Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

[cardinalbird5]

I am trying to do a video and test the differences. This is very difficult to do given all the the different variables. Difficulty, pitch confidence, pitch type, pitch velocity, and pitching interface all affect how easy it is to hit your spots consistently.

I am asking everyones opinions and what interface they use and difficulty they play on. I want to hear it from everyone please! I plan to do a video explaining the difference but I want to actually hear what everyone has to say what they believe does what.

This is for in game only and not sims.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Control would seem to be more important IMO
If you have a pitcher who has 5 pitches & control of 75 or better on all of them & then say a 50 on BB/9, I'd rather have him than a pitcher with 75 BB/9 and only a 50 control over each of his pitches.

[aarondmsu]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Control would seem to be more important IMO
If you have a pitcher who has 5 pitches & control of 75 or better on all of them & then say a 50 on BB/9, I'd rather have him than a pitcher with 75 BB/9 and only a 50 control over each of his pitches.

I agree with this. I don't feel like BB/9 has much of an effect. I know that it does affect the size of the PCI and how easy it is to throw a perfect pitch but I personally don't feel it having as much of an effect as the specific attributes related to each individual pitch, especially control.

[cardinalbird5]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

I agree with this. I don't feel like BB/9 has much of an effect. I know that it does affect the size of the PCI and how easy it is to throw a perfect pitch but I personally don't feel it having as much of an effect as the specific attributes related to each individual pitch, especially control.

It has no affect on the PCI size.

Although I do not know the exact difference. I do know that they both have an impact in game. For which ones do which...I am not sure so I was some of you guys could help me lol.

Also we have an old thread that sort of shed some light on this topic: http://www.operationsports.com/forum...man-games.html

[cardinalbird5]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Control would seem to be more important IMO
If you have a pitcher who has 5 pitches & control of 75 or better on all of them & then say a 50 on BB/9, I'd rather have him than a pitcher with 75 BB/9 and only a 50 control over each of his pitches.

Interesting. Do you pay attention to the attributes a lot and do you feel like you can tell a difference between the two?

My impression now is that one is the base for how easy it is to execute the interface and the other attribute modifies it. I originally thought that only one affects the pitching interface whereas the other affected the consistency.

For example, BB/9 may be the base for how easy it is to execute your pitch interface, however control may directly modify that. So like you said if you have a high bb/9 with all poor control then in general it will still be hard to hit your spots.

I think the case is usually for pitchers with high bb/9 is that they usually have good command on 1-2 pitches and maybe mediocre command on a few others.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Interesting. Do you pay attention to the attributes a lot and do you feel like you can tell a difference between the two?

No & no. I'm no expert on attributes by any means, but since BB/9 includes IBB,
I don't fret over that if it's not as high as some of the better pitchers around the league.
But if I'm trying to throw the ball outside the strikezone & I don't have good control, it's more likely to drift into the zone & then drift over the fence. I'd rather give up a couple walks than one HR.

[KBLover]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

I am asking everyones opinions and what interface they use and difficulty they play on. I want to hear it from everyone please! I plan to do a video explaining the difference but I want to actually hear what everyone has to say what they believe does what.

I use Classic on All-Star (tweaked sliders).

I notice a striking difference between, say, Boeve, my Marlins ace with 80's control and BB/9 and, basically any starter on my fantasy Rockies franchise as they all have very low BB/9 and Control. The biggest "offender" is Marmol with single-digit in both.

It's like night and day for me.

If I compare Boeve to Huff, my finesser with 70's BB/9 and Control, Huff is not as fine with his pitches. He gets by on changing speeds and hoping bad contact is put in play. I can paint corners all night with Boeve if he's on. With Huff...not happening. When he's on, his pitches don't get more accurate, they induce worse contact.

With Marmol - I don't even bother aiming. I just pick a pitch and throw. It will go God knows where and I just hope it's not middle of the plate or hitting the batter.

When these guys miss spots, Boeve tends to miss out of the zone or in the ballpark. If I'm aiming down/away, it might end up thigh-high/away instead of just below the knees and away. With Marmol, you can't tell because he's just that wild. With Huff, it's missing more towards the middle of the plate. Hope the batter was fooled on speed/movement somehow.

Walks - I hardly walk anyone with Boeve. I think he's at like 1.1 BB/9 (can't tell because of the zero'd stats in carryover). Huff's range is around 1-3 BB in around 7 innings of work. Marmol...well thank goodness he's a closer because it probably would be 10 BB/9. I mean another rookie reliever...Glasnow...walked 2 in 1.2 IP in his last game...he has 30's I believe in BB/9 and control.

Like I said, I use a less-than-default control/consistency slider (currently: 2/2), so perhaps I'm feeling differences that wouldn't be there on default.


So if I had to guess:

Control = did you miss?
BB/9 = how bad did you miss?

