MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

[BillPeener]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

We'll just have to agree to disagree and move on.

No, sir. You are not allowed to get away with that. You can't just do a drive-by-insult using fallacies and then say "let's just agree to disagree".

I'm not saying that programming the way a jersey moves in the wind, reacts to environments, etc is the easy part. I'm saying that fixing an incorrect sleeve color would be infinitely easier than reprogramming a logic component. The underlying 1's and 0's part, sure, it's more difficult, but not correcting it post release.

What evidence do you have that it's not difficult to add a new sleeve or update an old one post-release?

What evidence do you have that this difficulty is "infinitely" easier than reprogramming a logic component?

Unless I'm just remembering that incorrectly.

You're right - that's how MVP did it.

Maybe memory space wasn't the only aspect of it(I'm sure it wasn't) but it was definitely a limiting factor.

Now you're moving the goal posts, saying that memory space was but one factor. Setting aside that you haven't even proved that the Xbox / PS2 didn't have enough memory to add official accessories, it's a trivial issue.

My point was that one of the major reasons why games a generation ago had franchise logic - contracts, trades, player progression - and not Adidas batting gloves - is because coding logic that's entirely unrelated to the graphics / physics engine was doable on a computer made in 1990. What I'm saying is that these graphic upgrades are unnecessary thrills. It never breaks the game if your player doesn't have his Nike socks. It does break the game if you can't offer contract extensions mid-season, causing your players to see drops in morale and thus lower player ratings. My experience while playing the game is worsened far more from unnecessarily, unrealistically low player ratings than from not having the Nike socks I hardly notice.

Programming/Coding is a mindset. Programming is hard, it's complicated.
You have to think in a different manner. I respect your opinion and all, but it appears there are things that you just won't understand about coding/programming. Programming is hard, it's complicated.

Who are you talking to? What are you trying to teach anybody? For all the non-programmers out there, I guess you've successfully convinced them that programming is hard, except for when it's just visual stuff.

[SmashMan]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

No, sir. You are not allowed to get away with that. You can't just do a drive-by-insult using fallacies and then say "let's just agree to disagree".

Based on the totality of your post, I feel it necessary to remind everyone that the significant majority of programmers are not good programmers.

[p00p1]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

They have artists who work on uniforms, stadiums, etc. They have other programmers who work on the modes/gameplay. You can't just take one of the artists off uniforms and say, go work on franchise contracts.

[BillPeener]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

They have artists who work on uniforms, stadiums, etc. They have other programmers who work on the modes/gameplay. You can't just take one of the artists off uniforms and say, go work on franchise contracts.

Interesting factoid. Thanks for sharing.

[Mav3rek7]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

No, sir. You are not allowed to get away with that. You can't just do a drive-by-insult using fallacies and then say "let's just agree to disagree".

I wasn't insulting you. Sorry you felt that way.

What evidence do you have that it's not difficult to add a new sleeve or update an old one post-release?

What evidence do you have that this difficulty is "infinitely" easier than reprogramming a logic component?

Evidence..

Let's take MVP 2005 for example, PC version. If I wanted to, oh I don't know, change the way a jersey looks. Do you know what I had to do? Download the .psd template from mvpmods.com, put the colors I want on top of what's already there, import it into the game, and boom! Done. Simple. Quick/Easy fix graphic fix. Takes all of 10 minutes.

Now you're moving the goal posts, saying that memory space was but one factor. Setting aside that you haven't even proved that the Xbox / PS2 didn't have enough memory to add official accessories, it's a trivial issue.

My point was that one of the major reasons why games a generation ago had franchise logic - contracts, trades, player progression - and not Adidas batting gloves - is because coding logic that's entirely unrelated to the graphics / physics engine was doable on a computer made in 1990. What I'm saying is that these graphic upgrades are unnecessary thrills. It never breaks the game if your player doesn't have his Nike socks. It does break the game if you can't offer contract extensions mid-season, causing your players to see drops in morale and thus lower player ratings. My experience while playing the game is worsened far more from unnecessarily, unrealistically low player ratings than from not having the Nike socks I hardly notice.

Not moving anything. Was actually agreeing with you that there was more to it than just memory capacity issues.

And for some, having in season contract extensions doesn't break the game for them, but not having Nike socks does. Your argument is only pertinent to you and people who feel it's broken because of this as well. It can go both ways.

Who are you talking to? What are you trying to teach anybody? For all the non-programmers out there, I guess you've successfully convinced them that programming is hard, except for when it's just visual stuff.

