Chronicle Of A Civilization (Civ4 Game)

[Ben E Lou]

First off, I've never attempted to do a report on a game like Civ, so I have no idea how this is going to go, nor am I sure exactly what I should report. However, I wanted to give this a shot. I guess the first thing to report would be...

GAME SETTINGS
MAP: Titled Axis
SIZE: Huge
CLIMATE: Temperate
SEA LEVEL: Random
ERA: Ancient
SPEED: Epic
LANDMASS SIZE: Random

All "Options" remain disabled as in default.
All "Victories" remain enabled as in default, with the exception of "Space Race", which is disabled.

I am playing at Noble level, with 7 AI civs. All 8 civs are random.

My thought on these settings is that they'll make early-game exploration important, as I won't start off knowing whether I'll be on a tiny island, a massive continent, or what in between. I also won't know who I'm up against until I encounter them. Using 8 civs on the largest map size should also give everyone some room to operate, but still place us in close enough proximity to see some wars happen.

[Ben E Lou]

CRADLE OF CIVILIZATION
I launch the game, and I am surprised to discover that I'm good ol' George Washington. My starting techs are fishin' and agriculture. George's traits are "financial" and "organized," meaning....

Financial

• +1 gold on plots with 2 gold
• double production speed of bank

Organized

• -50% civic upkeep
• double production speed of lighthouse, courthouse

My settler starts off on the coastline, at the mouth of a short (2-tile) river. With room to operate, my emphasis is going to be on growth, growth, growth. The plan is to look to grow my first city a bit, and also build new ones early.

I start off with a Warrior that is next to a goodie hut. My first move is to the hut, wherethe villiagers give me a map of the territory, revealing grassland then jungle to the south going down the coastline. Given the amount of jungle nearby, I'm thinking that I'm somewhere near the equator.

I found Washington, D.C. right where my settler started on grassland. The eight tiles around it break down as follows:

grassland: 1
plains: 1
coast: 1
forest/grassland: 2 (with silk in one of them)
forest/plains: 1
hills/grassland: 1
hills/grassland/forest: 1

This city should have great food/hammers/commerce. The outer squares also have strong economic and health ability: no desert, no tundra, no jungle. Nice! I begin work on a warrior (gonna use my current one for exploration), and research sailing, with the rationale that if I can see this much water near the middle of the map, there's probably a decent bit of it in this world. The warrior should take 11 turns, and sailing 18.

[Ben E Lou]

EARLY EXPLORATION
While awaiting my second warrior and sailing to complete, the first warrior explores. There's another river just to the east of D.C., stone just to the southwest. The river goes off into the blackness to the east and to the north, taking a 90-degree run two tiles east of my capitol. To the east of the river is forest and jungle, and to the west is a strip of grassland stretching 4 tiles northward. I explore along the river to the north, and see that it should provide well-balanced sites for at least two more cities, as there are hills off to the west. About 6 tiles north of D.C., I run into a goodie hut which gives me Mysticism. Nice!

While exploring northward, I meet my first fellow leader, Asoka of the Indian empire. Asoki\a is Spiritual and Organized, so I'd expect an inevitable rivalry in the land grabbing. I continue northward, still following the river. Man, the land near it looks GREAT! Lots of grassland, forests, jungles and hills. Further northward, I encounter Alexander of the Greeks. He's Philosophical and Aggressive, so I'd imagine I'll have to watch out for his military. I encounter his border, and it is 12 tiles north of D.C. I wonder if I'll need to make war with him to secure that river. Given that my path is blocked now along the river. I head back toward home, to explore the river off to the east. Before I get there, D.C. finishes the warrior. I decide to take a risk and use the new warrior to get a good start on exploring the river to the east, and begin work on a worker in D.C., which will take 18 turns to finish.

[Ben E Lou]

EXPLORING THE EASTERN BRANCH OF THE GREAT RIVER
As my warrior heads eastward from home, he discovers that the Great River branches as it heads into the jungle to the east. Considering that I've explored northward a good bit, I decide to check out the southernmost branch of the Great River. Meanwhile, we discover sailng, and are faced with the decision of what to research next. Given the fact that no one has founded Buddhism next, I'm guessing that no one started with Mysticism, so I decide to take the risk and research Meditation, hoping to get the first religion.

The south branch of the Great River reveals lots of jungle. Two dye resources are within around 7 tiles of D.C. to the southeast, and I also discover another goodie hut down there. I get 37 gold from it, on the same turn (3120B.C.) that my original warrior makes it home to D.C., protecting it once again. I fortify it there and continue on southward with my second warrior.

