Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

[indcolts18288]

Ok so in real life Maddon bats Bryant in the 2 hole to give him more protection batting in front of Rizzo who's the best hitter on the team. Prevents teams from walking him, also allows Bryant to see better pitches. I bat Bryant in the clean up spot behind Rizzo. Still get decent results. And in the game Rizzo is doing very well for me. So if I should move Bryant into the 2 hole in front of Rizzo does the game recognize that Rizzo is a stud and the pitchers pitch to Bryant accordingly. After years of playing this game, I just kinda thought about this. And this doesn't have to be just about Bryant, Rizzo, and the Cubs I'm just talking in general but this is my example. Thanks for the replies.

[cts50]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

The manner in which pitchers will pitch to Kris Bryant will be determined by how good of a hitter Kris Bryant is.


Rizzo has little to do with it.

If you are swinging at crappy pitches, then the pitchers will pitch around Bryant.

If you make the pitcher throw strikes, then the pitches will throw strikes to Kris Bryant.


Same way it works in real life. Lineup protection is a myth.

[Fours]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

I don't think the game considers the next hitter in how they approach the batter.

The other benefit for the 2 hole is that when your leadoff hitter gets on base(usually a threat to steal), you will see more fastballs and less low breaking stuff to help the catcher out.

I expect they're using that to protect Bryant from being junkballed to death the way most young sluggers are.

[cts50]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

I don't think the game considers the next hitter in how they approach the batter.

The other benefit for the 2 hole is that when your leadoff hitter gets on base(usually a threat to steal), you will see more fastballs and less low breaking stuff to help the catcher out.

I expect they're using that to protect Bryant from being junkballed to death the way most young sluggers are.

No. They are just trying to get the most out of him. Soler was hitting there, got junkballed to death, and now hits 5th (most of the time).


If you are going to swing at crap, pitchers will throw you crap.

Lineup protection is a myth.

[Fours]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

No. They are just trying to get the most out of him. Soler was hitting there, got junkballed to death, and now hits 5th (most of the time).


If you are going to swing at crap, pitchers will throw you crap.

Lineup protection is a myth.

You're not wrong, you just seem to expect that lineup position/protection makes a bad hitter a good hitter..

It's a statistical fact that over the length of a season, a #2 hitter with see more fastballs than a 3,4, or 5 hitter if the leadoff hitter is a base stealing threat.

It's a statistical fact that when hitting before an elite run producer, you will see better pitches(less borderline strikes) than if you're hitting before a weaker hitter.

It doesn't mean you can hack like Soler and expect fastballs, if you hack at junk, the manager isn't going to waste the advantage of hitting 2nd or being protected on you for very long.

I've seen the myth argument laid out, and it's always based on Cabrera getting Fielder as protection, and not seeing more fastballs, or strikes. There are two huge problems with that - If being protected meant that Cabrera would see first pitch fastballs down the middle, he would have hit about 90 home runs, and the sabermetrics don't show how many times pitchers "gave in" with 3 balls to reduce the chance of a walk. They also fail to explain why Cabrera improved OBP, SLG, HR's, RBI's and his Intentional walks were down 40%.

[therewillbechud]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

The reason the Cubs hit Bryant second is because they bat the pitcher 8th and Russell is their de facto lead off man. Against lefties they bat Rizzo second. It's less about protecting a guy in the lineup and more about RBI opportunities, and Bryant has had plenty of those with the way Russell, Fowler and Rizzo all get on base.

If the Cubs played a more conventional lineup Rizzo would be batting 3rd and Bryant fourth the majority of the time most likely.

And let's not get too down on Soler at this point. He's got 54 strikeouts, and a .346 OBP, he's batting .273. Both those numbers are higher than anyone in the top 20 in strikeouts in the leagues besides Harper and Bryant. Pitchers are pitching him like he is an elite hitter, regardless of where he hits in the lineup. I believe he's pretty frustrated because of a poor RISP average. He's still a guy on the rise though, the pitchers are telling you that by giving him nothing to hit.

As for the game, I don't think it makes any difference in my experience. The CPU pitches guys based on their ratings and the situation. If there's a couple of guys on base for Bryant they'll start trying to find corners and nickle and dime you to death. If there's no one on base they'll be more inclined to challenge. Stars get pitched differently though and the game I don't think really recognizes Bryant as a star yet cause his OVR isn't high enough.

[therewillbechud]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

Edit: double post

[Fours]

Re: Is the game this smart? Where to bat Bryant...

And let's not get too down on Soler at this point. He's got 54 strikeouts, and a .346 OBP, he's batting .273. Both those numbers are higher than anyone in the top 20 in strikeouts in the leagues besides Harper and Bryant. Pitchers are pitching him like he is an elite hitter, regardless of where he hits in the lineup. I believe he's pretty frustrated because of a poor RISP average. He's still a guy on the rise though, the pitchers are telling you that by giving him nothing to hit.

Glad you pointed that out, you're right, "bad hitter" doesn't describe Soler, he's got great contact skills and power, he's just very undisciplined, and he's still trying to get by on pure talent.

When/if his recognition and approach catch up to his talent, he'll be a fastball murdering superstar.

For now, 5 or 6 is a good spot for him to get lower stress at bats, and not have him squeeze the juice out of the bat handle each time he takes a fastball for a strike.