Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

[bkrich83]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Thats right.

yup, no matter what anyone says that disputes it, you'll just come up with another one of your little excuses, or will come back with the "That's not what I meant" reply as per usual.

If you want to believe something as ridiculous as Kent and Bonds were a better 1, 2 punch than Gehrig and Ruth, and that Bonds accomplishments in '01 were far greater than Gehrig and Ruth's it's your choice.

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

yup, no matter what anyone says that disputes it, you'll just come up with another one of your little excuses, or will come back with the "That's not what I meant" reply as per usual.

If you want to believe something as ridiculous as Kent and Bonds were a better 1, 2 punch than Gehrig and Ruth, and that Bonds accomplishments in '01 were far greater than Gehrig and Ruth's it's your choice.

Its not ridiculous. Bonds had such an amazing season it compensated for his red-necked friend.

[Brandon13]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

I think this pretty much shows just how dominate Ruth and Gehrig were:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...L_1927_t.shtml

And here is the same thing but showing the 2001 season:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/le...L_2001_t.shtml

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

I never said it was special...I was just giving you the year.

Yeah, I know. It was a nice get. I still think he mentioned those guys as an excuse to say that quote.

[bkrich83]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Its not ridiculous. Bonds had such an amazing season it compensated for his red-necked friend.

Gehrig and Ruth each out homered teams, not other players but teams.

They did it in an era, where the pitching talent pool wasn't watered down, and 95% of the parks weren't bandboxes, not to mention it wasn't the greatest HR hitting era of all time either. I won't even go in to the chemical differences.


Bonds hit 73 homers, and drew a ton of walks, but I don't see his season as much better if any better than Gehrig or Ruth's.

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Gehrig and Ruth each out homered teams, not other players but teams.

Yeah because the HR wasnt emphasized in the 1910s. Thats all this means. Its not because it was more difficult or anything like that. They were forerunners. Thats all.

They did it in an era, where the pitching talent pool wasn't watered down, and 95% of the parks weren't bandboxes, not to mention it wasn't the greatest HR hitting era of all time either. I won't even go in to the chemical differences.

No.

Bonds hit 73 homers, and drew a ton of walks, but I don't see his season as much better if any better than Gehrig or Ruth's.

By now, this much is obvious.

FWIW, we had a good discussion in the Babe Ruth thread a while back about this.

[bkrich83]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Yeah because the HR wasnt emphasized in the 1910s. Thats all this means. Its not because it was more difficult or anything like that. They were forerunners. Thats all.

LOL, another typical Gluckich Excuse.

No.

So, the pitching hasn't been watered down due to expansion? That 98 to 2002 time wasn't the greatest HR hitting era of all time? And the ballparks aren't smaller?

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

LOL, another typical Gluckich Excuse.



So, the pitching hasn't been watered down due to expansion? That 98 to 2002 time wasn't the greatest HR hitting era of all time? And the ballparks aren't smaller?

Watered down relative to what? How many kids have been playing organized baseball in the last 20 years vs the 20 years before Babe Ruth? Yeah, there were fewer teams but now there's also more people and greater opportunity exists to participate in baseball and be discovered. So what is the ratio of kids playing HS baseball to the # of MLB players back in the day compared to now? Plus then it was a white mans league, now its not only integrated, its global. Again, youre chasing the wrong bone. The fact that more people were hitting more HRs means it was emphasized more. Strike out totals have also been going through the roof. Batters are opting for the high risk/high reward route. I often hear that ballparks are smaller. Yeah, todays parks are smaller to center field but a lot of those stadiums back in the day had extremely deep fences in center and extremely short porches down the line. Its amazing how the short porches often get overlooked when people mention "bigger ballparks". So were they truly bigger? Doubtful, its six of one, half a dozen of another.

[SPTO]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

What year was that? I call BS. You just mentioned Spahn/Sain as an excuse to say, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain".

I know it's a fact, here's proof:

During the 1948 season, he combined with teammate Johnny Sain to anchor a pitching rotation that was generally considered to be exceptionally weak otherwise, resulting in the saying, "Spahn and Sain and pray for rain."

Actually i'd say that's more applicable to the '47 season but you get the gist of it.

(from Wiki)

[Jistic]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Pretty tough to top Ruth and Gehrig, imo.

It's a waste of breath to even pretend there is any better combo.

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

LOL, another typical Gluckich Excuse.



So, the pitching hasn't been watered down due to expansion? That 98 to 2002 time wasn't the greatest HR hitting era of all time? And the ballparks aren't smaller?

Just an FYI on the batting averages:

http://www.cosmicbaseball.com/jcba20_rulesacs.html

1889 The sacrifice bunt is statistically recognized, but the batter is charged with a time at bat. 10.09
1893 A batter credited with a sacrifice is not charged with a time at bat. 10.09
1908 The sacrifice fly rule is adopted, exempting the batter from an at-bat when a run scores after a catch. 10.09
1912 Earned runs are charged to a pitcher when a player scores by means of safe hits, sacrifice hits, bases on balls, hit batters, wild pitches, and balks. 10.18
1926 The sacrifice fly rule is amended to exempt a batter from an at-bat when a runner advances from first to second or second to third as well as on scoring. 10.09
1931 The sacrifice fly is eliminated. 10.09
1939 A batter is credited with a sacrifice fly and not charged with a time at bat if he hits a fly ball that is caught and a runner scores on the catch. This rule lasted only a year.

[Misfit]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Yeah because the HR wasnt emphasized in the 1910s. Thats all this means. Its not because it was more difficult or anything like that. They were forerunners. Thats all.

Gehrig didn't debut until 1923, I believe, and didn't break out until 1927.

I'd go with the easy answer of Gehrig and Ruth because they both hit a lot of home runs and were both tough to get out. In 1927 Gehrig hit .373 and Ruth hit .356 and the duo combined for 107 long-balls and 236 walks. That had to be the most feared duo in the history of the game.

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Gehrig didn't debut until 1923, I believe, and didn't break out until 1927.

I'd go with the easy answer of Gehrig and Ruth because they both hit a lot of home runs and were both tough to get out. In 1927 Gehrig hit .373 and Ruth hit .356 and the duo combined for 107 long-balls and 236 walks. That had to be the most feared duo in the history of the game.

How many times did they fly out and advance a runner to second or third?

[Misfit]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Ruth = 14
Gehrig = 21

Thats total sac hits, I do not know how many of those were runners going from second to third or first to second (I'd assume very few for first to second). If you count all of those sac hits as At-bats each hit:

Gehrig = .360
Ruth = .347

Still damn impressive.

EDIT: To further add, after 1930 without the benefit of any sacrifice hits both had some monster seasons:

Gehrig (1934) = .363/.465/.706
Ruth (1931) = .373/.495/.700

Ruth also had seasons of extraordinarily high averages before 1926 (including his career high of .393) and Gehrig had several .340 plus seasons after 1930.

[glucklich]

Re: Best One Two Punch In the History Of Baseball

Ruth = 14
Gehrig = 21

Thats total sac hits, I do not know how many of those were runners going from second to third or first to second (I'd assume very few for first to second). If you count all of those sac hits as At-bats each hit:

Gehrig = .360
Ruth = .347

Still damn impressive.

EDIT: To further add, after 1930 without the benefit of any sacrifice hits both had some monster seasons:

Gehrig (1934) = .363/.465/.706
Ruth (1931) = .373/.495/.700

Ruth also had seasons of extraordinarily high averages before 1926 (including his career high of .393) and Gehrig had several .340 plus seasons after 1930.