Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

[rudyjuly2]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

The comparison video was a lot worse last year when the 2K9 video was showing outfielders flat out missing the ball and other basic errors. I think they should avoid highlighting the really embarrassing things.

[J_Posse]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I like what they've done graphically with 2K11. I'm sure they'd like to improve the graphics a lot more, but either the graphics engine or the need to keep the game at 60 FPS is hindering them. We likely won't see a huge jump in graphical quality on this current console generation, but they are making improvements.

My only gripes are with the fact that batting gloves, fielding gloves and bats still look sub-par. The fielding glove looks like a clay molding on the players' hands, while the batting glove still has no detail or pop to it. It may not happen, yet I'd love to see helmets and hats being removed or falling off of the players. Sweaty hat stains (sounds gross) would also be a small touch that would be nice to see.

[Blzer]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

And why does 2k always bashes the game they made last year. On what will they talk down about 11 when 12 rolls around next year? Doesn't really makes me believe them this time again...

I've tried to make this point many times before. Now I've just given up haha.

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I've tried to make this point many times before. Now I've just given up haha.

It's a red herring. We all know that they released their last three games with problems. We then demand that they admit this and fix it.

So the next year rolls around, they admit it and fix it, but we bash them for doing so. It's not enough that we complain about what they get wrong (which I support), but I don't get this idea that we need to complain about how they tell us what they fixed. It's just a backhanded way to bash the developers for having released a game with bugs last year.

We have list after list in this forum about what we didn't like about 2K10. I think it is really disingenuous to call the developers on admitting their mistakes.

[jeffy777]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I appreciate their honesty. I'd much rather them admit the problems rather than pretend like they never existed, which is what some other developers do and it's very annoying. This is a much better route because this way we know that the issues are actually being addressed rather than swept under the carpet. Instead of acting like all the previous games were perfect, they are showing us that they acknowledge the problems and are actively improving them. I have to tip my hat to VC for this. I wish all developers would be this honest, but it requires swallowing your pride and not everyone is willing to do that.

Hopefully, now that they've had a couple full years of development under their belt, they've worked through most of the big problems so that next year there will only be minor issues mentioned when they look back on 2K11. Again, I say hopefully......but I really think they are making good progress with this series.

[Blzer]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I think it is really disingenuous to call the developers on admitting their mistakes.

I appreciate their honesty. I'd much rather them admit the problems rather than pretend like they never existed, which is what some other developers do and it's very annoying.

I understand what you're saying, but the issue is the timing. Last year for 2K10, before the game came out they made no admittance whatsoever about zombie faces, lack of errors and injuries, and whatever else may have plagued the game. Instead they avoid saying anything about these issues to make a fast buck. I'm sure this makes sense on their end, but instead they'll only admit these things later, after the game drops from $60 and the next iteration is announced.

I would prefer they were just brutally honest from the get-go. The only thing they did it for last year was check swings, and you can see how things can be caught on and implemented instantly if they let us know about the game's concerns before they release it.

[duke776]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I appreciate their honesty. I'd much rather them admit the problems rather than pretend like they never existed, which is what some other developers do and it's very annoying. This is a much better route because this way we know that the issues are actually being addressed rather than swept under the carpet. Instead of acting like all the previous games were perfect, they are showing us that they acknowledge the problems and are actively improving them. I have to tip my hat to VC for this. I wish all developers would be this honest, but it requires swallowing your pride and not everyone is willing to do that.

That's basically how I look at it. I mean it sucks to have big issues that can suck the fun out of the game, but it sucks even more when they are ignored or not acknowleged IMO.

[JayhawkerStL]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I understand what you're saying, but the issue is the timing. Last year for 2K10, before the game came out they made no admittance whatsoever about zombie faces, lack of errors and injuries, and whatever else may have plagued the game. Instead they avoid saying anything about these issues to make a fast buck. I'm sure this makes sense on their end, but instead they'll only admit these things later, after the game drops from $60 and the next iteration is announced.

