Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

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  • Padgoi
    Banned
    • Oct 2008
    • 1873

    #1

    Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

    I want this thread to only be about gameplay-specific issues that need to be addressed for this game to really take a leap in the realism department. Everyone says this is the most realistic representation of baseball to date in the video game world and they're right, but that really doesn't mean much if the competition isn't realistic at all. I play on Legend difficulty so my views may be a bit distorted as very few of you play on that difficulty, but here are the things that I really feel need to be addressed gameplay-wise for next year. Let me preface this by saying these are my opinions only:

    - Pop-ups: there are ENTIRELY too many pop-ups in this game. Every pitch in which contact is low on the ball results in an infield pop-up and this simply isn't realistic. There are almost no foul balls straight back or into the press box, which happen all the time in real baseball. The ball off the bat physics need to be addressed because, even though hit variety is better, it's still FAR from even close to realistic.

    - Ground balls down the line: Another ball off the bat issue. It's 2016 and we've been dealing with this issue for YEARS. Ground balls down the line are a double almost 100% of the time, and sometimes they result in triples. There is NO reason for a grounder down the line to be a single and there's no reason I should have to adjust default sliders so they are extra-base hits.

    - Strike Zone: high strikes at the letters simply aren't called very often anymore. Yes, they're called sometimes, but it's rare. The current strike zone that is actually called is closer to the bottom of the letters (and usually lower) on the uniform to the top of the kneecap. In the show, strikes are CONSTANTLY called higher than the letters.

    - Umpire Consistency: I understand umps make mistakes and I understand no umpire is 100% consistent, but most umpires are somewhat consistent and in the show, the umpires are deathly inconsistent. I can literally throw the exact same pitch in the exact same location twice in a row and have different calls and while this does happen in real life, it's not NEARLY as prevalent as it is in the game.

    - Predestined Games: No, I do not believe (anymore) in the concept of comeback AI or rubber-band AI, however there are certain games that feel like the CPU is pretty much saying, "you have no chance of winning this game" and this simply needs to be toned down. As an example, I was playing a game a few days ago in which the CPU scores 5 runs on the following: walk, bunt single, routine double play booted for error, 5 consecutive singles, another routine dp booted. And no, no one was playing out of position or even at a second position. Yes, errors happen. They just need to be a touch more realistic. Every single error that happens doesn't happen with runners in scoring position or lead to a rally. In the show, it almost always does.

    - Dribblers in front of the plate: Again a ball off the bat issue. How many dribblers are there hit in front of the plate in a normal game on average if you had to estimate? Maybe . . . 0.5 per game? So why do I average 3-4 per game? And yes, this is with sliders tweaked up the wazoo. This has to do with foul balls and the completely unrealistic ball physics of batted balls.

    - Passed Balls: When was the last time you saw a catcher take a fastball right down the middle off his facemask for a passed ball? Yes, catchers get crossed up. But they don't miss broadway fastballs that hit them in the face for passed balls. This happens at least once every other game.

    - Bunt singles: I had not one, not two, not three, but FOUR bunt singles in my last game alone. How often does a bunt single happen in real life? Bunts are still way over-powered.

    Please feel free to add to this list. Thanks.
  • EWRMETS
    All Star
    • Jul 2002
    • 7491

    #2
    Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

    I am sure the game is almost complete but fielding to me is the biggest problem.

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    • underdog13
      MVP
      • Apr 2012
      • 3222

      #3
      Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

      I agree on pop-ups and dribblers. There are just many pitches where the pci isn't that close and yet you still make contact. That needs to be toned down. Not enough swing and misses

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      • tnixen
        MVP
        • Oct 2011
        • 3184

        #4
        Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

        I agree with everything P.A.D said especially about the little dribblers in front of the plate I see these way too much.

        Gameplay really needs to be much more realistic!
        Last edited by tnixen; 10-19-2016, 04:15 PM.

