MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

[kehlis]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

So we should be content with inaccuracies? They aren't SCEA San Diego's fault, but they are still inaccuracies, how can you dismiss them? Did you even bother to read my "rants".

Its not beating a dead horse to say that they pursue a way that would allow them to follow the style guide and perhaps get the uniforms right.

You are boiling my point down to something that it isn't, I'm suggesting they change their course of action, you're arguing that they can't do anything but follow the style guide. A statement that, while true, is not a proper response to what I'm saying.

So how would you propose they change something that can't be changed?



No, it's not perfect, but if it can't be fixed it can't be fixed. Sounds like you think you are being a pioneer but you are posting things that have been posted here for over 4 years now.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

Enjoy the crusade.

[LaserRocketArm31]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

Guys, no one is actually bound by the MLB style guide and no 2k absolutely does not have different contractual requirements regarding the style guide. If you have been around this business or follow any kind of sports apparel, cards, collectibles, and figures you would know that every time a company makes a mistake it is blamed on the style guide. There are not multiple style guides. However, every company is suppose to follow the style guide. Does it happen? NEVER. Is it punished? ABSOLUTELY NOT.

I've been in this business since 1988 and every year and every sports line no matter the sport there are errors with the product. Even if their competitors got it right, they still say it is the style guide because they know you guys have no idea what you are talking about and it is an easy excuse. All of the hundreds of companies that produce MLB products receive the same style guide. As long as the product is approved when sent to the MLB, it is good to go. Now maybe SECA is unaware of this and they are using the style guide but 2k is aware of the nature of the business as they may have someone with licensing experience.

Again, all of the style guides are the same and no one has a different contract regarding accurate uniforms. The style guide is always full of inaccuracies. Anyone involved with sports licensing knows that it is the company's job to get right what the style guide gets wrong. The Rays powder blues are not in the style guide but you sure can buy the jersey and 2K put it in. As long as your final product is approved by MLB the style guide does not matter. It just sounds entirely to me that SECA is trying to play it by the book because they do not have anyone who has experience with sports licensing on their team to let them know how the style guide works in reality.

[G3no_11]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

I don't really know and don't have any inside knowledge, but I would think they could vary from the style guide if they chose to. If MLB teams are doing it without being looked down upon, I don't see why a video game couldn't do it.

The impression I got from a developer was that they are choosing to go by the style guide... but honestly if they just watched a week of baseball they would see a lot of their uniforms are completely off as far as what teams actually wear.

I think they just give their artists the style guide and call it good. They can use at as a valid excuse and not have to spend extra time actually seeing what teams wear and/or make changes to what they already have in the game.

The reason I think they can vary from it if they want, is because they used to have some of the uniforms correct in previous years. Do you think they changed the style guide from a correct version of the uniform to an older/out of date version? or do you think the artists started going strictly by the style guide?

[thehomie]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

Can you guys stop worrying about things that don't even effect gameplay. Lets get the gameplay fixed then worry about the rest. I assume they did not fix the rounding 3rd problem, can anybody confirm that?

[iRepIndiana]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

Saw someone post earlier and ask when did SCEA become EA?!?!?!?!

They WILL NOT EVER be as bad as EA has become.

The fact that they have dropped the ball on some certain and to some, gamebreaking things, isn't the end of the world.


They still make the BEST sports game IMHO in sports gaming.

That comment was ridiculous.

Hopefully some SCEA guys can come in here and sherd some light to us on why certain things haven't been touched.

[Iceman87GT]

So how would you propose they change something that can't be changed?



No, it's not perfect, but if it can't be fixed it can't be fixed. Sounds like you think you are being a pioneer but you are posting things that have been posted here for over 4 years now.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

Enjoy the crusade.

Its as simple as informing the teams their style guides are inaccurate and because of The Show's contractual limitations this means that the uniforms in the game are inaccurate. If the teams then choose not to update them after this THEN there's nothing you can do about it. They can't actually change the style guides but they can do something to try and get the teams to change them. Or they could lobby to the MLB asking for some room when it comes to uniforms, allow them to deviate from the style guide as long as the teams okay it.

I mean the Canadian cover of the game features a jersey that isn't in the game because of the style guide limitations.

