Prospect Progression

[sccavs64]

Re: Prospect Progression

I could be wrong, but I think I remember in last year's game, a pitcher's stamina wouldn't progress regardless of whether or not you focused on that attribute via training. Is that still the case this year?

[killaxxbearsxxx]

Re: Prospect Progression

I will add that if you have a prospect you are considering calling up to the MLB, waiting until he is hot is a good option. As well calling him up cold is a bad idea.

Because of injury I was left with a huge hole in my starting rotation. I chose to pick a prospect who was hot with a lower overall than a veteran with a higher overall but was cold.

The prospect has stayed hot since calling him up and is now 6-0 with a 2.56 era through 8 starts. If he ends up cooling off and starts to struggle due to his low ratings then I'll send him back down. But for now he is staying in my rotation over the veteran pitcher who got hurt in the first place.


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Could you come back after the season and tell us whether or not his ratings skyrocketed after this great season he's having?

[tessl]

Re: Prospect Progression

I could be wrong, but I think I remember in last year's game, a pitcher's stamina wouldn't progress regardless of whether or not you focused on that attribute via training. Is that still the case this year?

You are correct. No idea if it's still the case because I quit playing until if/when the game is patched but I doubt it has changed because I haven't heard of any mention of progression/regression being changed. I think speed also couldn't be increased with training. Speed might be realistic but relievers do convert to starters. Adam Wainwright is a good example.

One reason I disagreed with progression based upon performance is the sim engine and game engine produce different results and therefore cpu and user player progress differently but it's done now. We just have to deal with it.

[Cdub28]

Re: Prospect Progression

I just drafted a LF and this kid is an A potential with an overall of 68 already and he's only 18! I have him batting 3rd on my AAA squad, hopefully he progresses well.


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So, this is weird. I think I just drafted the same player tonight. What's his name? I will have to go back and check this later...

[Cdub28]

Re: Prospect Progression

Question, will pitchers develop new pitches on their own in the minors?

[countryboy]

Re: Prospect Progression

Question, will pitchers develop new pitches on their own in the minors?

Unless it has been changed this year, they will not.

[Nolove626]

Re: Prospect Progression

I have been doing extensive testing with multiple franchises and multiple seasons since the game has come out. Basically just trying to figure out the nuances of the franchise mode progression since it feel so different this year.

After playing multiple seasons I am 100% convinced progression is random and not performance based. I have seen to many guys with decent seasons declining in overall and potential while I have also seen too many guys having awful seasons seeing really good gains. Here is an example using the phillies two months in to season one:

Mikael Franco (80 overall, 85 potential starting)
Hitting .286 leading the league in doubles, 6 home runs, 28 RBI's, .348 OBP.
This is a decent season in most respects but for some reason he has been declining in overall progressively and has taken a -2 potential hit

Tommy Joseph (72 overall, 88 potential to start)
Hitting .219, 2 home tunes, 12 RBI's, .279 OBP. I even send him down to the minors for a week because he was batting .184.
Currently improving in potential +1 and improving in power even bough I am not training in that category, and thus far only having 2 home runs in two months of play.

I'm sorry but this makes absolutely no sense. It almost feels like they just do a random lottery drawing every season to determine who will improve. Don't even get me started on training which completely makes no difference this year. Train in power and decline, but gain +2 in left contact. Train in contact and decline 2 and 3 points in both handedness but improve discipline but 2 points. If training is not going to be a factor just take it out of the game.

I was always against performances based progression for this reason. There is no way to know how he games progression engine views statistics and determines which ones lead to increases in progression. If the devs maybe came out and explained how the progression actually works this year I don't think I would feel so weird about this year.

I'm honestly not even frustrated with this years progression, I think I just feel more confused then anything lol.

[G3no_11]

Re: Prospect Progression

What if progression is based more on the "hidden" numbers rather than actual stats? Things such as solid contact%, balls taken%, stuff like that. Not saying it is the right way to base progression but just a random thought.

[335TDC]

Re: Prospect Progression

What if progression is based more on the "hidden" numbers rather than actual stats? Things such as solid contact%, balls taken%, stuff like that. Not saying it is the right way to base progression but just a random thought.