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        • underdog13
          MVP
          • Apr 2012
          • 3222

          #5
          Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

          Also more foulballs that go behind home. More into the netting

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          • HighCmpPct
            Denny 3K
            • Oct 2011
            • 3589

            #6
            Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

            I think the ball physics need a bit more work. Specifically more slicing on liners, and to speak on the pop-ups a bit I believe that too many balls are gotten under to much too often altogether. To much hang, and too many high trajectory balls in play leading to most of the scoring coming via the homer.

            Also seems to be too much "friction" put on the ball by the ground. Both in the infield and outfield, seems that when the ball contacts the ground it really kills the momentum just to much.

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            • KBLover
              Hall Of Fame
              • Aug 2009
              • 12172

              #7
              Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

              I agree with most of the OP except for this:

              Originally posted by P.A.D.
              - Predestined Games:
              This might be something I don't see since as dramatically I don't play on Legend (and if so, it would confirm why I don't want to move up the difficulty but would rather make the CPU sliders harder if I need more challenge).

              I don't feel like the game is "predestined". I think what happens, at least with pitchers, is the impact of "good stuff" vs "bad stuff" is too pronounced. A 70 in /9's pitcher might pitch like 50's with bad stuff and 90's with good stuff. It's too drastic.

              I think it may create "game types". I remember seeing something like this in Madden where I can play the same game with the same sliders and it plays dramatically different. I've done it in The Show as well and noticed the same effect. I don't know if that's just the RNG-instead-of-physics aspect or if it's RNG + "game typing". The result wasn't "predestined" (I might win; I might lose. My team's play and my decisions still impacted the outcome) but how the game played out was very much different.

              That said, if I crush one with a 95 Power hitter, even on a "no carry day" it's gone. So I don't think it's "predetermined" as much as "influenced".

              I don't know about the errors because I don't get rallies on every error. Like I said, that could simply because I stay on All-Star.

              Same for the passed balls. I agree there's silly ones. I just don't see it nearly as much as every other game. That's crazy.


              Originally posted by P.A.D.
              Please feel free to add to this list. Thanks.

              I would add flyball trajectories. I think they are too high a lot of times, which leads, potentially, to pop-ups but even when they aren't, the trajectories turn a well-hit fly into an easy out.

              At first, I thought the flyballs are too "floaty" (i.e. they don't get impacted by gravity enough), but I think it might seemed that way because they go so high to begin with, leading to an increase in hang times.

              Actually, I think there's too much trajectory variation as it is. In the real game, trajectories don't vary that much. There's not so much chopper vs mortar shot flyball as it is the difference between a "low fly ball" that's on the border of LD vs FB or a "normal" flyball. The "normal" fly might carry out, the "low fly" drops down because it doesn't have the hang time.

              I think if trajectories were more confined to the more "regular" trajectories as opposed to the more extreme ones, hitting would feel better as would how the plays resolve.

              That and the overly slow fielding animations. Even if they kept the same ones and speed them all up, that probably would be better. I see plays in the real game that I think "couldn't happen on The Show because he'd still be like 'oh, yeah, I better get up and throw' ".
              Last edited by KBLover; 10-19-2016, 06:33 PM.
              "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

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              • Jr.
                Playgirl Coverboy
                • Feb 2003
                • 19171

                #8
                Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                I feel like a new animation system is needed at this point. There are too many animations that just don't work and are unrealistic. The slide animations are infuriating because of how slow they are, which causes outs when runners should be safe. Some of the fielding animations (which has been discussed extensively) need to be fixed. Catcher movement is really poorly done and looks very unnatural.

                I enjoy the game and play it very frequently, but the animation system is old and stale and needs to be completely rebuilt.
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                • Steven78
                  Banned
                  • Apr 2013
                  • 7240

                  #9
                  Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                  Infielder urgency.

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                  • Mike3207
                    MVP
                    • Apr 2009
                    • 4665

                    #10
                    Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                    Sim issue in RTTS. It only sims hitting appearances, meaning you have to play every game in RTTS to get credit for fielding and baserunning opportunities. That gets old fast.