I imagine the MLB would prefer the game reflect real life as much as possible, I doubt they would strip them of the license for simply asking for more leeway, and asking teams to update their style guides is a pretty simple process (whether they update it is out of their control). The way this is always addressed on this site is that there is absolutely nothing they can do, when there is! There's just no guarantee that what they can do will lead to actual change, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't do it.

I made my argument twice and the response was essentially "they have to follow the style guide" a response that ignores a large part of those 2 arguments. There are things they can do to affect change, but the response to these suggestions is always "no there isn't."

Its not the same old thing, I'm sure someone has suggested these ideas before me, but the same old thing in this case is suggesting they can just decide if they want to follow the style guide or not. That is clearly not the case, which is why I'm not making that argument. I'm saying that yeah you have to follow the style guide, but surely there is some leeway, surely the MLB would be open to allowing some deviation if the real life uniforms are proven to be out of sync with the style guide, surely the developers could contact the teams that have inaccuracies and ask them to get them up to date. If SCEA isn't even exploring these possibilities then they aren't doing all they can do.

[Bobhead]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

SCEA's contract with MLB is NOT similar to 2K Sports' contract with MLB.

I know that for a fact.

Whatever rights SCEA has with MLB, that agreement wasn't just decided by MLB, it was also decided by 2K. When 2K first carved out their agreement, the first-party (Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo) exception didn't fall out of the sky. It was spelled out in the contract. So SCEA has been hamstrung not only by MLB, but by 2k Sports...

EVERYTHING was spelled out in that contract. That's how contracts work. In addition, 2K gained several advantages because their contract was literally written 10 years ago, and so they kinda bought out things MLB didn't really care about at the time, because no one cared about them at the time (since no game console was capable of actually exploring such things), like brand name clothing and stuff like that. Stuff SCEA doesn't have because their agreement involves a revolving lease, that is constantly updated and adjusted at MLB's discretion.

Just look at the pink bat nonsense that happened this year... Knight posted this originally.

The reason I think they can vary from it if they want, is because they used to have some of the uniforms correct in previous years. Do you think they changed the style guide from a correct version of the uniform to an older/out of date version? or do you think the artists started going strictly by the style guide?

I think someone got a cease and desist: misrepresentation letter in the mail and was forced to go in the game and change it. Simple as that. There's literally no other reason a developer would take time out of doing practical and relevant things to go delete some random uniform... except if it were a corporate directive as a result of legal action.

It's the same reason we don't have any more Jon Dowds, any more manually triggered arguements, baseball fights, etc...

This stuff is far more complex than you guys seem to want to believe.

[bkrich83]

SCEA's contract with MLB is NOT similar to 2K Sports' contract with MLB.

I know that for a fact.

Whatever rights SCEA has with MLB, that agreement wasn't just decided by MLB, it was also decided by 2K. When 2K first carved out their agreement, the first-party (Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo) exception didn't fall out of the sky. It was spelled out in the contract. So SCEA has been hamstrung not only by MLB, but by 2k Sports...

EVERYTHING was spelled out in that contract. That's how contracts work. In addition, 2K gained several advantages because their contract was literally written 10 years ago, and so they kinda bought out things MLB didn't really care about at the time, because no one cared about them at the time (since no game console was capable of actually exploring such things), like brand name clothing and stuff like that. Stuff SCEA doesn't have because their agreement involves a revolving lease, that is constantly updated and adjusted at MLB's discretion.

Just look at the pink bat nonsense that happened this year... Knight posted something about it, I'll try to find the link and edit it back in...



I think someone got a cease and desist: misrepresentation letter in the mail and was forced to go in the game and change it. Simple as that. There's literally no other reason a developer would take time out of doing practical and relevant things to go delete some random uniform... except if it were a corporate directive as a result of legal action.

It's the same reason we don't have any more Jon Dowds, any more manually triggered arguements, baseball fights, etc...

This stuff is far more complex than you guys seem to want to believe.

Agreed. You're on point. Not sure why people act like this is new. This is old news around here.

[Iceman87GT]

Saw someone post earlier and ask when did SCEA become EA?!?!?!?!

They WILL NOT EVER be as bad as EA has become.

The fact that they have dropped the ball on some certain and to some, gamebreaking things, isn't the end of the world.


They still make the BEST sports game IMHO in sports gaming.

That comment was ridiculous.

Hopefully some SCEA guys can come in here and sherd some light to us on why certain things haven't been touched.

