SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

[redsox4evur]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

So where does user accountability come in when it's stated pretty clearly in the TOS what can or can't be done?

But then again it seems to be basic culture to blame anyone but themselves when they've done something wrong.

It's kind of like someone who continually overdraws their bank account and then blames the bank about the fees for allowing them to do so.

Also when this is posted about a week ago to remind everyone that you can get banned or suspended for doing this type of stuff.

Spoiler

Suspension and Banning Public Service Announcement

If a player is found cheating, exploiting, harassing other players, or breaking the rules in game or here on The Show Nation forums, we will suspend the account for a limited time or even permanently ban the ID and console.

This isn't new and we've always been on the lookout for these types of players, but it's important to remind the community of the potential consequences that may await players if they decide to travel down the dark path.

What can get you suspended or banned?
- Harassment
- Trolling
- Insulting
- Spamming
- Cheating
- Abusing exploits
- "Hostage" situations or "Griefing"
- Manipulating marketplace transactions
- Selling of in-game currency for real world currency

By participating in any of the points listed above, you are not only ruining the enjoyment of other players but also compromising a fair and balanced gameplay environment that we here at SDS are committed to maintain. This is unacceptable, and suspensions or bans are non-negotiable. Play fair and there won't be a problem.

Do you suspect someone of cheating or foul play?
Aside from using the in-game report tools, you may also email [email protected] with the details. Videos and screenshots are very helpful, so if it is possible, please include them. Please know that you will not likely get a response. This doesn't mean you're being ignored, but rather we are not obligated to speak openly about user account suspension/ bans. Also remember not everyone who disconnects, freezes, or "lags" is cheating. Connection "strength" depends on a lot of variables, and sometimes those variables don't all align.

[Jason_19]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Feel free to use me as example, SCEA, because you'll only expose your poor standards for this decision in doing so. I didn't knowingly do anything and I pay pretty close attention to my stubs. For all of you people accusing everyone of knowingly doing that, feel free to keep clinging to your false beliefs.

[Sandule]

In the video game world, you will NEVER win the "it's the company's fault for making an exploitable game" argument. You're about 15-20 years too late bro.

It does not matter if the company has glitches in the game. If you KNOWINGLY exploit them, then you (the player) are at fault and it's stealing.

I know from seeing this kind of thing all the time from games over the years that if you do find a glitch or loophole, you report it, you don't exploit it ..then blame the company for having glitches.

Why would I report a loophole. They don't pay me to test for bugs. Maybe some people like to work for free but I don't. If their testers can't find them that's SCEA's problem not mine. Corporations continuously exploit people and situations and they have no issues with it, in fact when they do it it's called competitive advantage! But when the tables are turned all of a sudden they start using the word criminal. I find it hilarious. I didn't personally use the exploit because I didn't know about it, but I paid money for a game and if that game I received has an exploit, then I will use it as that is what I paid for. Again, it's their fault, not mine.

[extremeskins04]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Why would I report a loophole. They don't pay me to test for bugs. Maybe some people like to work for free but I don't. If their testers can't find them that's SCEA's problem not mine. Corporations continuously exploit people and situations and they have no issues with it, in fact when they do it it's called competitive advantage! But when the tables are turned all of a sudden they start using the word criminal. I find it hilarious. I didn't personally use the exploit because I didn't know about it, but I paid money for a game and if that game I received has an exploit, then I will use it as that is what I paid for. Again, it's their fault, not mine.

It's not your job to find bugs, you're correct, but it's also called stealing or cheating when you knowingly exploit a loophole in a game.

So because you paid money for the game, if it has an exploit, then you'll use it because that's what you paid for? You can't just ignore the exploit or bug and play legitimately?

Your logic is insurmountably ridiculous man. Like I can't even....

[kehlis]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Feel free to use me as example, SCEA, because you'll only expose your poor standards for this decision in doing so. I didn't knowingly do anything and I pay pretty close attention to my stubs. For all of you people accusing everyone of knowingly doing that, feel free to keep clinging to your false beliefs.

You've been very contrite, honest, and understanding with your comments today..

It had to be hard seeing all the posts you've seen and very easy to get defensive about them but you haven't.

I think you have to understand that most of the negative posts you're seeing are with regards to the masses and not necessarily your specific scenario. The only posts I've seen specifically directed to you have been a resounding ideal that we all hope that if you were wronged, it will be righted.

The only posts I've made this evening have been with regards to people blaming SCEA for allowing the exploit to happen. To me that's a copout.


I truly both hope and expect that if mistakes were made they will be rectified.

[NKRDIBL]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Why would I report a loophole. They don't pay me to test for bugs. Maybe some people like to work for free but I don't. If their testers can't find them that's SCEA's problem not mine. Corporations continuously exploit people and situations and they have no issues with it, in fact when they do it it's called competitive advantage! But when the tables are turned all of a sudden they start using the word criminal. I find it hilarious. I didn't personally use the exploit because I didn't know about it, but I paid money for a game and if that game I received has an exploit, then I will use it as that is what I paid for. Again, it's their fault, not mine.

