Pujols wins the Triple Crown is if Bonds gets injured or has a catastrophic slump, as there's no way Bonds loses a four-homer lead if he's playing at his normal level.

Pujols has been one of the top players in the majors this year; Bonds, as usual, has been THE top player in the majors.

MizzouRah · 08-20-2003, 08:06 AM

Depends, if Pujols helps take the Cardinals into the playoffs, he might have a chance. Although Bonds is sick, that guy could hit a bowling ball out of the stadium. I wonder if someone's going to pop him with a baseball next game? After posing for his gw hr? (He's still an a-hole)

Quote:

st. louis can't even hold a lead in the worst division in the league

Have you taken a look at all the injuries the Cardinals have had this year? Bitch about the Cubbies or the Astros who can't beat a injury plagued Cardinals team.

Todd

Butter · 08-20-2003, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MizzouRah
Have you taken a look at all the injuries the Cardinals have had this year? Bitch about the Cubbies or the Astros who can't beat a injury plagued Cardinals team.

Well, SOMEONE'S been beating them.

Bonds.

MrBug708 · 08-20-2003, 08:22 AM

Eric Gagne should throw a pitch at Bonds armor.

On that note, Gagne should be the MVP

cuervo72 · 08-20-2003, 08:25 AM

Gagne is having a great season, but...closers are overrated.

Hammer755 · 08-20-2003, 08:27 AM

Who should be the NL MVP? Bonds, hands down.
Who will win the NL MVP? Probably Pujols.

MizzouRah · 08-20-2003, 09:11 PM

Hammer,

I think you are assbackwards there.

Todd

sooner333 · 08-21-2003, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MizzouRah
Have you taken a look at all the injuries the Cardinals have had this year? Bitch about the Cubbies or the Astros who can't beat a injury plagued Cardinals team.

Maybe you haven't noticed, but the Giants have been pretty injury-ridden as well. In fact, Aurilia just got off the DL, Schmidt had been hurt, Reuter has yet to be activated, Durham is on the DL, and Snow is on the DL. Oh yeah, before he got traded, Ainsworth was also out for the season as well. This after Robb Nen never got a chance to play this year.

Anyway, I think you can look at the Cards and see Jim Edmonds, Scott Rolen, and hell, even J.D. Drew, and say "Wow, these guys are loaded" You take away Bonds from the equation, like Montreal, and you get a four-game sweep as Jeff Hammonds is playing LF and is also apparently good enough to bat sixth in the order because Nefei Perez and Yorvit Torrealba are in the lineup as well. Then look at the pitching the Giants have dealt with. There have been about 13 starting pitchers this year. The only constant to this over-achieving team has been Bonds' knack to get on base and produce runs.

Lets say you put Bonds out of the mix and put in an average LFer. The Giants would be a third place team at best and the Rockies would be giving them a run for their money. I'm not saying the Cards without Pujols would be just as good, but I don't think there would be the same impact as losing Barry.

Neuqua · 08-21-2003, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MizzouRah
Have you taken a look at all the injuries the Cardinals have had this year? Bitch about the Cubbies or the Astros who can't beat a injury plagued Cardinals team.

Todd

Whoa whoa whoa, at the beginning of the year the Cubs weren't even considered to be close to Houston and St. Louis in regards to talent. And we've had our share of injuries also with; Sammy going down for the month, Patterson going down for the year, and Wood missing starts.

MizzouRah · 08-21-2003, 09:00 PM

Good points sooner333, but Jimmy has been hurt, JD gets hurt every other day and has only played 1/3 (if that) of the season, and our pitching has been atrocious. Matty Mo has been injured, Izzy for most of the beginning of the season (we lost like 14 games in the 9th in his absence), and a few others here and there.

The Giants definitly don't have the depth at hitters as the Cardinals do, that's for sure, but Pujols has very similar numbers as Bonds does.

A Cardinals fan would say Pujols, a Giants fan Bonds, both are logical and I wouldn't be upset either way (unless Pujols wins the triple crown, which HR wise might be tough if Barry stays healthy).

My original gripe was about St. Louis can't hold a lead in the worst division in baseball comment. That's bs, besides Atlanta thus far, I would put the Cubbies, Astros, or Cardinals up against any other NL team in a 5 or 7 game series.

Todd

The_herd · 08-22-2003, 12:40 AM

Bond's changes the entire approach a pitcher takes in a game. No other player in baseball has the impact he has even when he's on the on-deck circle. Bonds is lucky to see 1 good pitch a night, but on the occasions he gets a good one, he hammer's it 9 out of 10 times.

Pujols doesn't have the impact Bonds does on a game when he's not at the plate, and for that reason I would have to say Bonds deserves the MVP.

TroyF · 08-22-2003, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MizzouRah
Good points sooner333, but Jimmy has been hurt, JD gets hurt every other day and has only played 1/3 (if that) of the season, and our pitching has been atrocious. Matty Mo has been injured, Izzy for most of the beginning of the season (we lost like 14 games in the 9th in his absence), and a few others here and there.

The Giants definitly don't have the depth at hitters as the Cardinals do, that's for sure, but Pujols has very similar numbers as Bonds does.