Unforunately, seven turns from getting meditaiton, Buddhism is founded in a distant land. I immediately switch to Polytheism (18 turns) and shoot for Hinduism.

The southern branch of the Great River finally ends in a mountainous area, where a panther attacks my warrior to no avail. Another river also starts in this range. I suspect that it is actually teh eastern branch of the Great River having turned southward again, but this branch also heads ever further to the east, so the warrior heads that way.

As he's going, Frederick of the German Empire makes contact with us. He's Philosophical and Creative, so I expect him to be a cultural giant. I continue exploring the Great River, which has now turned northward and is about 15 tiles due east of D.C. My worker finishes in D.C. I decide to build a lighthouse (23 turns), because the city is only at pop 2. I'll use the worker to help the city grow, and then when the lighthouse is done and ready to give me excess food, build a settler.

[Buccaneer]

grassland: 1
plains: 1
coast: 1
forest/grassland: 2 (with silk in one of them)
forest/plains: 1
hills/grassland: 1
hills/grassland/forest: 1

That's a really good spot for growth.

[Buccaneer]

Wait a minute. You're playing on a huge map and you already ran into 3 other civs early on? Do you think you got lucky (or unlucky) with the placement of so many other civs within 12 tiles of you?

[Neon_Chaos]

screen shots would be most helpful.

[Ben E Lou]

GROWIN' AND GETTIN' RELIGION
There's rice in the outer section of D.C.'s city square, so I build a farm on it to give extra health and food. My warrior continues exploration of the Great River, which has it now a little north of Washington. To the east of this portion of the river are plains, with jungle to the west. This branch appears to mirror the first branch that I explored, and it appears to be the primary boundary of the jungle in the center. That jungle is around 7-10 tiles wide, and at least 10-14 tiles north to south. I've still yet to see a desert or tundra square.

Finally, I see more sea off to the east. The continent I'm on is 15 tiles wide at Washington's latitude, and it widens a bit more to the north. If I can control and build cities along the Great River, I will be in very, very good shape. In fact, it is so long to the south and east, that I don't see the need to attempt an attack on the Greeks. It appears that no civs started out to the south or east of me. All I need to do is grow in that direction, I think, and I'll be good to go.

The farm finishes, but I can't get the health benefits until I build a road. Since I don't have The Wheel yet, no can do.

Woohoo! We're the first to get to Polytheism. Washington becomes the Holy City of Hinduism, and we convert. With the Great River running for such a long distance, I decide to eschew The Wheel for now, and research Mining, which should help with Production.

As we get to the end of the Great River to the east, we encounter German land. We may be racing him to the center of the board. Having found the east coast and the nearest civ on the other side of the jungle, I decide to bring my warrior back through the jungle and then home.

The lighthouse in Washington is completed, and the settler production begins as the city is at size 3. Gibbon completes his greatest work, the Most Powerful Civilizations of the World:

1. Unknown
2. ASoka the Great
3. Unknown
4. Frederick the Mediocre
5. Alexander the Puny
6. Unknown
7. Unknown
8. Ben E Lou the Forgotten

I vow that I will not be forgotten for long.

We finish Mining, and jump to Hunting. I'm going to need archery to defend soon, I'm sure. Meanwhile, we build our first mine at home.

The warrior gets back near home, revealing that what I had assumed was correct: a large jungle to our east, with the Great River running through it, north to south. Two branches are the eastern and western borders of the Vast Jungle, and a third runs north-and-south near the middle.


Archery is completed in 1475BC. I'm going to want to build plantations on many of those jungle resources along the river, so I push towards Calendar (Priesthood-Writing-Mathematics-Calendar).

My first settler was completed in 1500BC. I move it to the northeast, along the Great River, where I found Boston. The warrior that was exploring meets up with the settler and is fortified there. Regardless, I also decide to build an archer there for better defense. Also, my worker from D.C. moves into place to build a farm to the west of the river to help Boston grow during the 19 turns it will take to get an archer. D.C. also builds an archer, which should be ready in seven turns. D.C. will grow to size 4 before that, so another settler sounds like it will be in order soon.

As this segment closes, I enocounter Peter of the Russians, who is philosophical and expansive. Grrrrrrrrr. That should be a good combination on this map. Fortunately, he must be relatively far away from me.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

screen shots would be most helpful.

