Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

[OhioBobcats]

What have roster makers out there done to adjust stats across eras? Looking for any tools I could possibly mess with. Thanks.

[Culture Rot]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

No point. The show uses a stat ceiling based around "modern" stats. Statistically Anomalies are not able to be recreated no matter how you set ratings. The game artificially increases and decreases stats to level things out during a season

[Knight165]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

No point. The show uses a stat ceiling based around "modern" stats. Statistically Anomalies are not able to be recreated no matter how you set ratings. The game artificially increases and decreases stats to level things out during a season

Not true...at all.
I've had players hit .365-.375 easily in the game.
60+ homers
K #s can get quite high.

The hardest is probably wins.

M.K.
Knight165

[Culture Rot]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

Not true...at all.
I've had players hit .365-.375 easily in the game.
60+ homers
K #s can get quite high.

The hardest is probably wins.

M.K.
Knight165

All due respect I disagree. At all? Are you suggesting not only that I'm wrong but that there are no stat ceilings at all?

If your getting those numbers, it's gotta be through playing not pure simulation stats.

I tested this experiment many times. Take a 99 rated pitcher. Throw 3 shutouts with him user control. Sim 5 starts and take note of what happens. His era will sky rocket to "level out". This also happens with hitters. It's why maxed out hitters only max out at current era levels. It's why in your own rosters, Tony Gwynn can barely crack .330 in years he hit 360 plus. I'd love to be wrong. If this no longer exists, it must have changed on next gen. I tested this from mlb the show 10 to 15 on past gen. I strongly suspect nothing has changed but have to respect your two cents on this Knight. Can you prove or confirm otherwise? Truly?

[JTommy67]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

Not true...at all.
I've had players hit .365-.375 easily in the game.
60+ homers
K #s can get quite high.

The hardest is probably wins.

M.K.
Knight165

Definitely agree. I have a 1941 test roster ('15 version) in the vault which uses scaled ratings and Ted Williams can hit in the .390s in a good sim year.

To the original poster, the pitcher and hitter ratings work together. To produce higher batting averages, you needn't necessarily raise contact ratings; lowering H/9 ratings will suffice. The same holds true for walks, strikeouts, and home runs. It's better to manipulate pitcher ratings downward for more offense; you have more room to work with.

[JTommy67]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

All due respect I disagree. At all? Are you suggesting not only that I'm wrong but that there are no stat ceilings at all?

If your getting those numbers, it's gotta be through playing not pure simulation stats.

I tested this experiment many times. Take a 99 rated pitcher. Throw 3 shutouts with him user control. Sim 5 starts and take note of what happens. His era will sky rocket to "level out". This also happens with hitters. It's why maxed out hitters only max out at current era levels. It's why in your own rosters, Tony Gwynn can barely crack .330 in years he hit 360 plus. I'd love to be wrong. If this no longer exists, it must have changed on next gen. I tested this from mlb the show 10 to 15 on past gen. I strongly suspect nothing has changed but have to respect your two cents on this Knight. Can you prove or confirm otherwise? Truly?

For the 2013 version of the game I created a test roster where every attribute for every player (pitchers and position players) was set to zero. I then added a player to every roster who was 99 for every rating. These guys were batting .500 with 80-100 homers typically.

I did this to see if ratings could be scaled to reproduce more historically accurate sim engine results.

So, yes, the range of possibilities in the sim engine is greater than it might appear.

[Culture Rot]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

For the 2013 version of the game I created a test roster where every attribute for every player (pitchers and position players) was set to zero. I then added a player to every roster who was 99 for every rating. These guys were batting .500 with 80-100 homers typically.

I did this to see if ratings could be scaled to reproduce more historically accurate sim engine results.

So, yes, the range of possibilities in the sim engine is greater than it might appear.

Thanks for your findings on this. I was so disappointed by this, I swore off the series for a long while outside of online play. It doesn't explain my findings though. Obviously one cant play with a 0/99 roster just to get a few statistically noteworthy seasons out of hall of fame players. I wonder what the sweet spot here is.

If there is an actual retro roster that has been able to solve this "historical stats" issue, I've yet to play it :/

[JTommy67]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

No problem. There's a long history to my conclusions.

After I confirmed that it was possible to scale ratings I created a calculator and used it to rate players for all years in MLB history, and included these ratings in my roster utility (see link below).