A Cardinals fan would say Pujols, a Giants fan Bonds, both are logical and I wouldn't be upset either way (unless Pujols wins the triple crown, which HR wise might be tough if Barry stays healthy).

My original gripe was about St. Louis can't hold a lead in the worst division in baseball comment. That's bs, besides Atlanta thus far, I would put the Cubbies, Astros, or Cardinals up against any other NL team in a 5 or 7 game series.

Todd

That might be stretching it a little. The Giants are 5-1 against the Cardinals and 2-1 against the Astros this year. They do have a losing record against the Cubs at 2-4. Arizona has also handled the Cards and Astros without problem. (again, a losing record against the Cubs)

Philadelphia? They are 12-3 against those three teams. Dodgers? 8-4.

I think the Central winner will have a very tough time getting out of the first round. If it's the Giants or Braves, they can kiss it good bye.

TroyF

mrskippy · 08-22-2003, 04:19 AM

I'd vote for Bonds. The guy never fails to impress.

MizzouRah · 08-22-2003, 08:13 AM

I'm not afraid of the Braves.

The Giants, well they've had our number recently.

Bonds time is now, I can wait for Pujols to earn some Bonds like respect from pitchers.

Todd

08-20-2003, 07:43 AM	#5
cuervo72 Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Maryland	The voters like stats like RBI and AVG though. __________________ null

08-20-2003, 08:25 AM	#10
cuervo72 Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Maryland	Gagne is having a great season, but...closers are overrated. __________________ null

08-20-2003, 08:27 AM	#11
Hammer755 High School Varsity Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Houston, TX	Who should be the NL MVP? Bonds, hands down. Who will win the NL MVP? Probably Pujols. __________________ I failed Signature 101 class.

08-22-2003, 12:40 AM	#16
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	Bond's changes the entire approach a pitcher takes in a game. No other player in baseball has the impact he has even when he's on the on-deck circle. Bonds is lucky to see 1 good pitch a night, but on the occasions he gets a good one, he hammer's it 9 out of 10 times. Pujols doesn't have the impact Bonds does on a game when he's not at the plate, and for that reason I would have to say Bonds deserves the MVP. __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

08-20-2003, 04:38 AM	#2
IMetTrentGreen College Prospect Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Austin, Texas	having a .520 obp is obscene. he should be jailed for that. bonds, no question. st. louis can't even hold a lead in the worst division in the league

08-20-2003, 06:34 AM	#3
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	Tough choice... But that .520 obp puts Barry over the top, that's incredible. Of course if Pujols wins or even comes close to the triple crown than he would have to win(and he would deserve it).

08-20-2003, 07:40 AM	#4
oykib College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	The triple crown is nice. But Barry had a much more impressive triple last year: Batting Average, On Base Percentage, and Slugging Percentage. The problem with giving Pujols the MVP based on the triple crown is that he still won't come close to Barry's OPS. I'd guess that every other triple crown winner was his league's leader in OPS. That would usually be the by-product of leading those three categories. But Bonds is clearly the most valuable player in the league again this season. As great a season as Pujols is having, he's not even close. If Pujols were in the AL he'd be running away with the prize, though.

08-20-2003, 08:00 AM	#6
Katon College Benchwarmer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Providence, RI	The Triple Crown has a nice reputation, but two of the stats (average and RBI's) are distinctly overrated. SLG and OBP (both of which Bonds is beating Pujols in) are more important. Anyway, the only way Pujols wins the Triple Crown is if Bonds gets injured or has a catastrophic slump, as there's no way Bonds loses a four-homer lead if he's playing at his normal level. Pujols has been one of the top players in the majors this year; Bonds, as usual, has been THE top player in the majors.

08-20-2003, 08:22 AM	#9
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	Eric Gagne should throw a pitch at Bonds armor. On that note, Gagne should be the MVP

08-20-2003, 09:11 PM	#12
MizzouRah Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Troy, Mo	Hammer, I think you are assbackwards there. Todd

08-21-2003, 09:00 PM	#15
MizzouRah Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Troy, Mo	Good points sooner333, but Jimmy has been hurt, JD gets hurt every other day and has only played 1/3 (if that) of the season, and our pitching has been atrocious. Matty Mo has been injured, Izzy for most of the beginning of the season (we lost like 14 games in the 9th in his absence), and a few others here and there. The Giants definitly don't have the depth at hitters as the Cardinals do, that's for sure, but Pujols has very similar numbers as Bonds does. A Cardinals fan would say Pujols, a Giants fan Bonds, both are logical and I wouldn't be upset either way (unless Pujols wins the triple crown, which HR wise might be tough if Barry stays healthy). My original gripe was about St. Louis can't hold a lead in the worst division in baseball comment. That's bs, besides Atlanta thus far, I would put the Cubbies, Astros, or Cardinals up against any other NL team in a 5 or 7 game series. Todd

08-22-2003, 04:19 AM	#18
mrskippy Banned Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: California	I'd vote for Bonds. The guy never fails to impress.

08-22-2003, 08:13 AM	#19
MizzouRah Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Troy, Mo	I'm not afraid of the Braves. The Giants, well they've had our number recently. Bonds time is now, I can wait for Pujols to earn some Bonds like respect from pitchers. Todd

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