Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

[QuestGAV]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

PhilliesFan--

How are your games coming along with QuestGav's pitch edits?

I'm curious because I saw Willard's roster with pitch edits won't be out for another minimum 2-3 weeks and I didn't want to wait that long. So I am debating on whether I should do the inputs myself.

Keep in mind that it only tones down the problem, doesn't cure it. There are more than a handful of guys who really do have 12-15 MPH FB/CHG differentials and ~20 MPH FB/CB differentials that you're still going to struggle with. The CBs are easier to recognize of course. Ultimately I think SCEA has to give us a way to recognize changeups better, though I'm not sure how that would work without it being cheesy.

[SpritePuck]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

This is so tricky to me. If they make it easier then the only way to determine base hits vs contacts for outs is scripting it. Or we will all hit like .400.

As stated slowing down pitch speed helps. I can not hit on any level higher than All-Star. Which is fine my average and strike outnumbers are realistic. Walk numbers a bit low. Now GIDP numbers are dumb! But this is life.

In real life a pitch with break looks different. The spin makes the ball either look like a red ring is around it or a red dot in the center of it. This is caused by the spin and the laces. I am by no means a good enough hitter in real life to adjust in the time one has at the plate. But have stood in the box against AA pitchers and can tell (assuming I picked up the ball out of a pitchers hand) if it was a breaking ball or not. So, prior to swinging and missing, I knew I was going to swing and miss, because I was sitting fastball and new it was a curve but could never adjust my timiming fast enough to hit it. Change ups should have fastball spin and excluding the greatest pitchers, it is their arm motion that gives it away, also an indicator for curves. Again adjusting quick enough is the part that few can do. Thing is to hit a pitch over 90 mph you have to start to set up swing when ball is released, adjusting to a change usually means just foul it off and wait for something fast.

In softball it is the same when she releases a pitch you can see the rotation of the ball. Again adjusting to it is what is hard. Every high end camp has taught us that good mechanics and timing is all that matters in hitting. We are taught literally pick a pitch and sit and wait on it. If need because of count foul off anything else. Purposely foul it off. Because a change up or rise ball or curve when sitting fastball will be an out if hit in play, as the adjustment messes up your timing. Now, if your eye is good enough and hands are quick enough and mechanics just so, you can easily always get your pitch and hit it hard somewhere. Excluding that pitcher who holds a crystal ball in her mitt and knows what you are thinking and looking for.

Here is the issue with hitting in The Show. To make great pitchers great they are near impossible to hit. The arm motion is always identycal regardless of pitch. The ball looks the same out of pitchers hand. I watch it from release to plate and there is no way to see spin only break. Truth is in real life once you see a breaking ball break you missed it. This is why you have to pick up spin to hit at any high level of baseball or softball. Without a slight change in arm motion or any tells like seeing spin actual MLB hitters would wiff on changes like us gamers do. Not sure what they can do to improve this. If they put spin indication on the ball, they would have to exagerate it and many would say it looked unrealistic.... The better the game gets sometimes the more it feels impossible. But I imagine hitting Price's fastball or change would feel that way for us one and all and probably does for many MLB guys at times.

Good news is I strike out way less than I used to, walk way more and maybe someday I will have to play on a level above All-Star to keep stat lines realistic. Patience and waiting for your pitch in The Show is as important as real life. Get in an 0-2 count and you are gonna K but so it is in reality. Hitters counts are hugely important to success this year. I am certain there are rewards and penalties for contact depending on pitch count. Plus, get ahead and that crazy change, curveball or slider will not be thrown. Catch is playing on high enough difficulty that they throw enough balls to get ahead but where you can still hit... Hard balance to find my suggestion is changing pitch speed. Though I personally did nt and just practiced, and practiced more.

[SpritePuck]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

Also, I know a lot of peopld do pitch edits and use edited rosters... Not saying not to do this but when you change that stuff, you have changed what the stats will be. I have created players and used say a certain pitchers attributes and bumped one thing and it totally changed simmed results. Give Kershaw a few points more in velocity and things change crazy amounts. Just did this and simmed games to see affect. It was huge on stat lines.

[SpritePuck]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

Last thing that has worked for me in hitting the change. Sit on them early. Pitch confidence is very big. You may be way late or foul off fastballs but if looking for changes (only when it is a pitcher who uses them a lot) you can smash a few and they quit throwing them. If they have success with a pitch confidence goes up and you are going to get a lot of that pitch and it will be even harder to hit it.

[PhilliesFan13]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

PhilliesFan--

How are your games coming along with QuestGav's pitch edits?

I'm curious because I saw Willard's roster with pitch edits won't be out for another minimum 2-3 weeks and I didn't want to wait that long. So I am debating on whether I should do the inputs myself.

Here is how I have done through the first 14 games of my Phillies Franchise.

