MLB The Show 22: High Sinkers Gotta Go

[TroyF]

Re: MLB The Show 22: High Sinkers Gotta Go

I hope they don't make it completely ineffective. In 2021, of all sinkers in the strike zone, the highest whiff rate was at the top of zone (~20%): https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/visua...=&player_name=. So if a sinker is in the zone, it is more than 1.5x effective at missing bats compared to other locations in the zone.

Pitchers like Steven Matz actually went to the high sinker more in 2021 than in previous years. Matz has found a way to make it very effective thanks to his release point and movement of his entire arsenal. A decent breakdown can be found here: https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2021/12...sinkers-part-2. In doing this, Matz also managed to reduce opponent's exit velocity on batted balls by 3% from the previous season and dropped his opponents line drive percentage by almost half.

I do think the pitch and location needs to be toned down; however, I hope they don't take it to the opposite end of the spectrum (completely ineffective by all pitchers).

Thank you. A sinker ball is a POWER pitch. It's essentially a 2 seam fastball. Fastballs are thrown high in the zone. The issue is the game engine is screwed up, so just a kunckleball can't be used in DD, high sinkers are broken.

But high sinkers ARE a thing. I mean, they are massively a thing. Many sinkerball pitchers live up in the zone with it. I think people get confused about the name. They equate sinker with having to be low. All sinker means is that the height of the ball is changing. And in this day and age with upper cut swings, pitchers who live low with the sinker are going to have a bad time.

[Caulfield]

Re: MLB The Show 22: High Sinkers Gotta Go

Thank you. A sinker ball is a POWER pitch. It's essentially a 2 seam fastball. Fastballs are thrown high in the zone. The issue is the game engine is screwed up, so just a kunckleball can't be used in DD, high sinkers are broken.

But high sinkers ARE a thing. I mean, they are massively a thing. Many sinkerball pitchers live up in the zone with it. I think people get confused about the name. They equate sinker with having to be low. All sinker means is that the height of the ball is changing. And in this day and age with upper cut swings, pitchers who live low with the sinker are going to have a bad time.

I was wondering if the 2-seamer would work its way in here. I'm throwing the majority of my power pitches high & inside (including any 2-seamer/sinkers in any of my pitchers arsenal), and the majority of my breaking ball/off-speed pitches low & away

[jsou4646]

Re: MLB The Show 22: High Sinkers Gotta Go

Thank you. A sinker ball is a POWER pitch. It's essentially a 2 seam fastball. Fastballs are thrown high in the zone. The issue is the game engine is screwed up, so just a kunckleball can't be used in DD, high sinkers are broken.

But high sinkers ARE a thing. I mean, they are massively a thing. Many sinkerball pitchers live up in the zone with it. I think people get confused about the name. They equate sinker with having to be low. All sinker means is that the height of the ball is changing. And in this day and age with upper cut swings, pitchers who live low with the sinker are going to have a bad time.

That may be true but sinker ball pitchers aren’t aiming high in the zone. When used they are rare and pitchers aren’t trying to be up in the zone when using sinkers. How many sinker ball pitchers do you think are even in the league now. No where even close to the amount of pitchers that have sinkers in the show. That’s the main issue. I’m not attacking you just pointing out that sinker ball pitchers are really far and few between and yes i pitched in college and was drafted by the Giants back in the late 90s in case this was going to the have you ever even played or watched baseball argument

[Cod]

Re: MLB The Show 22: High Sinkers Gotta Go

That may be true but sinker ball pitchers aren’t aiming high in the zone. When used they are rare and pitchers aren’t trying to be up in the zone when using sinkers. How many sinker ball pitchers do you think are even in the league now. No where even close to the amount of pitchers that have sinkers in the show. That’s the main issue. I’m not attacking you just pointing out that sinker ball pitchers are really far and few between and yes i pitched in college and was drafted by the Giants back in the late 90s in case this was going to the have you ever even played or watched baseball argument

Some of the numbers tend to disagree with your assertion. When Kluber won the Cy Young in 2017, his sinker's location average was middle-up (https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/visua...mmaryYear=2017), which was even higher than his cutter and offspeed pitches. If you look at the years leading up to this, his sinker location pretty much stayed middle-up.

Another example is Chris Bassitt. Over the past four seasons, he has used his sinker 47% of the time and the average location...middle-in to righties (https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/visua...mmaryYear=2021).

Highly recommend checking out this article from Fangraphs (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/players-...he-same-pitch/) regarding Two Seamers vs Sinkers where they interview pitching coaches. What really caught my attention was this (not related to this discussion lol): “If you include the shuuto, there are actually three versions of the two-seamer. If you talk to the Japanese guys, it’s a real pitch. Over there, they practice it and work with it. The shuutu is more side to side, a sinker is more downwards, and a two-seamer is kind of in between."

tldr; the sinker is a power pitch that is thrown evenly around the zone and the numbers back that claim up. I applaud the developers for recognizing this and incorporating it in the game correctly.