Heh. Was about to do just that. Here it is...

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Wait a minute. You're playing on a huge map and you already ran into 3 other civs early on? Do you think you got lucky (or unlucky) with the placement of so many other civs within 12 tiles of you?

Well, there's only one that I've seen within 12 tiles. I ran into other scouts in every case but the Greeks.

This is pretty consistent with my experience even with huge maps on Terra. My guess is that the map is very long top to bottom, and relatively skinny left to right. Probably all eight nations are on one big continent.

[Ben E Lou]

I'm heading to bed soon, but just so you know, the plan is to place my third city exactly five squares due east of D.C., to take full advantage of all that fresh water along the Great River.

[Coffee Warlord]

Holy jungle batman.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Well, there's only one that I've seen within 12 tiles. I ran into other scouts in every case but the Greeks.

This is pretty consistent with my experience even with huge maps on Terra. My guess is that the map is very long top to bottom, and relatively skinny left to right. Probably all eight nations are on one big continent.

Ah, understood. Do you accept peace with all of the civs you ran into?

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Ah, understood. Do you accept peace with all of the civs you ran into?

Yup. Considering my nearly-complete lack of a military, definitely.

Actually, the more my rivals roam the countryside, the fewer Barbarians I will have to face early on. I've had far more problems in the early game from the Barbarians than from the other civilizations.

That's it for tonight, but I'm sure I'll have at least a couple of hours of civving in the morning before I need to go to the office.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Holy jungle batman.

I TOLD you it was a big jungle.

[Ben E Lou]

EXPANDING, EXPLORING AND DIPLOMACY
This section begins at 1125 B.C. Judaism gets founded in a distant land on the first turn of the morning. Boston builds an archer without incident. Boston is at size 2 with growth in 8 turns at that point, so it begins work on a barracks and awaits growth again before turning out settlers. I send the warrior that was in Boston a little to the east into the jungle to help discourage Barbarian uprisings, and leave the archer fortified in Boston. Sure enough, I see my first Barbarian military unit a couple of turns later. I sent an archer to fortify at the position 5 tiles east of D.C. where I plan on placing my next city, and a Barbarian warrior appears out of the jungle near that unit. It unsuccessfully attacks my archer one turn before I finish up my settler in D.C. D.C. sets up a queue with barracks-archer-settler, which at the point of beginning is set to take a total of 32 turns. The settler moves east to rendevous with the archer and build Philadelphia

Peter approaches me offering Open Borders, and I accept. My plan is to accept all Open Borders for the purpose of trade in the early game.

As of 780 B.C., Lord McAuley's "The Most Cultures Civilizations Of The World."

1. unknown
2. Ben E Lou the Great
3. unknown
4. Frederick the Mediocre
5. Alexander the Puny
6. Asoka the Pathetic
7. unknown
8. Peter the Forgotten

Ugh! While waiting for my three barracks to finish, I notice a light pink border just tot he southeast of Washington, and due south of Philly, telling me that Asoka has build a city along the Great River right where I wanted to expand. This could well mean war. I'll have to see how much room I have to the north and east, but with Asoka being Organized, I'd imagine a move to grab land to the east along the river that I'll need to stop.

Mansa Musa of Mali, a Spiritual and Financial leader, makes contact with my warrior in the jungle to the east. Shortly thereafter, a Barbarian warrior heads toward Philly from the southeast. Considering the city was founded on a hill, has a fortified warrior, and has no improvements yet for it to pillage, I welcome the experience point help. Sure enough, it attacks Philly and allows a promotion to City Garrison one for my archer. Speaking of archers, D.C. finishes its improved archer from the barracks, which I send to the north along the coast. I'd like a second coastal city, and the archer fortifies in the first coastal forest square to the north and slightly west of D.C., awaiting a settler. While sitting there, Hatshepsuc of Egypt (Spiritual, Creative) makes contact with it.

Boston finishes its barracks, and is up to size 4, but only five turns from size 5. I decide to let it grow one more, so I set up an archer/settler queue. It'll be size 5 when it begins work on the settler. I enter the Classical era, finishing mathematics, in 280BC.

On the diplomacy front, the Russians wants us to cancel Open Borders with the Germans, but for now, that's a no. Washington finishes the settler, and I begin work on a library to help improve its 11 beakers. The settler heads to the northwest to build the planned city on the coast. The Greeks also want us to cancel Open Borders with the Germans. Considering that Germany is a decent distance away, on the other side of the jungle, and two more nearby nations have asked me to do it, I cancel it.