I would prefer they were just brutally honest from the get-go. The only thing they did it for last year was check swings, and you can see how things can be caught on and implemented instantly if they let us know about the game's concerns before they release it.

But it's not true. They admitted last year they could not get errors in the game, becasue they couldn't add animations via a patch.

I never felt like they pretended that the problems didn't exist. I thought they were up front about what they were not fixing, and what they were.

[Segagendude]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

In the past, our players have sported a zombie-like, wide-eyed expression

They actually admit to this. Always nice to see a dev admit their past mistakes.....

Doesn't look too bad thus far.

[SoxFan01605]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I understand what you're saying, but the issue is the timing. Last year for 2K10, before the game came out they made no admittance whatsoever about zombie faces, lack of errors and injuries, and whatever else may have plagued the game. Instead they avoid saying anything about these issues to make a fast buck. I'm sure this makes sense on their end, but instead they'll only admit these things later, after the game drops from $60 and the next iteration is announced.

I would prefer they were just brutally honest from the get-go. The only thing they did it for last year was check swings, and you can see how things can be caught on and implemented instantly if they let us know about the game's concerns before they release it.

I see what you're saying, and idealistically, I guess I would agree. I just think that's a somewhat unrealistic expectation though. Maybe "unfair" is too strong a term, but it seems at least "unbalanced" to pin something like that on 2K. Look at any game on this site (even the universally praised ones) and they ship with issues that you don't find out about until we all start griping about them. Nobody admits failures ahead of time...sometimes it's because it's not found until we find them and sometimes it's not worth mentioning. 2K did, at least, cop to some mistakes last year and explained why they could or couldn't get it patched...they were panned for that too though...lol. That's really about the most you can expect from any developer though (with maybe a few exceptions).

As for the problems themselves, the zombie faces wasn't unique to MLB 2K and certainly not to 2K10...there was really nothing to "admit." We all knew what we were getting as we saw the pics year after year. It's no different than when a more reputed developer touts a player model improvement over previous iterations as one of the big new things when it has been noticeable for several years.

It doesn't mean they've been selling to us falsely, it simply means that once they got it right, they say so and explain how/why it's better. It's simply more noticeable as an "issue" with a franchise like MLB 2K because it has had so many hiccups along the way and so many people don't trust them (understandably so, but that's not anything they can change overnight).

As for bigger problems like fielding, I could make similar comparisons to other developers, but it's hard to compare in generalities and specifics aren't allowed...lol. Needless to say this isn't a unique "issue" to VC. Again, the only difference is, because so many people are down on 2K baseball, they get called out for it while others don't.

I guess my feeling is that, at the end of it all, VC is doing the best thing they can do until they get some more credibility for their series: keep it simple, short, and focused on problem-solving. They don't get credit for it (and maybe, given the series' history, that's fair), but it's certainly better than the alternative (the overhype for a sub-par product and ignoring consumer complaints-i.e how it was approached before VC took back over).

Of course, none of that matter if 2K11 doesn't show improvement, but that's kind of the point also...these tactics only stand out to people because of MLB 2K's lack of success. It's kind of a backwards association IMO.

[rudyjuly2]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

But it's not true. They admitted last year they could not get errors in the game, becasue they couldn't add animations via a patch.

There is NO excuse for shipping the game without errors in the first place and there is NO excuse for not being able to fix the issue. Nothing they could have said about this would have satisfied me.

Hits, runs and ERRORS are the three things listed on any standard box score. And no injuries is ridiculous too. Last year EVERY MLB team used at least 7 starters and over half of them used 10 or more. Some of that is due to performance but much of that is due to injury. 25% of the money spent on pitchers in baseball is wasted on the DL.

I think we all expect these things fixed for 2K11. I just hope there isn't another big omission or bug that gets released with the game. The PS3 guys got screwed over last year as we didn't get an early patch and only got one much later. Games released with these conditions give the new patch generation a bad name. Just rush a flawed game to meet a deadline and use the public as free beta testers. Sometimes it sucks.