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                    • NDAlum
                      ND
                      • Jun 2010
                      • 11453

                      #11
                      Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                      The double play animations are too fast and too perfect, resulting in too many DP's.

                      The fielding needs to just be refined and made more contextual.

                      Still need more hit variety and refine ball physics to be even better

                      High breaking pitches need to be punished and not called strikes
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                      • capa
                        Banned
                        • Jul 2002
                        • 5321

                        #12
                        Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                        Outfielder urgency.

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                        • KBLover
                          Hall Of Fame
                          • Aug 2009
                          • 12172

                          #13
                          Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                          Too many balls going right at fielders, especially ground balls and line drives. That decreases how many hits come from LD. In the real game, a LD is hit about 70% of the time, even if it's a slow velocity (for a line drive).

                          A lot of times, I see a lot of hard hit grounders go right to the 2B/SS on 1 hop that happens just short of the infield dirt. So that's a DP waiting to happen, barring an error. I think that's the other half of why DPs are too often. Too many balls are tailor-made for DPs. It's like the animation of the ball playing out is only to visually show what the hitting engine has determined. If that's not what's happening, it's what it looks like with some of these plays. There shouldn't be any determination except batted ball direction, angle/trajectory, and velocity.

                          For the talk of GIDPs being too perfect, when there is a mistake, it's almost always the dropped transfer throw. Having more realistic mistakes would be nice. If that falls under needing new animations - then cool need more animations for various situations. I believe it was MLB15 where throws sometimes pulled the 2B off the bag (though it seemed to be only with the 2B for some reason).

                          Though some animations need to die.

                          No more double clutches, please. Do away with 'preload at X time or else you get unrealistic animation'. Instead, if the preload is too late, then all that happens is no catch-and-throw in one motion. The player might pull up to throw and then have to wind up and throw as he's lost his momentum charging up to the ball. Don't have the preload "early but not early enough" so then "you get the double clutch". Assuming that's actually the issue because if the CPU can't do it right (they get double clutches too), then...I don't know.

                          And if it's an attempt to express throwing ratings - then express it on the throw, not make a double clutch because "it's a throw he can't make". If it's too short or whatever then that's where everyone on the field needs to react realistically to the ball.

                          Can we finally get rid of the do push-ups on the wall when 10-15 feet away? So frustrating to watch a fielder break down, field a ball, then jog three or four steps to do a push-up off the wall since I've preloaded a throw. Or sometimes I wait to throw until he's slowing himself down and then when I hit the throw button, he'll then go to the wall and push-up - as if that's what the button is for. Why?

                          Yet, if he's charging to make a catch near the line, he'll catch and then bump up against the wall with no brace or collision. Why? Why is it just forced with throwing situations? Why is it in at all?
                          Last edited by KBLover; 10-20-2016, 11:59 AM.
                          "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

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                          • Padgoi
                            Banned
                            • Oct 2008
                            • 1873

                            #14
                            Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                            Well said, KB.


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                            • Comduklakis
                              MVP
                              • Oct 2005
                              • 1887

                              #15
                              Re: Gameplay only issues that need to be addressed for next year

                              agree with most of the OP's post.

                              1. Ball physics are big. Along with fielding (particulary urgency which has been mentioned several times) it's the biggest game issue. Too many dribblers, ball holds up in the air for too long. Too many up the chute pop ups to the catcher.

                              2. Fielding. More urgency. Charge the ball. Don't let slow animations result in hits back to the pitcher or on routine groundballs to the SS

                              3. agree with the double clutches. I lose time on throws due to that.

                              4. end the baserunner "knowing" the throw is going offline or to the wrong base. Every time I see a baserunne (CPU or mine) make a questionable decision to go for an extra base, I'm 99% sure the throw will be offline. Runners shouldn't know this.

                              5. Don't suck my OFs into the wall.
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