I finish the archer in Boston, and I move it toward another city along my southern border. Five tiles due east of Philly is the eastern branch of the Great River, a location with jungle, plains, forest and river. I move the archer down in that direction to stake out that spot. Meanwhile, the settler arrives at the spot to the north along the coast to build New York, which sparks my having to pay maintenance for the first time. Science gets lowered to 90%, and New York builds a lighthouse to take advantage of the water food resources. With the coastal connection, Hinduism gets spread there in one turn.

Philly finishes the barracks, and switches to library, primarily for the culture, considering that the Indian city is just to the south.

Apparently the AI knows that rivers are important. My archer arrives at the place I wanted for my next city, only to discover that it is now German land. I use the warrior that I also have in the jungle, and it also is right near German lands. It appears that Germany now controls most/all of the eastern branch of the Great River which borders the Vast Jungle. For a huge map with fewer nations than designed, I'm really hemmed in. There MUST be another continent, or at least decent-sized islands. Time to look to the seas!

[Ben E Lou]

Updated map...

[Ben E Lou]

RELIGION, THE RIVER, THE WORLD
Well, it turns out that the Great River runs northward directly through the Greek city of Sparta. Sparta gains Hinduism in 40AD. Having a city on the river with our Holy City religion could be a very nice boost, since so many cities appear to be on it.

Washington finishes its library, and I decide to build a galley, as I'd like to see if any islands or other continents can be reached in the early game by sea. On the same turn, New York finishes a lighthouse. The conversion of Sparta reveals that it is only 4 tiles from N.Y., so I'd love to get some culture going, and also work on religion, so work begins on a Hindu Temple in NY.

Boston finishes its settler, and moves to build another archer/settler combo. THe settler heads off to the northeast to an unclaimed spot along the Great River. The northeast is the only direction that is not blocked by another nation's borders.

Tacitus's Most Advanced Civilizations
1. MAnsa Musa the Glorious
2. Peter the Great
3. Alexander the Fine
4. Frederick the Mediocre
5. Hathepsut the Puny
6. Asoka the Pathetic
7. unknown
8. Ben E Lou the Forgotten.

I'm hoping this is a product of my tunnel vision towards Calendar, and will pick up as I work on the cheaper sciences. I'm 9 turns away from Calendar at the moment (220AD).

D.C. finishes the Galley, and can build the Oracle in 22 turns. Hmmmmm. With there being nothing else really to build now, I decide to go for it. I could use the gold if I don't finish it. The Galley explores along the coastline to the south.

The settler finds a spot on the river to the northeast and founds Atlanta, with the warrior as defense. I'm not terribly worried about Barbarians at this point, with the number of nearby Civs. I begin work on a library in the A-T-L.

I discover Calendar a couple of turns later, in 400AD, centering the World Map. Time to pick up the quick-to-discover techs such as masonry, animal husbandry, and the wheel. I go for Masonry first. The centering of the world map reveals that I'm on the southern end of the world. If this is a one-continent world, there's LOTS of land to the north, considering I've encountered seven of eight nations and the land I've seen so far is barely over 1/4 of the north-to-south axis of the map.

[Ben E Lou]

Zoomed-out view of the known world at this point.

[Ben E Lou]

WHAT LIES TO THE NORTH?
The Galley goes around the southern tip of the continent and heads northward to discover how big of a land mass we're on. A warrior from Qin Shi Huang (Industrious, Financial) makes contact with us on land, giving us access to all of our rivals. Hinduism spreads along the Great River to Munich, which turns out to tbe the German city that took over the sport I wanted east of Philly. Frederick soon thereafter fully converts to Hinduism. I'm thinking that religion is going to be my path to success...

The Oracle gets finished elsewhere, and I get 155 gold and switch to another galley. After finishing the cheaper techs mentioned above, we begin work on improving religion, especially the discovery of Monotheism. After Washington finishes the second Galley, I begin work on Aqueduct, as the city is unhealthy. On the same turn, Boston finishes its settler and begins work on a Hindu Temple. My best bet for another city on this continent appears to be to the northeast of Atlanta, so the settler and archer from Boston head off in that direction as the Galley explores the coast northward from D.C. The galley off the east coast discovers the Egyptians wayyyyyyy up to the north. They have a lot of room to expand, it would appear. On another front, the discovery of monotheism allows a switch to Organized Religion. Just a turn or two after finding Egypt, her cities begin acquiring Hinduism, and a few turns later, the entire nation converts to Hinduism. Nice!