It's SDS's product. If you feel like they're taking advantage of you. Play a different game. Noone has a gun to your head.


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[oski96]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

In the video game world, you will NEVER win the "it's the company's fault for making an exploitable game" argument. You're about 15-20 years too late bro.

It does not matter if the company has glitches in the game. If you KNOWINGLY exploit them, then you (the player) are at fault and it's stealing.

Absolutely agree.

I know from seeing this kind of thing all the time from games over the years that if you do find a glitch or loophole, you report it, you don't exploit it ..then blame the company for having glitches.

You can't report something you don't know about.

[redsox4evur]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Absolutely agree.



You can't report something you don't know about.

So when a guy knows that he made a 60K order then after cancelling said order he now has 120K stubs he doesn't know that something is wrong with that? Right.

[oski96]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Really odd to claim a company has no accountability while absolving users who knowingly exploited a system.

It's really odd to claim that everyone banned "knowingly exploited a system" when you do not know any details of how they determined who was cheating.

If you claim to know, then tell me:

1. How did the exploit work.

2. How are you sure that it could not be accidentally triggered.

3. That, if the glitch could be accidentally triggered, that the sweep accounted for this.

* SDS says it is 100% sure its glitch cannot be accidentally triggered.

** Many credible posters that have been banned claimed they did not know of the exploit and did not intentionally trigger it. Most posters who prefer a witch hunt simply overlook that within thousands of transactions a few random stubs here and there are not going to be detected. It's not like we hire an accountant to keep a ledger of our stubs, etc.

*** According to SDS, only 1% of the "exploiters" got banned which is 1,500. That means 150,000 players intentionally used this exploit, yet not one of them ever posted about it. Of course, I say "intentionally" because SDS claims it is "100%" sure that the exploit can only be triggered "intentionally." Cardinalbird5 revealed that one of his friends was told a transaction for 200 stubs was in violation. Think about that. Are you telling me that anyone that had access to what they believed was an iron-clad exploit would pull a 200 stub transaction out of it? Silly. It seems pretty obvious the glitch had been triggered accidentally - yet, SDS refuses to acknowledge or believe it.

I think any rational view of this situation would include the simple fact that given the numbers, it is clear the exploit was triggered by tens of thousands or more people UNintentionally. I don't care how cynical you are, I am not going to believe for a minute that there are 150,000 users out there who would intentionally cheat (and have it remain quiet).

That is basically what SDS is saying - and I find that patently absurd.

[oski96]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

So when a guy knows that he made a 60K order then after cancelling said order he now has 120K stubs he doesn't know that something is wrong with that? Right.

If he KNOWS, then he knows. And I would say if we are talking about numbers that big, the only reasonable conclusion would be cheating.

If we are talking about someone who sets their orders in the morning on the PS4, then checks, cancels and resets later in the day at work, and then comes home later to play in the evening - and the values are not really significant ... I'd say you have a different scenario.

I can tell you that I always have a general idea of how many stubs I have (as well as my inventory) but I really wouldn't know +/- 5 - 10k. Its really not that easy to track when you make hundreds of transactions per day.

And yes, I made hundreds of transactions every day. I have made thousands of transactions and generally make enough to get 1.5 sets done each week.

Bottom line, your example of 60k and my example as given are basically hypotheticals at this point because SDS has not revealed much information as to what the infracting actions actually were and how much was taken. Per Ramon's twitters yesterday, one guy made 3 million over 30 transactions (obviously cheating), but another guy made 100k over 48 transactions - how can we be sure what that means without more information for that guy? If he had a transaction history like mine, you would be looking at one transaction ever 3 days for a few thousand - but in the meanwhile he is making 10x that by just trading. Doesn't make sense.

Also, what is 48? If you clear a slate of buy/sells and only 10 are buys - is that ONE instance, or is it 10? that basically means if a guy cleared his queue from a computer 5 times in 3 months, you are ready to run him out of town? I would not feel comfortable with that in light of the fact we lack context and information about this.

I am quite comfortable banning players that have all the telltale signs of exploiting - that is easy and i have posted them previously. It is obvious they are cheating, but it still requires an analysis of their transactions to make that call.

[NKRDIBL]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

It's really odd to claim that everyone banned "knowingly exploited a system" when you do not know any details of how they determined who was cheating.

If you claim to know, then tell me:

1. How did the exploit work.

2. How are you sure that it could not be accidentally triggered.

3. That, if the glitch could be accidentally triggered, that the sweep accounted for this.

Rumor is the glitch was deleted buy orders on your phone/tablet/pc then deleting them on your PS4 moment later. While the system didn't recognize the first delete. Double the stubs were returned into your account.

If that's the case. There is zero chance anyone would be doing this unwillingly. Unless you cam think of a way it would be an accident.

The "sweep" should be pretty strait forward. The game should code a time a buy order is placed. And should be giving an order number. If multiple receipts exist for that order number. I'm sure it would flag strait away.