[jeffy777]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I see what you're saying, and idealistically, I guess I would agree. I just think that's a somewhat unrealistic expectation though. Maybe "unfair" is too strong a term, but it seems at least "unbalanced" to pin something like that on 2K. Look at any game on this site (even the universally praised ones) and they ship with issues that you don't find out about until we all start griping about them. Nobody admits failures ahead of time...sometimes it's because it's not found until we find them and sometimes it's not worth mentioning. 2K did, at least, cop to some mistakes last year and explained why they could or couldn't get it patched...they were panned for that too though...lol. That's really about the most you can expect from any developer though (with maybe a few exceptions).

As for the problems themselves, the zombie faces wasn't unique to MLB 2K and certainly not to 2K10...there was really nothing to "admit." We all knew what we were getting as we saw the pics year after year. It's no different than when a more reputed developer touts a player model improvement over previous iterations as one of the big new things when it has been noticeable for several years.

It doesn't mean they've been selling to us falsely, it simply means that once they got it right, they say so and explain how/why it's better. It's simply more noticeable as an "issue" with a franchise like MLB 2K because it has had so many hiccups along the way and so many people don't trust them (understandably so, but that's not anything they can change overnight).

As for bigger problems like fielding, I could make similar comparisons to other developers, but it's hard to compare in generalities and specifics aren't allowed...lol. Needless to say this isn't a unique "issue" to VC. Again, the only difference is, because so many people are down on 2K baseball, they get called out for it while others don't.

I guess my feeling is that, at the end of it all, VC is doing the best thing they can do until they get some more credibility for their series: keep it simple, short, and focused on problem-solving. They don't get credit for it (and maybe, given the series' history, that's fair), but it's certainly better than the alternative (the overhype for a sub-par product and ignoring consumer complaints-i.e how it was approached before VC took back over).

Of course, none of that matter if 2K11 doesn't show improvement, but that's kind of the point also...these tactics only stand out to people because of MLB 2K's lack of success. It's kind of a backwards association IMO.

That's a good way to put it.

[NINJAK2]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

I understand what you're saying, but the issue is the timing. Last year for 2K10, before the game came out they made no admittance whatsoever about zombie faces, lack of errors and injuries, and whatever else may have plagued the game. Instead they avoid saying anything about these issues to make a fast buck. I'm sure this makes sense on their end, but instead they'll only admit these things later, after the game drops from $60 and the next iteration is announced.

I would prefer they were just brutally honest from the get-go. .

You make a good point but you may be a little unrealistic with that expectation. Expecting game companies to tell you what a game's problems are before you buy it is like expecting movie studios to tell you a movie stinks before u get a chance to buy a ticket.

Good diary but it would be cool to see those side by side comparisons in video form.

[Pared]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

Nothing they could have said about this would have satisfied me.

That's all you really had to say. There's not much to discuss if you feel this way as it wouldn't be a discussion - it would be you not listening to anything anyone else says or any reasoning.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: MLB 2K11 Developer Diary #2 - 2K10 vs 2K11 Side-by-Side Comparison

You make a good point but you may be a little unrealistic with that expectation. Expecting game companies to tell you what a game's problems are before you buy it is like expecting movie studios to tell you a movie stinks before u get a chance to buy a ticket.

Good diary but it would be cool to see those side by side comparisons in video form.

Yeah, I don't expect them to point out what is wrong, but it'd be completely different if they specifically said something was in the game that wasn't...either by their own admittance or in response to a question.

These guys, like every other game, are trying to sell their game and in doing so, they are going to tell you what the game does right and does well. We know things are going to be wrong or missing and those things will be made loud and clear a day or two after release, which is why I wait.

The good thing about Q&A sessions is they often have to answer these questions before hand and it gives us a lot of insight of what we can and cannot expect...this is probably why 2K has basically pulled the plug over the last few years. With some much missing and wrong, they didn't want to tip their hand before they had to.