The most obvious predictor of progression for players in the Show is righty/lefty splits. If you can hit a few home runs and hit for decent average against lefties using either Mazara or Schwarber, they blow up (given that they're also raking vs. righties).

It would be interesting to see after a year long sim how K/BB affect Vision and Discipline.

Don't know how errors affect fielding attributes or how SB affect affect baserunning/speed.

Or the Devs can just tell us...

[underdog13]

Re: Prospect Progression

How can progression not be affected by performance when potential can be change based on performance?

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[Nolove626]

Re: Prospect Progression

The most obvious predictor of progression for players in the Show is righty/lefty splits. If you can hit a few home runs and hit for decent average against lefties using either Mazara or Schwarber, they blow up (given that they're also raking vs. righties).

It would be interesting to see after a year long sim how K/BB affect Vision and Discipline.

Don't know how errors affect fielding attributes or how SB affect affect baserunning/speed.

Or the Devs can just tell us...

I think you may be right, but that is the inherent problem though. That is simply not the way to do progression. I personally don't have time to play every minor league game plus my MLB games so I am heavily reliant on simulating to develop my prospects. Unfortunately some top prospects will just never improve because their stats are simply not good enough to generate the level of production required to progress. You should see Jorge Alfaro. 90 potential but has been toiling away in the minors because he can't hit a lick to begin with. His hitting stats are all in the 40's and I even tried moving him to double a but within a few years the pitchers get really good at that level to.

[Nolove626]

Re: Prospect Progression

How can progression not be affected by performance when potential can be change based on performance?

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Underdog. The problem is the potential increases have nothing to do with production and seem to be random. I have had players having horrendous seasons improve in potential while players having solid years take a potential hit. Until the developers pop up and announce what the factors are that cause these fluctuations we are just assessing players blind.

Second point why even have training in the game. It seems to have zero effect. I would say it's pretty much 50/50 that your player actually approves in the attributes they are assigned training in. And never mind training with the hitting coach because I have noticed if you train vision/discipline/ clutch you take the biggest hits to your contact and power. How does training with a hitting coach negatively effect your hitting stats?!?! It makes no sense. I could see it negatively impacting fielding/baserunning since you are neglecting these areas but a hitting coach negatively effecting your hitting? It's very confusing. At least last year players and low rated prospects would actually improve in assigned categories unless they were 29 or older in most cases

[underdog13]

Re: Prospect Progression

Underdog. The problem is the potential increases have nothing to do with production and seem to be random. I have had players having horrendous seasons improve in potential while players having solid years take a potential hit. Until the developers pop up and announce what the factors are that cause these fluctuations we are just assessing players blind

In previous years I've only had potential changes that made sense based on continued great/poor production. Maybe this year it isn't quite the same?

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[Nolove626]

Re: Prospect Progression

In previous years I've only had potential changes that made sense based on continued great/poor production. Maybe this year it isn't quite the same?

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Yeah it was that way last year. Generally you would see increase/decreases by going on prolonged hot or cold streaks. You would even get an email telling you they improved. It felt organic and realistic this way. This year I have yet to get a potential increase/decrease email and the only way to know is to go to the player card and see the red or green arrow next to their potential grade. Nine times out of ten they are not on a cold or hot streak from what I can tell

[335TDC]

Re: Prospect Progression

Yeah it was that way last year. Generally you would see increase/decreases by going on prolonged hot or cold streaks. You would even get an email telling you they improved. It felt organic and realistic this way. This year I have yet to get a potential increase/decrease email and the only way to know is to go to the player card and see the red or green arrow next to their potential grade. Nine times out of ten they are not on a cold or hot streak from what I can tell

Well, players' progress/regress on the 2nd of every month, so I just do a roster check on that date when sim testing. And I'd call potential progression this year progress based with some elements of randomness. I say this because Diaz, the young closer, shoots up to an A potential every time if he has a very low ERA and high SO, and I'm talking about first or second month. But I've seen the down arrow on Kris Bryant and some others where it really doesn't mean much because it's from a 96 to a 95 or something similar.

But again, agreed: dev clarification would be nice. And those emails -- I miss them too. Why the hell did they get rid of them?! They were a nice touch of immersion.