Vs. Red Sox
Won 7-1 (4 walks and 7 strikeouts)
Won 3-2 (8 walks and 6 strikeouts)
Lost 3-2 (7 walks and 6 strikeouts)

Vs. Nationals
Won 3-2 (5 walks and 8 strikeouts)
Lost 4-2 (3 walks and 10 strikeouts)
Lost 3-2 (5 walks anf 15 strikeouts)

@ Mets
Won 1-0 (4 walks and 21 strikeouts in 14 innings)
Won 4-3 (6 walks and 9 strikeouts)
Won 4-3 (2 walks and 8 strikeouts)

@ Nationals
Lost 9-3 (5 walks and 5 strikeouts)
Lost 4-1 (3 walks and 10 strikeouts)
Lost 4-3 (4 walks and 18 strikeouts)
Lost 1-0 ( 2 walks and 10 strikeouts)

Vs. Marlins
Lost 6-5 (8 walks and 11 strikeouts)

Obviously I can walk as I lead MLB so far with 66 walks. I am 29th in strikeouts with 144. Only 2 behind the Marlins at 146. Just a ridiculous number through 14 games.

My team batting average is dead last at .190. Last in doubles with 13, last in home runs with 5, last in RBI with 39, last in slugging % at .253, 28th in OBP at .288. Just awful.

My pitching has been decent however. 6th in ERA at 3.05, 6th in runs allowed with 45, 2nd in home runs allowed with 8, 2nd in base on balls allowed with 31, and 2nd in strikeouts with 139.

I play on All-Star for both hitting and pitching. Directional hitting and Classic pitching.

[SpritePuck]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

Obviously I can walk as I lead MLB so far with 66 walks. I am 29th in strikeouts with 144. Only 2 behind the Marlins at 146. Just a ridiculous number through 14 games.

My team batting average is dead last at .190. Last in doubles with 13, last in home runs with 5, last in RBI with 39, last in slugging % at .253, 28th in OBP at .288. Just awful.

My pitching has been decent however. 6th in ERA at 3.05, 6th in runs allowed with 45, 2nd in home runs allowed with 8, 2nd in base on balls allowed with 31, and 2nd in strikeouts with 139.

I play on All-Star for both hitting and pitching. Directional hitting and Classic pitching.

That is crazy. Your walk numbers are way higher than mine. But your OBP substantually lower which is head scratching. Of course 14 games is kinda a small sample but I bet you have had some rage games. It just makes no snense. You are taking pitches obviously.

Are the Phillies ranked really bad in contact? I do not recall them being way bad but am away from game.

On a bright side your pitching stats are awesome thus far. Sixth in runs allowed is sweet!

Facing the Nats so much stinks for sure. That rotation is not fun to face. Between them and Alanta that division is maybe the hardest to hit in.

Hope the bats come to life!

[PhilliesFan13]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

That is crazy. Your walk numbers are way higher than mine. But your OBP substantually lower which is head scratching. Of course 14 games is kinda a small sample but I bet you have had some rage games. It just makes no snense. You are taking pitches obviously.

Are the Phillies ranked really bad in contact? I do not recall them being way bad but am away from game.

On a bright side your pitching stats are awesome thus far. Sixth in runs allowed is sweet!

Facing the Nats so much stinks for sure. That rotation is not fun to face. Between them and Alanta that division is maybe the hardest to hit in.

Hope the bats come to life!

Here is the rankings for the Phillies in the game.

Contact - 20th
Power - 27th
Defense - 30th
Pitching - 19th
Speed - 26th
Overall - 28th

Oh yeah. I definitely take a lot of pitches, but it always feels like I either walk or strikeout.

That last series against the Nationals I faced Doug Fister, Max Scherzer, Stephen Strasburg and Jordan Zimmermann.

My last game against the Marlins was a real rager. Ended up taking a 4-3 lead in the 7th thanks to a Ryan Howard 2-run homer. Marlins tied it at 4 the next inning. Game went into extra innings and then with 2 outs in the top of the 10th I made a mistake pitch and Giancarlo Stanton murdered a ball for a 2-run homer to take a 6-5 lead. I scored 1 in the bottom of the 10th but then flew out with 2 outs and the tying run on 2nd. Brutal.

I don't want people to take my last few posts as being whiny. It's not that. It is honestly just frustration with the whole changeup stuff. It is a borderline superhuman pitch this year.

[SpritePuck]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

Here is the rankings for the Phillies in the game.

Contact - 20th
Power - 27th
Defense - 30th
Pitching - 19th
Speed - 26th
Overall - 28th

Oh yeah. I definitely take a lot of pitches, but it always feels like I either walk or strikeout.

That last series against the Nationals I faced Doug Fister, Max Scherzer, Stephen Strasburg and Jordan Zimmermann.

My last game against the Marlins was a real rager. Ended up taking a 4-3 lead in the 7th thanks to a Ryan Howard 2-run homer. Marlins tied it at 4 the next inning. Game went into extra innings and then with 2 outs in the top of the 10th I made a mistake pitch and Giancarlo Stanton murdered a ball for a 2-run homer to take a 6-5 lead. I scored 1 in the bottom of the 10th but then flew out with 2 outs and the tying run on 2nd. Brutal.