Yeah, I get tired of the EA is the worst argument (really!? HSBC Bank was laundering money for terrorist organizations and drug cartels, but EA has the online pass so EA is worse), and I think one of the biggest issues with the EA is the worse sentiment (So we're going to forget about FIFA, and the NHL series - although NHL has dropped off some since the consecutive best sports games awards, and ignore that 2K Sports also makes MLB 2K, and remember them only for their NBA franchise), is that when a developer isn't entirely on its game they all of a sudden get labeled as becoming EA, or "horrible".

EA deserves criticism, they have made mistakes, they haven't always listened to their consumers, but its getting out of hand on this site.

SCEA - SD is not becoming EA because they didn't address exactly what you want in a particular patch, and EA isn't the devil. Also 2K can be just as negligent with certain titles (*cough* MLB *cough*) as any other company.

[bkrich83]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

I imagine the MLB would prefer the game reflect real life as much as possible, I doubt they would strip them of the license for simply asking for more leeway, and asking teams to update their style guides is a pretty simple process (whether they update it is out of their control). The way this is always addressed on this site is that there is absolutely nothing they can do, when there is! There's just no guarantee that what they can do will lead to actual change, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't do it.

I made my argument twice and the response was essentially "they have to follow the style guide" a response that ignores a large part of those 2 arguments. There are things they can do to affect change, but the response to these suggestions is always "no there isn't."

Its not the same old thing, I'm sure someone has suggested these ideas before me, but the same old thing in this case is suggesting they can just decide if they want to follow the style guide or not. That is clearly not the case, which is why I'm not making that argument. I'm saying that yeah you have to follow the style guide, but surely there is some leeway, surely the MLB would be open to allowing some deviation if the real life uniforms are proven to be out of sync with the style guide, surely the developers could contact the teams that have inaccuracies and ask them to get them up to date. If SCEA isn't even exploring these possibilities then they aren't doing all they can do.

The MLB (and NFL, NBA in reality) are fierce in their protection of their IP's is exactly why the style guide exists and exactly why there's really no room for deviation. Which is a good thing in theory because it's supposed to protect the IP's and thus give us the most realistic uniforms. Unfortunately in reality it doesn't work out that way as it appears the guides at least the ones SCEA is working with are not up to date.

But at the end, no there's no real leeway, and I don't believe SCEA wants to risk souring their relationship or the headaches that would possibly occur for deviating from their contractual obligation.

[Bobhead]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

"The Pink Bat Thing"

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/enforced-banning-pink-labled-bats-not-manufactured-louisville-175639268.html

Again thanks to MK Knight for sharing this originally.

[Gagnon39]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

Can we PLEASE stop talking about the stinking style guide. I have two questions that I've asked a million times and have yet to see a definitive answer for. After 1.23 are statistics more realistic as franchise progresses (I know it doesn't say this is fixed in the patch but technically its not really a "bug"). And secondly, and most importantly, if it does fix the issue do we have to restart our franchise?

I'd really like to see a screenshot of stats if someone has stats from, say, 2025.

[shadow2201]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

Can we PLEASE stop talking about the stinking style guide. I have two questions that I've asked a million times and have yet to see a definitive answer for. After 1.23 are statistics more realistic as franchise progresses (I know it doesn't say this is fixed in the patch but technically its not really a "bug"). And secondly, and most importantly, if it does fix the issue do we have to restart our franchise?

I'd really like to see a screenshot of stats if someone has stats from, say, 2025.

I agree, no more style guide talk when there are much more pressing issues to be taken care of in this game.

[G3no_11]

Re: MLB 13 The Show Title Update 1.23 Available Now, Details Included

but wait... the colors are off on a lot of uniforms!!!! where are the 1970's throwbacks?!?!? why are my teams socks this color!!!?!

[Iceman87GT]

Can we PLEASE stop talking about the stinking style guide. I have two questions that I've asked a million times and have yet to see a definitive answer for. After 1.23 are statistics more realistic as franchise progresses (I know it doesn't say this is fixed in the patch but technically its not really a "bug"). And secondly, and most importantly, if it does fix the issue do we have to restart our franchise?

I'd really like to see a screenshot of stats if someone has stats from, say, 2025.

No you don't have to restart the franchise, and there have been more than a few guys who have stated they will be doing some simulations and posting what they find later, I would also suggest going into the forums and seeing if anyone has managed to come up with something so soon. I guarantee you they will not be posting all that info in the comment section of the news about the patch.