Need some feedback on the next project (SimGolf-like)

[GoldenCrest Games]

One of the lessons I learned during the Desktop Dynasties football game project is that I needed to have a much better (and more detailed) plan for the game before I started hammering out code. Since I'm at the point of development where there isn't a lot of creative work that can be done outside code, it's probably a good time to start planning the next project.

I have a feel for what I'd like to project to be, but I'm interested in feedback on feature requests, ideas, gameplay mechanics, things to avoid... etc. Ideally, I'll have most of the game planned out before I start coding, and can reduce the development cycle to around 6-8 months. Getting feedback early is going to help me think through the plan.

The game is going could be considered a next-gen SimGolf. You would build and develop your golf course to compete with other course owners. Little AI golfers would play on the courses, train, enter tournaments, and give feedback just like SimGolf. You can develop your own golfer(s) to play the courses, also like in SimGolf.

How does it differ from SimGolf?

• Much less emphasis on the balance sheet. The focus of the game is not on the business side of running a golf course. Primarily, the game is about course design and golfer development. There will be a sort of earned progression that may end up being money needed to build the course, but there's not going to be any ongoing income/expenses management.
• More detailed golfer skills and development. Since a major part of the game is the career development of individual golfers, it needs to be detailed enough that they don't all end up seeming too similar. Plus, this feels like an area that lends itself to multiplayer.
• And of course, multiplayer. The one thing about SimGolf that felt like a missed opportunity, was multiplayer. I always changed the golfers to people I knew, and tried to get them into tournaments to compete against eachother. It worked to an extent, but was ultimately unsatisfying. Multiplayer tournaments just seem like a no-brainer for a golf game.

For graphics, I'd also like to step it up a notch. That other golf game I posted, Boss Golf, is a cool idea but it doesn't feel like an evolution. I also don't want to get too realistic, because that just kind of sucks the whimsy out of it.

I'm thinking of a visual style somewhere between:
SimGolf


and TPG




I'm definitely open to adding/removing/changing elements of the game at this point. I guess I'd really like to see how people feel, and what they would get excited about, before I dive headfirst into the project.

Thanks!

[Ramzavail]

When I think about the golf game that I want, I think about the 3 click swing and having some kind of career progression at a reasonable price point. Nothing on steam hits that mark and graphics don't mean much to me. If one of those old genesis games had career progression and was playable on Windows, I would play it non-stop.

I think there is a market out there for a good golf game that people can invest time in. The Sim element is an interesting one but I think a simple career progressing golf game is more marketable.

[jct32]

I loved SimGolf, I should see if I can get it running on my PC. I imagine it is freeware by now.

For me, I think if we are allowed to take control of a golfer then it should be more of a strategy based game where you pick your approach instead of basing it on clicks and aiming.

[GoldenCrest Games]

I'm planning on the golfers to be a slightly more in-depth version of the SimGolf players. You could actually create a golfer, and develop the skills so he turns into the type of golfer you want. (can't be perfect at everything!)

I'd love to hear some thoughts around the actual golfer gameplay. My initial plan is to have something closer to a single-click style than making the player perform the swing. You'd select the club, decide if you want to attempt a fade/draw, pick the aim point, and then you'd single-click to have the golfer make the swing. The actual success of the shot is going to be based on the golfer skills. I'm thinking I'd use some sort of visual feedback so you know where the shot is supposed to go. Maybe a line that traces the planned trajectory. I want to make it easy to plan the shot, but it always comes down the quality of your golfer to determine the success.

I also wanted to take the player's skill out of the shot success because I'm already going to develop the shot-making system for the AI golfers, so it makes sense to use the same system for the payer's golfer. I think it opens up a lot of possibilities for large multiplayer leagues/tournaments.

Thoughts?

[jct32]

I was even thinking less than that. No aiming involved, instead options like play it short, play it long, fade, draw, etc.

[NobodyHere]

Did the goldfish make it?

[corbes]

I don't know the exact terminology for this, but from a design standpoint, SimGolf needed about 4x as many grid points (or more!) for added resolution and more nuanced contours and playing angles...

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Ramzavail

When I think about the golf game that I want, I think about the 3 click swing and having some kind of career progression at a reasonable price point. Nothing on steam hits that mark and graphics don't mean much to me. If one of those old genesis games had career progression and was playable on Windows, I would play it non-stop.

I think there is a market out there for a good golf game that people can invest time in. The Sim element is an interesting one but I think a simple career progressing golf game is more marketable.

FWIW, I totally agree with this. Even it's sim golf like graphics to begin with, a realistic game in which you can build your career up from amateur to pro with control over your golfer on the course is a huge hole in the market today. The Tiger Woods series was awesome until they started micro-transactioning everything. Obviously those kind of graphics aren't reachable for an indie developer but still... even if the graphics are mediocre I think I'd play the hell out of that game.

In all honesty, seems like you want to remake Sim Golf but mash in a career mode, which doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me. Especially considering you can still buy the original on GOG for five bucks. Really that game was about the quirkiness and fun factor rather than any serious emphasis on course design and golf play.

[korme]

I never understood why there wasn't a great golf sim. Follow the careers of a whole tour of golfers.

[GoldenCrest Games]

I think you guys might be on to something here. This is probably a case where I was remembering playing SimGolf differently than I actually played it. Now that I think about it, the best part of that game for me was the golfing itself, rather than the course design. bhlloy kind of nailed it, too. I'm really talking about two different games here. One that's focused on course design and creating the best golf course, and one where you career-play a golfer.

The project makes a lot more sense if it's focused on one of those things, with the other thing as an expansion or as a separate game.

With that in mind, I'd probably focus on the golfer career-play game first and create a course design game some other day. I really want to recreate that experience of entering my golfer into tournaments against other user-created golfers. The golf course design part was just a way to get there, but it isn't really necessary.

It's funny how this stuff becomes so obvious once you start talking it out.