You... I'm talking to you. All I've tried to explain since the first post was that it's not as simple as you believe it to be and that putting out a quick patch that changes a jersey sleeve is easier than reprogramming something that alters logic.

[loganmorrison1]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Not sure if it was mentioned, but seems as though the patch screwed up the stadium music, hardly hear any rally music now


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[BillPeener]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Let's take MVP 2005 for example, PC version. If I wanted to, oh I don't know, change the way a jersey looks. Do you know what I had to do? Download the .psd template from mvpmods.com, put the colors I want on top of what's already there, import it into the game, and boom! Done. Simple. Quick/Easy fix graphic fix. Takes all of 10 minutes.

I was talking about Show '17. What evidence do you have that it's not difficult to add a new sleeve or update an old one post-release in '17? What evidence do you have that this difficulty is "infinitely" easier than reprogramming a logic component in '17?

And for some, having in season contract extensions doesn't break the game for them, but not having Nike socks does. Your argument is only pertinent to you and people who feel it's broken because of this as well. It can go both ways.

You're right. I'm starting to get the impression that this game wasn't made for me, and I'm wasting my time. Sad considering there's no alternative. I guess the developers don't feel like my $60 is worth as much as the Nike sock guy.

You... I'm talking to you. All I've tried to explain since the first post was that it's not as simple as you believe it to be and that putting out a quick patch that changes a jersey sleeve is easier than reprogramming something that alters logic.

When you have some evidence for any of your claims, let me know.

EDIT: I should note that your last point is a straw man. I never claimed this is a matter of fixing contract logic vs releasing a quick patch that fixes one sleeve. I was talking about development in general, either for '17, its patches, '18, or beyond. I want the contract issue fixed, whether that be tomorrow, next month, or next year. I'm not saying they shouldn't patch a sleeve and instead should patch contracts. I'm saying they need to re-evaluate their priorities when developing the game. They put so much time and effort into the graphics (far more than you understand), yet so little time seemingly goes into other aspects that break the game for a lot of users. I stand by my claim that adding mid-season contract extensions is a relatively easy task, and I'm well aware of how complicated it is. That's why I say "relatively."

[Mav3rek7]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

I was talking about Show '17. What evidence do you have that it's not difficult to add a new sleeve or update an old one post-release in '17? What evidence do you have that this difficulty is "infinitely" easier than reprogramming a logic component in '17?



You're right. I'm starting to get the impression that this game wasn't made for me, and I'm wasting my time. Sad considering there's no alternative. I guess the developers don't feel like my $60 is worth as much as the Nike sock guy.



When you have some evidence for any of your claims, let me know.

We can go round and round forever. I appreciate your enthusiasm, but at this point I feel like we aren't going to achieve anything constructive.

You want hard physical evidence that I can't provide without seeing the code/talking to a developer of The Show. I was just speaking on relative/general terms of how programming works, and I would almost guarantee it's setup that way. But, choose to believe however you see it.

Either way, let's just drop it and move on. Nothing good is coming of this.

[My993C2]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Please stop. I take your words that some of you are developers. But unless you actually work on the game, it's all speculation. I am a seasoned developer myself, though I have never worked at a gaming company (presently I work at an insurance company). Anyway I have been programming professionally since before many of the people here were even born. That does not make me some sort of know-it-all superstar. No, but I have 30+ years of experience to draw on. I have bugs in some of the systems I presently support. I really want to fix them. In some cases I have fixed the bugs as it is my instinct to fix the bugs once they are discovered. But they are not deployed yet, especially when there is some sort of work around and/or data fix. You see it's not up to me as to what code is deployed and what isn't. That decision rests with business and management. You guys can argue all day long about why your favorite feature needs to be addressed. The bottom line is it is up to brass at SDS to decide what their developers work on. If anyone of us does not like this, we don't have to buy the game ... next year.

In closing, I cannot help but laugh and think about that scene from Money Ball when Billy Bean is trying to recruit Scott Hatteberg to play 1B. Billy Bean tells Scott, "Playing 1B is easy, tell him Ron" followed by Ron the 1B coach saying "Playing 1B is incredibly difficult". Well I'm like Ron. Writing good code is incredibly difficult.