As for which is more important...I don't know, I seek out and value both. I want accurate pitchers but if they are "off" or as confidence wanes, I don't want them just start missing over the middle all game. It takes a LOT more to throw Boeve into "miss always over the middle" mode than it does, say, Severino or Yordano Ventura from my fantasy Rockies.

[WhiteBunny]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Maybe i'm wrong, but from my experience Control is the ability to put a ball in the strikezone while BB/9 is your command on the pitches. Confidence level for your pitches, visibile during gameplay, is a modifier.

[nomo17k]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Glancing over the thread cb5 cited, I noticed B Ma did confirm what I wrote there:



(That moment B Ma gives his thumb up... priceless. For everything else, there's Discover Card.)


I actually remembered asking this very question to B Ma, about the difference between BB9/Control, in one of the developer Twitch streams a year or two ago.

So (unless you are of type who believes in Developers' Grand Conspiracy), I think the question would be to how much degree Control of each pitch modifies BB/9.

I cannot really think of a decent way to test this without squandering time (i.e., accumulating stats), but the easiest to see, if the effect of BB/9 and Control is big enough, is to use the Pulse interface and observe (1) how the size of pulsing circle at the min/max radius changes and (2) how fast it pulsates.

I know for sure these change very noticeably with difficulty level (e.g., Beginner vs. Legend).

I also do remember at least BB/9 has a very noticeable difference in pulsing. With DD pitchers (of yore, when they could be almost fully customized), high/low BB/9 pitchers are very noticeable in Pulse size/speed. I never really tried to look for it, so I don't know how much Control modifies this.

[cardinalbird5]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Glancing over the thread cb5 cited, I noticed B Ma did confirm what I wrote there:



(That moment B Ma gives his thumb up... priceless. For everything else, there's Discover Card.)


I actually remembered asking this very question to B Ma, about the difference between BB9/Control, in one of the developer Twitch streams a year or two ago.

So (unless you are of type who believes in Developers' Grand Conspiracy), I think the question would be to how much degree Control of each pitch modifies BB/9.

I cannot really think of a decent way to test this without squandering time (i.e., accumulating stats), but the easiest to see, if the effect of BB/9 and Control is big enough, is to use the Pulse interface and observe (1) how the size of pulsing circle at the min/max radius changes and (2) how fast it pulsates.

I know for sure these change very noticeably with difficulty level (e.g., Beginner vs. Legend).

I also do remember at least BB/9 has a very noticeable difference in pulsing. With DD pitchers (of yore, when they could be almost fully customized), high/low BB/9 pitchers are very noticeable in Pulse size/speed. I never really tried to look for it, so I don't know how much Control modifies this.

Would you also agree that velo, break, and pitch type affect the pulse as well? I remember using a guy that only threw 90 mph in MLB 13 and his pulse was so small. I then would use guys that threw 99-102 with max BB/9 and it was more difficult to control.

Also, do you think primary pitches get a boost to control?
And what effects do you think pitch confidence has in game?

[nomo17k]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

Would you also agree that velo, break, and pitch type affect the pulse as well? I remember using a guy that only threw 90 mph in MLB 13 and his pulse was so small. I then would use guys that threw 99-102 with max BB/9 and it was more difficult to control.

Also, do you think primary pitches get a boost to control?
And what effects do you think pitch confidence has in game?

Of the three you mentioned (Speed, Break, and pitch type), I think pitch type definitely would... some pitches, e.g., curveball, is definitely harder to command so the pulsing may already take that into account. I doubt Break attribute by itself would though...

I'm not sure what "maxing out" you are talking about here, because with DD players there were often ceiling and it might have been that hard throwers were "capped" lower in BB/9/Control whereas finesse guys may have had higher cap in BB/9/Control?

I would not be surprised if higher Speed making BB/9/Control slightly worse, but I'm not sure. I don't know if that's enforced on the attribute level, or expressed through pitching interfaces that have the concept of "efforts" (i.e., trade-off between speed vs. command).

I don't know about primary pitches... it seems to affect the pitch usage (and not effectiveness) by CPU but that doesn't matter to HUM.

I think Pitch Confidence definitely would affect pulsing, as confidence in this game is a mechanism to influence pitch command.

[90Bamagrad]

Re: Which is more important for gameplay BB/9 or control?

First this comment is based on me using analog pitching. The only thing I do know is that control below 50 effects my ability to pitch, especially if I am pitching from the stretch. When its under 50 and Im in the stretch ion my push back up with the stick it is very very sensitive. On the feedback you see it looks like a very fast oscillating wave and my pitches go anywhere and everywhere. But once I get into the 50s that sensitivity goes away and I am able to control my up push on the stick better.

Now I am sure BB/9 has some effect who knows, but it has to be subtle and under the hood because its not as visible as the control one is, at-least for using analog.

Whatever the results I gotta say I love this type of info and really do appreciate the work that is put into it to help everybody.