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[redsox4evur]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Rumor is the glitch was deleted buy orders on your phone/tablet/pc then deleting them on your PS4 moment later. While the system didn't recognize the first delete. Double the stubs were returned into your account.

If that's the case. There is zero chance anyone would be doing this unwillingly. Unless you cam think of a way it would be an accident.

The "sweep" should be pretty strait forward. The game should code a time a buy order is placed. And should be giving an order number. If multiple receipts exist for that order number. I'm sure it would flag strait away.

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I have heard legit sounding excuses. One being that using the Community on TSN is slow and you are watching a game and the game finally finishes then you turn your system and cancel the order. Or maybe you think you didn't finish deleting the order on your phone and you do it again on your console.

[oski96]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

It's SDS's product. If you feel like they're taking advantage of you. Play a different game. Noone has a gun to your head.


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And nobody has a gun to SDS' head.

That is the point. The relationship between consumer and producer has to have some semblance of trust. Regardless of actions taken (or not taken) I cannot believe SDS has so little regard for its consumers that it takes the position, "Well, we don't have to since you don't have a gun to our head."

Instead, like any business intent on making money, SDS has a commitment to serving its customers. One of the important things it wants and the customer wants is to rid its game of cheaters. I think SDS had good intentions here, but its execution is way off the mark - to the point were it is deplorable: no transparency, arrogance in claiming its (ITS!) glitch can only be exploited intentionally; no forewarning about their glitch to the community (as if they were trying to entrap people - indeed, they have known of this glitch for weeks), no explanation as to how their sweep detects the purported cheaters, no opportunity for the banned player to explain him/herself in order to get an overturn or reduction OF A PERMANENT BAN.

I can't believe you would really think this is the hallmark of a well run business.

[oski96]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

Rumor is the glitch was deleted buy orders on your phone/tablet/pc then deleting them on your PS4 moment later. While the system didn't recognize the first delete. Double the stubs were returned into your account.

If that's the case. There is zero chance anyone would be doing this unwillingly. Unless you cam think of a way it would be an accident.

The "sweep" should be pretty strait forward. The game should code a time a buy order is placed. And should be giving an order number. If multiple receipts exist for that order number. I'm sure it would flag strait away.

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I appreciate your answer and I am sure this is consistent with what SDS has said.

However, and sadly, this is 100% incorrect. I know because I have never deleted orders from my computer and then done so on my PS4. I know that for a fact.

I do market orders from work and then later come home. Under your scenario, the glitch would not be triggered.

On weekends, i only use my computer when my son is on PS4 (otherwise, I do all trades from PS4 - since its way easier). If my son says he is done and I can play, I eventually go to the PS4, start the program and check my orders before playing a game.

Under your scenario, that would not trigger the glitch.

Yet, I have been banned. Many others have the same story as me. Some may be lying, but I would bet everything I own that not all of them are lying. In fact, I believe most are telling the truth.

Anyhow, the answer to the question lies in what I believe to be the false assumption that the glitch can only be triggered intentionally, and in one certain manner.

I believe the assumption is false, because I have never cleared my buy orders on computer or phone and then ran (I don't run anywhere, btw) to my PS4 to re-clear orders. I know that for a fact. You don't have to believe me, and it really doesn't matter if you do.

[NKRDIBL]

Re: SCEA Bans Many Players for Using Exploits in MLB The Show 16

I appreciate your answer and I am sure this is consistent with what SDS has said.

However, and sadly, this is 100% incorrect. I know because I have never deleted orders from my computer and then done so on my PS4. I know that for a fact.

I do market orders from work and then later come home. Under your scenario, the glitch would not be triggered.

On weekends, i only use my computer when my son is on PS4 (otherwise, I do all trades from PS4 - since its way easier). If my son says he is done and I can play, I eventually go to the PS4, start the program and check my orders before playing a game.

Under your scenario, that would not trigger the glitch.

Yet, I have been banned. Many others have the same story as me. Some may be lying, but I would bet everything I own that not all of them are lying. In fact, I believe most are telling the truth.

Anyhow, the answer to the question lies in what I believe to be the false assumption that the glitch can only be triggered intentionally, and in one certain manner.

I believe the assumption is false, because I have never cleared my buy orders on computer or phone and then ran (I don't run anywhere, btw) to my PS4 to re-clear orders. I know that for a fact. You don't have to believe me, and it really doesn't matter if you do.

This glitch could have been done on just a computer as well. It didn't need to be done by going back and fourth between devices.

And I've stated this before. Everything you and so many others are claiming to have done. I do the exact same thing. And I can still play. So something is different. I get there is frustration on not knowing what, but they don't owe you an explanation.

Instead of clamoring for answers. As I have also said before. Boycott the product. Let the world know the scam they're running (or whatever you may believe). Trying to plead your innocence isn't getting you anywhere. Not with the community and not with ramone.

And it's SDS's business. And the customer is not always right. The business has the product. Has the demand. They make the calls.

Maybe in the end they will admit this huge F up on there end. But if that's what you're holding out for, don't get your hopes up.

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