I find a spot to the northeast of Atlanta to build Chicago, STILL along the same Great River. It is pretty close to Germany, so I immediately begin work on a library. Unless there is much open land to the far north, this could well be my last city on this continent. New York finishes its temple, and begins work on a monastery, as I'd like to send forth some missionaries.

Boston finishes its temple, but is having health problems (jungle). An aqueduct is begun there to help.

Continued water exploration reveals that this continent is probably the dominant area of the world, perhaps the only continent. It is probably double (maybe even triple) the width in the north than in the south. The four nations based up there (Egypt, Mali, Russia, China) should have a significant advantage on land area alone.

The Chinese and Greeks both cancel Open Borders with us. They're pissed because we refused to accept their state religions. Things are not looking good.

[Ben E Lou]

I WONDER IF I CAN GET A WONDER
In 820AD, D.C. begins work on the Hanging Gardens. I could really use the health boost. Hinduism is now second only to Buddhism in terms of influence (30%-20%). Boston finishes our first monastery, and begins work on a missionary in 930AD. We enter the medieval era in 940AD with the discovery of Theology. Hinduism continues to spread. By 950AD, it is up to 25% influence.

We make a nice trade with India, bringing us bronze working and currency in exchange for thelogy. That helps fill out our tech tree, but could create a rival for the Sistine Chapel. Meanwhile, I send a missionary toward the southern tip of the continent to spread Hinduism to Delhi, the Indian capitol. It gets there in 1030AD, and the One True Religion is spread further.

A German revolt takes place in Atlanta. Neither Atlanta nor Chicago look like they're going to remain mine for long. The former is 7% American, and the latter 2%. The German cultural influence may be too strong. I decide that the prudent thing to do is to gift those fledgling cities to the Germans and hope they'll love us in return.

D.C. finishes the Hanging Gardens in 1065 AD, and my little 4-city nation now begins to focus on growing its cities.

[Ben E Lou]

Do I have a chance?

[Ben E Lou]

RELIGION, SCIENCE, CULTURE
Yup, the above are going to be the keys for me if I'm to have any hope whatsoever in this one. I begin focusing on research and buildings to improve those three things.

At this point (1135AD), I'm going to start painting with not-quite-so-detailed strokes. In other words, I'm no longer going to report each building built or tech researched. I'll report directions I'm heading, wonders, great people, major diplomatic initiatives, great people, etc.

1155AD Most Advanced...
1. India
2. Egypt
3. Mali
4. Peter
5. Germany
6. America
7. China
8. Greece

[Ben E Lou]

THE BEGINNING OF THE END? (THE GREEKS INVADE)
Yes, in 1170 AD, the Greeks send five horse archers into American territory. I immediately ask the Germans to go to war with the Greeks, and they agree in exchange for Paper. This war is a short one. The details:

1170: Worker attacked and captured
1180: New York attacked and razed
1185: Switch to slavery completed in order to fast-build catapults.
1190: It doesn't matter. D.C. captured despite catapults.
1210: The Greeks capture the German city of Essen.
1230: The Greeks capture the German city of Atlanta.
1265: Frederick makes peace with Alexander.
1265: Alexander refuses to make peace with me, despite my offer of two techs.
1265: Knowing that I have no hope whatsoever at this point, I resign.

[Blade6119]

You call yourself an American?? Ha....great read skydog, hopefully another is to come after you kind of got shafted in land distribution

[Ben E Lou]

Postgame Comments:

1. Looking at the recap map, it looks like the Great River being so near me was a double-edged sword. Yes, the resources were nice, but the problem was that Greece, Germany and India all chose to grow directly towards me, due to the river, no doubt. In the northern end of the single continent, the nations grew not so unidirectionally, and therefore didn't have the level of overlap and conflict.

2. I grew to a second city right around the same time as the AI nations did, so that seemed about right.

3. I've won a game at this level before, so it is good to see me get crushed here, too. Nice!

4. Yeah, this game is dadgum good.

[Ben E Lou]

Oh....

5. I paid tribute to the Greeks more than once, but they hated our state religion. I guess if I'm near an aggressive civ in the future, I'll either build more units, or try to kiss up to him, religion-wise.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

D.C. finishes the Galley, and can build the Oracle in 22 turns. Hmmmmm. With there being nothing else really to build now, I decide to go for it. I could use the gold if I don't finish it.

I've been saying this a lot.

