Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

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  • GBrushTWood
    Banned
    • Mar 2003
    • 1624

    #1

    Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

    Found this amusing to read this morning.


    Little and Penny were ejected during a lengthy argument with plate umpire Rick Reed in the fifth inning.

    With the Padres leading 4-2 in the fifth, Adrian Gonzalez walked on a 3-2 pitch to give San Diego runners on first and second with none out. Little came out to the mound to confer with Penny.

    Penny said Dodgers second baseman Jeff Kent told catcher Russell Martin that the pitch was a strike.

    "The umpire said something derogatory to Kent," Penny said. "If he never would have said anything to Kent, it wouldn't have happened."

    Reed confirmed that he responded to Kent.

    Little turned and walked off the mound to talk to Reed.

    "I'm trying to defuse the situation that could have gotten out of hand earlier than it did," Little said. "But it got out of hand anyway, so what are you going to do?"

    Little returned to the mound, then went back to the dugout.

    San Diego manager Bruce Bochy came out to argue with Reed that Little had made two mound visits.

    "He's got to come out of that game. That was my argument," Bochy said. "If he doesn't come out, I have to protest the game."

    Reed, however, said afterward that Penny would have to leave after pitching to the next batter.

    The four umpires huddled for a few minutes before Reed walked toward the Dodgers' dugout to tell Little he had indeed made two mound visits.

    "He understood but he wasn't real happy. He was ejected over that play," Reed said.

    Reed went to the mound and handed the ball to Penny. Mixing in some expletives, the big right-hander told Reed: "If you called that a strike, that never would have happened."

    Penny was tossed, and had to be pulled away by first base coach Mariano Duncan and bench coach Dave Jauss.

    The entire sequence lasted about 15 minutes.
    It's amazing that this mental deficient is even allowed near a baseball clubhouse, nevermind even managing a professional Major League Baseball franchise. Everybody in baseball knows that a manager can only make one mound visit per inning to confer with the pitcher. The moment he steps off that mound, the visit is finished. If he steps on the mound again, his pitcher is gone; it's that simple.

    The fact that Bochy pointed this out while Little was sheepishly backed into a corner just illustrates that other managers (who themsleves may be morons) are playing chess, while this rube is playing Connect 4. I kinda feel bad for Dodger fans (but not too bad) that they will have to endure Gump for the forseeable future. Don't be fooled, he WILL cost you critical games at the most inopportune times. It's just a matter of when, not if.
  • CMH
    Making you famous
    • Oct 2002
    • 26203

    #2
    Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

    There's a catch to all this, though.

    Little didn't intentionally step off the mound because he was done with his visit. He stepped off to handle a situation with the umpire because Jeff Kent had exchanged words with him.

    I agree that Little should have been aware of his actions, but I give him a pass considering everything that happened.
    "It may well be that we spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able to truly see, articulate and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence." - David Foster Wallace

    "You'll not find more penny-wise/pound-foolish behavior than in Major League Baseball." - Rob Neyer

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    • Chip Douglass
      Hall Of Fame
      • Dec 2005
      • 12256

      #3
      Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

      The previous mound visit was to make sure Penny was not injured after being struck by a linedrive on his leg....he might have been arguing the first mound visit wasn't official considering the situation.

      He might not have been aware the second time, considering there was a balls-and-strikes arguement occuring and he went to confer with Penny.
      I write things on the Internet.

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      • CMH
        Making you famous
        • Oct 2002
        • 26203

        #4
        Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

        Originally posted by Olson-for-Heisman
        The previous mound visit was to make sure Penny was not injured after being struck by a linedrive on his leg....he might have been arguing the first mound visit wasn't official considering the situation.

        He might not have been aware the second time, considering there was a balls-and-strikes arguement occuring and he went to confer with Penny.
        Nah, that's not what happened. You got the right idea, but it's more intricate than that.

