Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

What does this mean?

M.K.
Knight165

Spring Training has had the same issue since I began playing this game at 16, i'm 21 now and as of 2014 they made it even worse, by not programming the cpu to even make substitutions at all. They haven't even thought about fixing/improving it. I even own MLB 06 and I'm sure the AI is the same there if I bothered to look. No other sports title I play even has this issue with their preseasons, NHL, FIFA, Madden, NBA from all that I know all resemble some form of preseason and some games are more effective than others. Spring Training is too important a stage of the season for some teams/players to be (now fully) neglected. As I mentioned, they've for some reason decided to dumb it down even further on next gen. It shouldn't even take a forum of people to raise this issue, you would think it's gotten addressed already.

Rule of the day = If it's not important or popular enough (in their opinion) they'll remove it or ease it out from the game completely.

No reason to acknowledge it. Another misery loves company post.

do you play spring training, anyone who does has a reason to be miserable at times. but more to my point, this franchise has been making a series of "neglectful" decisions over the last couple of years. My criticism is warranted, not sour grapes, even though I know its daring to critique this franchise because it's easy to get blinded with what things they do provide.

[redsox4evur]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Spring Training has had the same issue since I began playing this game at 16, i'm 21 now and as of 2014 they made it even worse, by not programming the cpu to even make substitutions at all. They haven't even thought about fixing/improving it.

Ummm that's bull****. The devs have they have already fixed this issue for 15.

I have been informed that ST and AS games are now un-ruined. Thanks everyone for the heads up.

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Good for you then, by fixing do you mean restoring us with the same broken system spring training has been since the franchise launched? Or was there some reasonable overhaul made to give us a reasonable ST experience for the first time.

[redsox4evur]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Good for you then, by fixing do you mean restoring us with the same broken system spring training has been since the franchise launched? Or was there some reasonable overhaul made to give us a reasonable ST experience for the first time.

Here is the full conversation:

A question I really wanted answered by the AI Czar and still have not seen is AI CPU Sub logic in Spring Training and the All-Star Game? Worked fine till MLB 14. Was that tuned back to work as it did before? It basically ruined spring training (and the All-Star game).

Well, that's no good...let me ask.

I have been informed that ST and AS games are now un-ruined. Thanks everyone for the heads up.

So make whatever conclusions you want. But the substitution issue has been fixed in MLB 15.

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Here is the full conversation:






So make whatever conclusions you want. But the substitution issue has been fixed in MLB 15.

Based on the threads topic, we are seeking a reasonable spring training experience. I feel like they don't think that is important enough to give that to us, which they have unapologetically established a new pattern of doing. Stripping and easing elements out of the game they feel aren't valuable enough for them. I can understand the business side of what decisions they have to consider, but at the same now we have the issue of spring training remaining unimproved for almost a decade up to now and with no upgrade in sight, just one among other issues.

[Knight165]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Spring Training has had the same issue since I began playing this game at 16, i'm 21 now and as of 2014 they made it even worse, by not programming the cpu to even make substitutions at all. They haven't even thought about fixing/improving it. I even own MLB 06 and I'm sure the AI is the same there if I bothered to look. No other sports title I play even has this issue with their preseasons, NHL, FIFA, Madden, NBA from all that I know all resemble some form of preseason and some games are more effective than others. Spring Training is too important a stage of the season for some teams/players to be (now fully) neglected. As I mentioned, they've for some reason decided to dumb it down even further on next gen. It shouldn't even take a forum of people to raise this issue, you would think it's gotten addressed already.

Rule of the day = If it's not important or popular enough (in their opinion) they'll remove it or ease it out from the game completely.



do you play spring training, anyone who does has a reason to be miserable at times. but more to my point, this franchise has been making a series of "neglectful" decisions over the last couple of years. My criticism is warranted, not sour grapes, even though I know its daring to critique this franchise because it's easy to get blinded with what things they do provide.

Haha...okay.

Have a good day.


M.K.
Knight165

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Haha...okay.

Have a good day.


M.K.
Knight165

Maybe you've had a different spring training experience than the rest of us.

[Knight165]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Maybe you've had a different spring training experience than the rest of us.

In what respect?
That's a rather broad statement.

You mentioned....it's had the same issue since it's inception.
What issue is that?

You also mentioned that if they "don't care" about something...they remove it.
Can you elaborate? What have they removed that leads you to say this?

M.K.
Knight165

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

In what respect?
That's a rather broad statement.

You mentioned....it's had the same issue since it's inception.
What issue is that?

You also mentioned that if they "don't care" about something...they remove it.
Can you elaborate? What have they removed that leads you to say this?

M.K.
Knight165

Well I'm certainly not just making this up, I'm only echoing what I've seen written and posted on this forum alone by game officials. This philosophy of removing from the game what players might find important because it's not valuable to enough people.
That's a very narrow minded way of making decisions, for me.