I don't want people to take my last few posts as being whiny. It's not that. It is honestly just frustration with the whole changeup stuff. It is a borderline superhuman pitch this year.

There contact is low but one still should be able to do at least what they really are capable of. The Phillies will not lead the MLB in K's this year.

I do not think you are whining. It would be insanely frustrating. i had a ten game hitting slump right before all-star break. I wonder if there are slumps programed in and you just got yours at the start which stinks big time. Maybe someone else can confirm if they did or did not have a noticable team slump.

I love the game so have not posted this before. As it is the best sports game I have ever played and do not wish create an issue that is not there. But in my opinion sometimes you are not going to hit safely regardless of what you do. Some pitcher ratings seem OP and for me at times they are unhittable regardless of my actions. Maybe a coincidence or my confidence or just rating related or maybe a slight scripting, that I have never noticed in past games. Example if you face an Ace early on who has been shelled say in his first start (not against you) so he has a 7.5 era or something crazy. He is going to throw like a complete game shutout and level that number out. I want in the early season to face teams with them having an era of 1 and hitting .475. Cause it seems to balance that way too, with me putting up six and them getting a couple singles. Now, once well into the season and these numbers have levelled out it seems that last few games are less influentual and more based on hot or cold streaks. Which early on it seems just a stat levelling thing.

Again I am probably wrong just what it felt like to me... If facing a team 0-5 get ready to be thumped. Now a team 25-48 seems to play out more normal.. All just my opinion.

[Chairman7w]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

I find it especially difficult to hit when it's thrown below the strike zone...

Yeah... that's kinda how Changeups work.

[Chairman7w]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

I just "Guess Pitch" Changeup low, and if it's not correct, I'm ready for something else. If I AM correct, I literally set the controller in my lap and let go. If I'm holding it I'll swing! LOL I just don't touch it. (shrug) It's not a perfect solution, but it helps.

[MLB14]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

I've hit change-ups very low in the zone 440 feet. I use zone hitting with guess pitch off on hall of fame.

This might've been a change-up..

https://youtu.be/-_fcwAPR-c0

[Ruffy]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

A great hitter once said...always look for the fastball and adjust to the breaking ball.

I use that approach in this game for me and it works well.

That said a fastball and change combo are the best two pitches in baseball...command both of these and you will be a star. Anyone with a young kid who pitches...teach them a good fastball change and they can ride that to college and likely avoid tommy john with throwing too many curves and sliders at a young age. Anyways...back to the issue at hand.

I am still using dynamic difficulty but I don't feel I strikeout too much based on the amount of change-ups......curious if most guys that are having issues are using quick counts?

I stay away from quick counts because I feel I just can't get into any flow or rhythm hitting like I can with the normal see all pitches in an AB gameplay.

[PhilliesFan13]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

I do play with Quick Counts.

[Mets7766]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

The biggest problem this year, is that even the 12th guy in the CPU bullpen is a combination of Sandy Koufax, Walter Johnson and Pedro, with a razor curve and a changeup that looks like it drops almost vertically when it hits home plate. Hitting is always a challenge in The Show, but usually, with some work, I can get the hang of it. This year, I'm about ready to throw up the white flag and move on to another game.

[therewillbechud]

Re: Okay, we have to talk about it. Changeups.

I play with straight all star timing hitting. I strike out about 5 times a game and walk about 3-4 times a game. I played for years with variable strike zone off, so this gave me a real good understanding of the official strike zone. It's far more unforgiving to play that way. I'm getting tons of calls on borderline pitches now that I definitely would've swung at before just out of fear. Now I have no fear if he wants to put one down and away, I take it, and more often than not it's some junk.

People are worried about striking out, and they're striking out more, that's what always happens.

It's easy to go up there and forget the fundamentals of hitting, but every AB:

1. wait for your pitch
2. hit your pitch right back at the pitchers head
3. the pitcher has to come to you, if he doesn't give you your pitch, don't give in to him. Yes you may have to swing to foul stuff off, if you hit one of those in play on a must swing pitch, bad luck. Just don't help him out by swinging when you don't have to at stuff you don't want to.
4. Situational Hitting!

The last is the toughest to remember, especially when you're handling 35-38 AB's a game. You'll have a lapse and swing at a 1-1 pitch low in the zone with a runner on first sometimes, but the most important thing is, did you know why that was a stupid swing? If so great, learn from it and move on.

If you keep all these in mind you will have success, I don't care what the pitcher is throwing at you. And you can read the changeup, out of the pitchers hand usually it has a slight rise to it, by the time you see it rise up and start to level out, you're already sitting back on it and ahead of the game. Some guys you do have to sit on the changeup, especially if he's "fell in love with it" which means you've probably already swung and missed it a half dozen to a dozen times. There's no shame and in doing that and fouling off the fastballs, then you're making the pitcher adjust to you again which is what you want him to do. Doing anything different is just being a doormat.