Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

So Zone hitting implies that that the batter cannot see a pitch that he swings at in the wrong zone. It also seems to prevent someone from trying to place the ball into the hole vacated by the fielder in a hit and run. Sometimes you do want to pull an outside pitch, even if it is not going to be as strong of a hit.

While LS hitting implies that some hitters try to pull outside pitches with negative results, but does assume that the batter can actually see and find the ball. It rewards the batter for seeing the ball and going with it, and penalizes the batter for going against that. It lets the game determine based on pitch and hitter ratings if it is a miss or a hit if it is times well.

My preference is to play the game that begins with the assumption that a major league hitter can swing the bat where the ball is without my help, but allow me to control what kind of swing the batter will use.

I'm just not comfortable with a system that assumes that I might swing high and inside at an low and away pitch. When I went through slumps, and couldn't hit a thing, it sure wasn't because I was swing ing in the wrong zone. It was because technique threw my timing off, or made me swing over the ball.

Cursor hitting makes more sense than Zone hitting in this respect.

[Diablo25]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

Like I said before, to each his own. That being said, I believe zone hitting is the most realistic hitting model. It's the more realistic challenge.

[Skyboxer]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

I prefer zone hitting and cursor hitting but have zero problems with 2K having timing only.
It's a game and I'll make due with it and have fun. Which is what it's all about in the end.

Everyones going to have a preference and there will always be the self proclaimed baseball gurus with the only opinion that matters...theirs.

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

To be fair, I'd rather read informed opinions on why people prefer different modes than worry about who's right. We are all right for ourselves.

As I've mentioned a few times here, I was as excited as I could be that last year's game was going to have a zone or cursor hitting model. It made all kinds of sense to me that it would be the right way to have a hitting model.

I changed my mind after trying to use it. I found it to be harder than necessary, and took my focus off of what I think about when hitting in real life. So for me, zone and cursor hitting are not good choices.

But if people feel differently, then they are right for themselves. If zone hitting mimic what they go through when they hit, or presents a better challenge that provides more accurate results for them, then I would expect them to prefer it.

So while I don't agree with Diablo's take, I like reading thoughtful opinions and why he prefers a different mode, because it helps inform me about how different systems work, and more importantly, could be improved if ideas were adopted. Zone hitting and LS influence have a lot in common as well as distinct differences. Discussing them really allows others to think about what it is they find important.

What drew me to this topic was the assumption that 2K was crazy for yanking the cursor or zone hitting out. My responses addressed why it made sense for 2K to choose one system to perfect, and why the system they chose made the most sense for them in the big picture.

But there is no actual right or wrong answer.

[serialmike]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

To be fair, I'd rather read informed opinions on why people prefer different modes than worry about who's right. We are all right for ourselves.

As I've mentioned a few times here, I was as excited as I could be that last year's game was going to have a zone or cursor hitting model. It made all kinds of sense to me that it would be the right way to have a hitting model.

I changed my mind after trying to use it. I found it to be harder than necessary, and took my focus off of what I think about when hitting in real life. So for me, zone and cursor hitting are not good choices.

But if people feel differently, then they are right for themselves. If zone hitting mimic what they go through when they hit, or presents a better challenge that provides more accurate results for them, then I would expect them to prefer it.

So while I don't agree with Diablo's take, I like reading thoughtful opinions and why he prefers a different mode, because it helps inform me about how different systems work, and more importantly, could be improved if ideas were adopted. Zone hitting and LS influence have a lot in common as well as distinct differences. Discussing them really allows others to think about what it is they find important.

What drew me to this topic was the assumption that 2K was crazy for yanking the cursor or zone hitting out. My responses addressed why it made sense for 2K to choose one system to perfect, and why the system they chose made the most sense for them in the big picture.

But there is no actual right or wrong answer.

In my, Diablo25 and most if not all HighHeat fans opinion. The reason you WANT zone hitting is When you swing a bat at a ball in real life YOU must place the bat on the ball.

This is best simulated by choosing one of nine zones that the strike zone is broken up into. The same nine zones you see for hot and cold zones.

The game should then allow for some non solid contact in zones adjacent to the zone you swung for should the ball be in one of those adjacent zones.

Then just as in real life its about timing from there.

I just dont see how any other method comes close to being as real and all my fellow higheat warriors stand united in this front

In HH you cauld almost feel the contact with the ball. And man did it feel good.

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

How does one pull an outside pitch in order to execute a hit and run with zone hitting?

[mwjr]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

I want the MVP system where you don't see a cursor, but if you don't aim towards the ball with the L stick, you may miss it.

That's what I want as well. Fact is, I've been using the left stick to reach for balls, as if I were zone hitting. It's just a habit I can't break.

[serialmike]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

How does one pull an outside pitch in order to execute a hit and run with zone hitting?

How does one do that in real life....Exactly you dont.

[mwjr]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

How does one pull an outside pitch in order to execute a hit and run with zone hitting?

And how does one pull an outside pitch in order to execute a hit and run with cursor hitting?

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

And how does one pull an outside pitch in order to execute a hit and run with cursor hitting?

i'm not arguing in favor of cursor hitting. I don't think you can.

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

How does one do that in real life....Exactly you dont.

Well, that's not true.

[mwjr]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

i'm not arguing in favor of cursor hitting. I don't think you can.

Oh, I know. I was just trying to point out that neither is perfect. But the fact of the matter is, any good hitter worth his salt isn't going to try and pull that outside pitch; he's going to try and go the other way with it.

[phillyfan23]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

Well, that's not true.

i agree with jayhawker here, that in real life it is absolutely possible to pull an outside pitch.

However, jay, you insinuate that it's not possible to do this with zone hitting and you're wrong on this one if you think you ccan't do that with zone hitting.

to pull an outside pitch using zone, you aim the bat to the outside portion of the plate and swing EARLY, just like you do in real life. You won't get a lot of solid contact doing this just as in real life, but this can be done and i did this a lot last year on hit and runs and moving the runner to 3rd with no outs, or the runner home with less than 2 outs.

[SoxFan01605]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

Oh, I know. I was just trying to point out that neither is perfect. But the fact of the matter is, any good hitter worth his salt isn't going to try and pull that outside pitch; he's going to try and go the other way with it.

Well, in the example given he might. If the runner is going for a hit and run, the batter may very well try to pull that pitch to protect him. This is very possible in zone, cursor, and influence...it's just all about how they are achieved with each mechanic.

My problem with a system focused on influence for this is that often times it has been overdone and ends up overriding basic physics. I think, in terms of the debate for one mechanic over another, it comes down to different user priorities for them. It's "feel" vs results essentially. I think cursor hitting, when done right, provides the best results, despite a somewhat less intuitive feel.

Putting all that aside, I must say that despite my disappointment with the removal of the option, I did come away from the demo relatively impressed with how fluid the swing stick was this year. I've NEVER been a fan of the swing stick (regardless of the game) but I didn't hold this version in the same contempt I've held others...lol.

What remains to be seen is how it all comes together in the truly finalized product (meaning with the inclusion of the patched in check swing). As long as the hit variety is respectable and the check swing works well, I'll be able to look past the exclusion of my favorite hitting mechanic.

[DonkeyJote]

Re: yikes! is thus true? hitting only timing?

Okay...first I want to say that they did a good job fixing the timing and control of the swing stick.

However, "timing only" hitting is basically video game softball. The cursor last year was more realistic, but it doesn't work b/c it should have a null position. I want the MVP system where you don't see a cursor, but if you don't aim towards the ball with the L stick, you may miss it.

That's not how the MVP system worked...