Don't think there was much you could do since you were so hemmed in. Same thing happened to me with the Indians... I tried to concentrate on culture to grow my tiles and possibly swallow nearby cities, and in the meantime Montezuma began attacking my 5 cities with about 4 units each, including horse archers, while I had just an archer and a warrior at each city with walls. That was over in a hurry.

Noble is very hard. I can't imagine even coming close to winning on a harder level right now, unless I got REALLY lucky.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Butter_of_69

Don't think there was much you could do since you were so hemmed in.

Considering I was playing a 12-nation map with only 8 nations, that fact was rather shocking. In fact, looking at the map as it played out on the whole, it would have been better suited for 6 civs, probably. Perhaps the sea level was high, and everyone being on the same continent no doubt was unlucky.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Considering I was playing a 12-nation map with only 8 nations, that fact was rather shocking. In fact, looking at the map as it played out on the whole, it would have been better suited for 6 civs, probably. Perhaps the sea level was high, and everyone being on the same continent no doubt was unlucky.

Dola:

I'll probably try again with the same settings starting this evening.

[Coffee Warlord]

The jungle + the fact that SO many nations were near you just killed you. It's utterly difficult to get a fast start with so much jungle to fight agains. Add that to the fact that Noble is well, hard, and yeah, I'm not surprised.

[Buccaneer]

Well, shoot, that was a quick read. Nice write-up, I think you did it just right for your first attempt at a dynasty.

Suggestion. Use Ctrl-I before Print Screen to minimize the UI so we can see more of the lands to the south.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Well, shoot, that was a quick read. Nice write-up, I think you did it just right for your first attempt at a dynasty.

Suggestion. Use Ctrl-I before Print Screen to minimize the UI so we can see more of the lands to the south.

I thought about that, but was wondering if it would be a little more important to see the mini-map to get a feel for the big picture. I may just do both next time. {shrug}

[Ksyrup]

Good read. I haven't visited this forum in months, but that was well done. I suck at this game, so I'm interested in reading how others set up their civs and how you go about the decision-making process.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

EXPANDING, EXPLORING AND DIPLOMACY
...Boston is at size 2 with growth in 8 turns at that point, so it begins work on a barracks and awaits growth again before turning out settlers...

i'm curious as to why you decided to build a barracks without the intent to follow it up with military units. It just seems if you're going to build a settler after your barracks are done, you'd be better of building the settler first so you can found a city while the barracks are being built.

Also, given you were in the midst of all that jungle, did you chop down any forests? I've found that in the early game chopping forests very quickly brings your units to completion - each one being worth 30 hammers I think. In that jungle you could have been cranking out workers and archers in 3 turns apiece.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

i'm curious as to why you decided to build a barracks without the intent to follow it up with military units. It just seems if you're going to build a settler after your barracks are done, you'd be better of building the settler first so you can found a city while the barracks are being built.

The thinking there was this: I'd need a barracks eventually, and I'd rather sit still for a few turns and let the city grow a bit more than have two smaller cities. Keep in mind that at the time I was thinking that I had plenty of room to expand.

Also, given you were in the midst of all that jungle, did you chop down any forests? I've found that in the early game chopping forests very quickly brings your units to completion - each one being worth 30 hammers I think. In that jungle you could have been cranking out workers and archers in 3 turns apiece.

Yeah, in retrospect, I should have gone after bronze working much, much earlier than I did in order to get those shields.

[Ksyrup]

I've found myself making a beeline for bronze working in each game I've started. Not only is it useful, but I also like to know where the copper and iron are so I can plan where my next cities should be placed or whose ass I need to kick to get to it.

[Toddzilla]

I'm actually kind of surprised how much benefit comes from "The Chop". I usually expect to a bit of wandering and such in the early game waiting for units to be built, but with the workers sending shields (not hammers, d'oh) back to your city every few turns, it is nice to have more units available quickly.

What are the drawbacks to clear-cutting?

(going to cross-post this in the main Civ4 thread)

[Buccaneer]

esp. being the American civ. If I recall after reading Vel's thread, an Industrious civ (which I believe America is one), you can get 75 hammers per chop with ____ (something).

[Celeval]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Oh....

5. I paid tribute to the Greeks more than once, but they hated our state religion. I guess if I'm near an aggressive civ in the future, I'll either build more units, or try to kiss up to him, religion-wise.

I've had success spreading my religion to a couple of his cities, and then diplomacing him into converting; rather than changing my religion to match.