I used what statistics I believe the developers are using to calculate ratings and constructed my scales and formulas to match theirs as closely as I could.

I then applied some mathematical scaling to historical statistics to ensure a better balance between pitchers and hitters which would yield more historically accurate statistics. Without getting into too much detail, hitting ratings are rescaled (based on league averages for the year in question) to maintain a standard distribution while pitching ratings are allowed to freely fluctuate based on the current scale observed in the game.

Some members have used my utility and reported positive results. And, as I mentioned previously, check out my 1941 test roster in the 2015 roster vault. There are some things in there which have since been fixed, but you'll notice DiMaggio and Williams hitting in the .350 - .390 range if you sim many seasons and league-wide averages more or less on the mark for what happened that year.

The problem is that the roster-making process is a slow one and while there are some rosters out there made by people who've used my utility, I still don't think there is a full-on test where my numbers have been used exclusively, which makes it difficult to evaluate results.

Also, keep in mind that for historical years you have empty team slots (due to expansion) which must be filled with players. How this is done can significantly alter what you see in the sim engine.

Anyway, my conclusion is that accurate scaling is certainly possible, with the exception being stolen base numbers.

Here is a link to my utility:

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/pp9...shf/RB_Utility

[Culture Rot]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

I will be using this from now on

[Culture Rot]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

No problem. There's a long history to my conclusions.

After I confirmed that it was possible to scale ratings I created a calculator and used it to rate players for all years in MLB history, and included these ratings in my roster utility (see link below).

I used what statistics I believe the developers are using to calculate ratings and constructed my scales and formulas to match theirs as closely as I could.

I then applied some mathematical scaling to historical statistics to ensure a better balance between pitchers and hitters which would yield more historically accurate statistics. Without getting into too much detail, hitting ratings are rescaled (based on league averages for the year in question) to maintain a standard distribution while pitching ratings are allowed to freely fluctuate based on the current scale observed in the game.

Some members have used my utility and reported positive results. And, as I mentioned previously, check out my 1941 test roster in the 2015 roster vault. There are some things in there which have since been fixed, but you'll notice DiMaggio and Williams hitting in the .350 - .390 range if you sim many seasons and league-wide averages more or less on the mark for what happened that year.

The problem is that the roster-making process is a slow one and while there are some rosters out there made by people who've used my utility, I still don't think there is a full-on test where my numbers have been used exclusively, which makes it difficult to evaluate results.

Also, keep in mind that for historical years you have empty team slots (due to expansion) which must be filled with players. How this is done can significantly alter what you see in the sim engine.

Anyway, my conclusion is that accurate scaling is certainly possible, with the exception being stolen base numbers.

Here is a link to my utility:

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/pp9...shf/RB_Utility

What exactly is being adjusted with your utility though? If I have a player already in a franchise who is maxed out hitting, but only going .310 at the plate----what edits can I make to fix it?

Lowering his teammates?

Lowering pitcher ratings?

Some weird combo of ratings for the under performing hitter?

Thanks

[Phil Parent]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

No problem. There's a long history to my conclusions.

After I confirmed that it was possible to scale ratings I created a calculator and used it to rate players for all years in MLB history, and included these ratings in my roster utility (see link below).

I used what statistics I believe the developers are using to calculate ratings and constructed my scales and formulas to match theirs as closely as I could.

I then applied some mathematical scaling to historical statistics to ensure a better balance between pitchers and hitters which would yield more historically accurate statistics. Without getting into too much detail, hitting ratings are rescaled (based on league averages for the year in question) to maintain a standard distribution while pitching ratings are allowed to freely fluctuate based on the current scale observed in the game.

Some members have used my utility and reported positive results. And, as I mentioned previously, check out my 1941 test roster in the 2015 roster vault. There are some things in there which have since been fixed, but you'll notice DiMaggio and Williams hitting in the .350 - .390 range if you sim many seasons and league-wide averages more or less on the mark for what happened that year.

The problem is that the roster-making process is a slow one and while there are some rosters out there made by people who've used my utility, I still don't think there is a full-on test where my numbers have been used exclusively, which makes it difficult to evaluate results.

Also, keep in mind that for historical years you have empty team slots (due to expansion) which must be filled with players. How this is done can significantly alter what you see in the sim engine.

Anyway, my conclusion is that accurate scaling is certainly possible, with the exception being stolen base numbers.