Spring Training has always been pretty poor, with the least accurately managed AI I've played of any games preseason and remaining unimproved, unchanged every season. In the past, they did implement a certain position battle feature for ST to spice it up, only to remove for reasons I can only guess as to why. Spring Training, is almost dreadful to play while at the same inevitably it's one of the most important times of the year to nail down your 25 man roster or just evaluate players in general as the mode is intended. Seems not to be a death-defying thing to accomplish but remains ignored.

Spoiler

For anyone that's played one Spring Training game, AI issues are easy to spot, 25 man roster players get 75 to 100 percent of the playing time every day. CPU pitchers are programmed to start 3 innings, and following them their next teammate in the 5 man rotation (ie Strasburg, followed by Max Sherzer in the 4th, etc). No measure has even been introduced to handle tie ballgames and extra innings. Overall, it's poorly programmed and in 2014 it was severely neglected for next gen which I also find inexcusable.

It's been said here before, that their point of giving spring training to users was for them to basically selective have a month of games to play and learn the controls until they were tired of it and ready to play real games. That's a passable excuse back in 2006 but it's inexcusable now and has been for a long time. There's alot, obviously, that goes into the way Spring Training is managed in and out of games, and this series is no where near satisfying any of that.

At the same time, EANHL has had the deepest preseason options I've ever seen, FIFA and all other sports titles has put a reasonably good effort into preseason modes. Madden has always put effort into preseason, but baseball which has the most relevant preseason of any sport can't deliver.

[Jr.]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Well I'm certainly not just making this up, I'm only echoing what I've seen written and posted on this forum alone by game officials. This philosophy of removing from the game what players might find important because it's not valuable to enough people.
That's a very narrow minded way of making decisions, for me.

Spring Training has always been pretty poor, with the least accurately managed AI I've played of any games preseason and remaining unimproved, unchanged every season. In the past, they did implement a certain position battle feature for ST to spice it up, only to remove for reasons I can only guess as to why. Spring Training, is almost dreadful to play while at the same inevitably it's one of the most important times of the year to nail down your 25 man roster or just evaluate players in general as the mode is intended. Seems not to be a death-defying thing to accomplish but remains ignored.

Spoiler

For anyone that's played one Spring Training game, AI issues are easy to spot, 25 man roster players get 75 to 100 percent of the playing time every day. CPU pitchers are programmed to start 3 innings, and following them their next teammate in the 5 man rotation (ie Strasburg, followed by Max Sherzer in the 4th, etc). No measure has even been introduced to handle tie ballgames and extra innings. Overall, it's poorly programmed and in 2014 it was severely neglected for next gen which I also find inexcusable.

It's been said here before, that their point of giving spring training to users was for them to basically selective have a month of games to play and learn the controls until they were tired of it and ready to play real games. That's a passable excuse back in 2006 but it's inexcusable now and has been for a long time. There's alot, obviously, that goes into the way Spring Training is managed in and out of games, and this series is no where near satisfying any of that.

At the same time, EANHL has had the deepest preseason options I've ever seen, FIFA and all other sports titles has put a reasonably good effort into preseason modes. Madden has always put effort into preseason, but baseball which has the most relevant preseason of any sport can't deliver.

You didn't really answer his questions. People have stated the substitution issues are fixed (BTW, Madden has equally poor substitution issues in Pre-season and provides nothing substantial.. I haven't played FIFA or NHL).

You only mentioned position battles as something that was in and subsequently removed. If that's your only example.. one occurrence does not make a philosophy as you are claiming.

I certainly think Spring Training could be improved upon, but I seriously doubt they will remove it because some (maybe most) people don't play it.

[HozAndMoose]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

Well I'm certainly not just making this up, I'm only echoing what I've seen written and posted on this forum alone by game officials. This philosophy of removing from the game what players might find important because it's not valuable to enough people.
That's a very narrow minded way of making decisions, for me.

Spring Training has always been pretty poor, with the least accurately managed AI I've played of any games preseason and remaining unimproved, unchanged every season. In the past, they did implement a certain position battle feature for ST to spice it up, only to remove for reasons I can only guess as to why. Spring Training, is almost dreadful to play while at the same inevitably it's one of the most important times of the year to nail down your 25 man roster or just evaluate players in general as the mode is intended. Seems not to be a death-defying thing to accomplish but remains ignored.

Spoiler

For anyone that's played one Spring Training game, AI issues are easy to spot, 25 man roster players get 75 to 100 percent of the playing time every day. CPU pitchers are programmed to start 3 innings, and following them their next teammate in the 5 man rotation (ie Strasburg, followed by Max Sherzer in the 4th, etc). No measure has even been introduced to handle tie ballgames and extra innings. Overall, it's poorly programmed and in 2014 it was severely neglected for next gen which I also find inexcusable.