[BillPeener]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Please stop. I take your words that some of you are developers. But unless you actually work on the game, it's all speculation. I am a seasoned developer myself, though I have never worked at a gaming company (presently I work at an insurance company). Anyway I have been programming professionally since before many of the people here were even born. That does not make me some sort of know-it-all superstar. No, but I have 30+ years of experience to draw on. I have bugs in some of the systems I presently support. I really want to fix them. In some cases I have fixed the bugs as it is my instinct to fix the bugs once they are discovered. But they are not deployed yet, especially when there is some sort of work around and/or data fix. You see it's not up to me as to what code is deployed and what isn't. That decision rests with business and management. You guys can argue all day long about why your favorite feature needs to be addressed. The bottom line is it is up to brass at SDS to decide what their developers work on. If anyone of us does not like this, we don't have to buy the game ... next year.

In closing, I cannot help but laugh and think about that scene from Money Ball when Billy Bean is trying to recruit Scott Hatteberg to play 1B. Billy Bean tells Scott, "Playing 1B is easy, tell him Ron" followed by Ron the 1B coach saying "Playing 1B is incredibly difficult". Well I'm like Ron. Writing good code is incredibly difficult.

A part you might have missed is that I'm actually trying to solve the franchise problem. I'm preparing to reach out to SCEA and OOTP, to put together a petition, and to make a real difference here. My goal isn't to bash the developers. My goal is to find out how I can get involved in taking the pressure off of them so that we get a better game, and they still get done what they feel is important.

Maybe you think it's fruitless and I'm wasting my time. Then again, we're talking about a video game.

[Jaysonguy]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Tay-riffic, the broken game is making us attack each other.

Look, I'm all for everything working exactly how it's supposed to be but how about the game works fully offline and online first? Then we could fix other problems people have? If we have to choose between correct color socks and the ability to play DD let's all agree that DD wins.

While there are people on either side of the "making games is hard" argument the bottom line is that we're not paying for someone's good intentions. If you want to give money in a charitable way that's fine but once they ask for money in exchange for goods they have something on their end to live up to.

If there are difficult parts of the game that they can't do well leave them out and charge a lower price for the game.

It's frustrating paying a premium for an incomplete title.

[TGov]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Not sure if this is because of the patch, but I can't substitute a runner. I'm in my Angels franchise, top of the 9th, facing the A's. Score is 1-0 A's, and I have Cron on first. Can't pinch run for him. Super frustrating.

Edit: saved my game, went to the main menu, loaded it back up, and was able to pinch run. Weird.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

I've had some screwy things like this happen too, nothing big though.

- In the trading block screen, press X to initiate a trade for that player but pushing X doesn't do anything.
- Subbing in a player/swapping positions leaves the player that was subbed in highlighted, I don't know why.

Just some small things.

And another thing, why not have the Player of the Game's stats under his picture at the end of the game???
There's a perfect spot for it, seems like it was supposed to go there.

[Speedy]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

Extremely disappointed that they did not address the SP issue. Although this patch seemed to be all about OL fixes..

Admittedly, that's where their focus needed to be with the issues online is having.

I'm hopeful and almost expectant for another big patch to address everything else in a couple of weeks.

[Finn]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

I've had some screwy things like this happen too, nothing big though.

- In the trading block screen, press X to initiate a trade for that player but pushing X doesn't do anything.
- Subbing in a player/swapping positions leaves the player that was subbed in highlighted, I don't know why.

Just some small things.

And another thing, why not have the Player of the Game's stats under his picture at the end of the game???
There's a perfect spot for it, seems like it was supposed to go there.

I remember the trading block initiate trade issue last year, hadn't gotten to the point to find out it still exists. I wonder, and I may be remembering this wrong but, if DH still shows an unselectable need.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[BillPeener]

Re: MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.03 Available Now, Here Are The Details

I've had some screwy things like this happen too, nothing big though.

- In the trading block screen, press X to initiate a trade for that player but pushing X doesn't do anything.
- Subbing in a player/swapping positions leaves the player that was subbed in highlighted, I don't know why.

Just some small things.

And another thing, why not have the Player of the Game's stats under his picture at the end of the game???
There's a perfect spot for it, seems like it was supposed to go there.

That reminds me: when selecting the current game's starting pitchers in the pre-game screen, I recall '16 highlighting the starters. In this year's version, the starters are shown at the top of pitcher lists, but I don't see a clear outline indicating who is actually pitching. Has anyone else noticed this?

Also, I like your Player of the Game idea. And I've noticed the incorrectly highlighted player when subbing / swapping positions. I think I've seen the trading block issue once or twice.

My biggest pet peeve in the trade system is the new bug where the CPU says they'll accept a trade but then tells me they're not interested when I submit it. It's definitely due to money, but for whatever reason, '17 doesn't alert me about a money issue before I submit. The consequence is that I spend significant time putting together the perfect trade, only to find out it won't work.