Here is a link to my utility:

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/pp9...shf/RB_Utility

This is really interesting... I will be doing an historical set (1998) from scratch at some point after I finish my current project and I'd like to give this a try.

[JTommy67]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

What exactly is being adjusted with your utility though? If I have a player already in a franchise who is maxed out hitting, but only going .310 at the plate----what edits can I make to fix it?

Lowering his teammates?

Lowering pitcher ratings?

Some weird combo of ratings for the under performing hitter?

Thanks

Let me give you an overview of the logic applied, then work back to your question.

First, my calculator compares the league average for the year in question to the current league average and adjusts each player's average by the difference. So, if in a given year the league average is .270, then each player gets reduced by about .15 points (.270 - .255) and then rated for contact left and right. This brings most players into line with the current distribution found for 2015 players.

Next, the pitchers' corresponding rating (in this case H/9) is rated the same way as 2015 players. But since averages were much higher in our example, those H/9 ratings will be lower across the board. So, while in 2015 Miggy Cabrera might bat .320 with his 99 rating, in 1941 Ted Williams, also with a 99 rating, will be facing much weaker pitchers, producing a higher average.

The two important things are to use the proper statistics and also to keep the hitters more/less in the same scale as current players. The pitcher statistics will do the work.

Now, when you talk about a player being maxed out at 99 and batting .310, then he's facing pitchers that are too good. But without more info I can't really say much more than that. I notice that when people rate players they tend to want the best players to have ratings that are too high. Perhaps it is some kind of "nostalgic" creep, but if you want to reproduce historical seasons then something has to drift away from the variances we're used to. For seasons where averages were much higher, pitcher ratings must go down.

All hitting statistics are the result of both pitching and hitting for that year, and the same holds true for all pitching statistics. Lots of hits could mean lots of great hitters but also poor pitchers.

Hope this helps.

[JTommy67]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

This is really interesting... I will be doing an historical set (1998) from scratch at some point after I finish my current project and I'd like to give this a try.

Actually this was one of the years I was curious in seeing. I don't think I will be able to reproduce the higher HR totals for the top players. There's a very long story behind this. In short, I was fearful my method described earlier would produce too many HRs, so I flipped the constant to the other side, so to speak, allowing power ratings to fluctuate out of the standard scale while rescaling pitcher HR/9 ratings to 2015 levels.

What is likely to happen is that most players will have HR totals that are on target, but a few others will hit the ceiling. McGwire and Sosa won't reach 60; they'll have totals resembling a player on the 2015 roster who's rated 99.

This was on my list to address eventually but haven't gotten to it. However, if you were to do a roster your feedback would help immensely, and I'm certain I can make adjustments that could allow you to rerate it and make it work.

[doncropper]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

I will vouch for JTommy67's excellent Version 1 calculator. I use it almost 100% with the exception being using OOTP for a pitcher pitch types and their relative effectiveness. Also using his calculator almost, if not totally, exclusively is bostongahden & Rwings832. We have all been extremely satisfied with the results JTommy67's calculator produces.

I will also note that the results from a complete simulated season in a single swope from start to finish will produce vastly different results than a full season simulated a single calendar day at a time.

In my case I only play CPU vs CPU games and never ever control either team and the results seen from using JTommy67's Roster Building Utility is as pleasing to me as it is to both bostongahden and Rwings832 who each actually play the game versus basically just watching it like myself.

[Phil Parent]

Re: Adjusting stats across eras? Tools? Formulas?

Actually this was one of the years I was curious in seeing. I don't think I will be able to reproduce the higher HR totals for the top players. There's a very long story behind this. In short, I was fearful my method described earlier would produce too many HRs, so I flipped the constant to the other side, so to speak, allowing power ratings to fluctuate out of the standard scale while rescaling pitcher HR/9 ratings to 2015 levels.

What is likely to happen is that most players will have HR totals that are on target, but a few others will hit the ceiling. McGwire and Sosa won't reach 60; they'll have totals resembling a player on the 2015 roster who's rated 99.

This was on my list to address eventually but haven't gotten to it. However, if you were to do a roster your feedback would help immensely, and I'm certain I can make adjustments that could allow you to rerate it and make it work.

After having a look at the 1998 file, I have to say it looks amazingly spot-on and balanced. Your thought process is really solid. Yes, I will input this in the game and see the results we get. Later on this year!