It's been said here before, that their point of giving spring training to users was for them to basically selective have a month of games to play and learn the controls until they were tired of it and ready to play real games. That's a passable excuse back in 2006 but it's inexcusable now and has been for a long time. There's alot, obviously, that goes into the way Spring Training is managed in and out of games, and this series is no where near satisfying any of that.

At the same time, EANHL has had the deepest preseason options I've ever seen, FIFA and all other sports titles has put a reasonably good effort into preseason modes. Madden has always put effort into preseason, but baseball which has the most relevant preseason of any sport can't deliver.

And yet you still didnt tell us what they have taken out of the game.

[mlblover15]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

because it costs money to license the individual ballparks.

The teams don't own the ballparks.

well if that is the case put in as many generic stadiums as needed to make it realistic. two stadiums per state is boring to say the least...

[@legendm0de]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

And yet you still didnt tell us what they have taken out of the game.

I'm surprised that I even need, that has been well documented over the last two months, even the spokesperson has come here and owned up to it.

You didn't really answer his questions. People have stated the substitution issues are fixed (BTW, Madden has equally poor substitution issues in Pre-season and provides nothing substantial.. I haven't played FIFA or NHL).

You only mentioned position battles as something that was in and subsequently removed. If that's your only example.. one occurrence does not make a philosophy as you are claiming.

I certainly think Spring Training could be improved upon, but I seriously doubt they will remove it because some (maybe most) people don't play it.

Again I'm surprised that you're asking what it is, I'm referring to as being removed from the game. Spring Training, which is the topic of this discussion, has never had anything in it to actually remove in the first place. I certainly wasn't referring to position battles as the crux of the problem, just an overview of their history with that mode. They did remove the little bit of CPU Intelligence they did possess completely from MLB 14 (ps4) so I was referring to that a little bit. Now we're supposed to be happy that, the same olde system of Spring Training at least has returned.

I haven't played madden since 2010 on a PS2, so all I really know is of their effort to make preseason somewhat relevant moreso than I've ever seen of MLB The Show. Anyhow, I was being mildly sarcastic suggesting they would scrap Spring Training because not enough players in the grand scheme even use it or care aside from some of us here presumably. But that is the same wisdom, they have admittedly used on this forum lately to explain why they have scrapped other facets of the game which are arguably even more important than Spring Training.

[Knight165]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

You didn't really answer his questions. People have stated the substitution issues are fixed (BTW, Madden has equally poor substitution issues in Pre-season and provides nothing substantial.. I haven't played FIFA or NHL).

You only mentioned position battles as something that was in and subsequently removed. If that's your only example.. one occurrence does not make a philosophy as you are claiming.

I certainly think Spring Training could be improved upon, but I seriously doubt they will remove it because some (maybe most) people don't play it.

As I suspected...he blowing smoke and blustering.
His "rule of the day" is BS......*never happened and that is NOT what Ramone said*
...and they did not REMOVE the CPU AI logic for swapping out players more in ST.....I can nearly guarantee that they just didn't "turn on" that logic in the ST and All-Star games and it got through testing. It was an oversight that he's trying to turn into a mountain(for other reasons my guess)

His point about the CPU(the game for that matter) not giving you access to your full organization is his only point that he's really right about but we've discussed that already so it's not earth shattering news.
As far as the CPU using mainly the 25 man roster....
1-You don't have to do that
2- Yes....we've covered that as something we'd like to see...but again...the CPU is going to choose it's top 25 players with set position parameters.....until they implement something that takes those last couple of spots and add in something that makes the CPU choose one or the other....it is kind of pointless right now.(something that YOU can still do as your team GM)

"dreadful" and "inexcusable"...c'mon that's a bit much.

-and not that it matters here....but I play all the games he mentioned....and I don't see what is better about those pre-season games. The decision making on those games is basically the same...pick the top players.

I have to ask.....how the heck does a young man who is 21 y.o. get so miserable over a video game?
Yikes.

M.K.
Knight165

[Jr.]

Re: Implementing a Better Spring Training in MLB: The Show

I'm surprised that I even need, that has been well documented over the last two months, even the spokesperson has come here and owned up to it.



Again I'm surprised that you're asking what it is, I'm referring to as being removed from the game. Spring Training, which is the topic of this discussion, has never had anything in it to actually remove in the first place. I certainly wasn't referring to position battles as the crux of the problem, just an overview of their history with that mode. They did remove the little bit of CPU Intelligence they did possess completely from MLB 14 (ps4) so I was referring to that a little bit. Now we're supposed to be happy that, the same olde system of Spring Training at least has returned.

So is the CPU substitution AI showing the "philosophy" of removing things that have been in the game?

You can be surprised that people are asking, but you still aren't mentioning what exactly has been removed. I can't remember anything of great significance that has been removed after being in the game, and I've been playing the game consistently since '10.

So please, enlighten those of us who do not know what you are referring to.