        Grady Little going to the mound:

        (1) Visits the mound because Penny appears injured. Umpire agrees that it is not an official mound visit. Mound visits: 0

        (2) Little visits mound to talk to Penny. Mound visits: 1

        Now here is when things get crazy for Little.

        Little steps away from the mound to speak to the umpire (Reed I believe is his name) because of an argument going on between Reed and Jeff Kent.

        (3) Little steps back on the mound to finish his discussion with Penny. However, according to the rule books, Little is on the mound a second time. Mound visits: 2

        Little, apparently (and I don't place too much blame on him for this) didn't think he was visiting the mound a second time because well, he didn't go back to the dugout and then come out again. He merely stepped off the mound, spoke to the umpire, and stepped on the mound again.

        However, according to the rules, when Little stepped off the mound to speak to the umpire he officially ended his mound visit with Penny. By stepping back on he made a second visit.

        I just can't put too much blame on Little for this. It was a confusing, frustrating 15 minutes. Penny basically said the most intelligent thing. ''If [the umpire] never would have said anything to Kent, it wouldn't have happened.''
        "It may well be that we spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able to truly see, articulate and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence." - David Foster Wallace

        "You'll not find more penny-wise/pound-foolish behavior than in Major League Baseball." - Rob Neyer

        Comment

        • SPTO
          binging
          • Feb 2003
          • 68046

          #5
          Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

          I know Grady Little is a popular punching bag but something similar happened with Willie Randolph earlier this year when El Duque decided to go crazy and pitch near Troy Glaus' head.

          Randolph went to calm Hernandez down then stepped off the mound and had words with the HP umpire. He then went back to the mound and it was put to his attention that he had to replace Hernandez because he'd made 2 "trips" to the mound.

          So as stupid as Little is at times, it can happen to anyone in the heat of an argument or chaotic situation.
          Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

          "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

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          • Stu
            All Star
            • Jun 2004
            • 7924

            #6
            Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

            What did Little do after they told him he had to remove the pitcher? It said he got ejected, which seems like the smartest move in that case. The manager should get ejected and have a long drawn out argument, giving time for a reliever to warm up.
            Sim Gaming Network

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            • Chip Douglass
              Hall Of Fame
              • Dec 2005
              • 12256

              #7
              Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

              Originally posted by SPTO
              I know Grady Little is a popular punching bag but something similar happened with Willie Randolph earlier this year when El Duque decided to go crazy and pitch near Troy Glaus' head.

              Randolph went to calm Hernandez down then stepped off the mound and had words with the HP umpire. He then went back to the mound and it was put to his attention that he had to replace Hernandez because he'd made 2 "trips" to the mound.

              So as stupid as Little is at times, it can happen to anyone in the heat of an argument or chaotic situation.
              The point is that wasn't the case here. It's in fact complicated.

              Like the poster above you said, Little stepped away from the mound to speak to the umpire because of an argument going on between Reed and Jeff Kent.

              Little steps back on the mound to finish his dicussion with Penny. This is where he was ruled to have gone on the mound a SECOND time.

              He was simply conferring with Penny, stepped off the mound for a side conversation with an umpire interfering. He then went back on the mound to finish the conversation, but the umpire mistook it for a SECOND mound visit, so therefore it was an invalid removal of the pitcher.
              Last edited by Chip Douglass; 08-24-2006, 03:34 PM.
              I write things on the Internet.

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              • SPTO
                binging
                • Feb 2003
                • 68046

                #8
                Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                Originally posted by Olson-for-Heisman

                He was simply conferring with Penny, stepped off the mound for a side conversation with an umpire interfering. He then went back on the mound to finish the conversation, but the umpire mistook it for a SECOND mound visit, so therefore it was an invalid removal of the pitcher.
                That's basically what happened with Randolph. IIRC he was ejected as well. I know you're a huge Dodger fan and trying to stick up for Little here but as rare as it is these complications can crop up elsewhere.
                Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

                Comment

                • CoRruPt-
                  MVP
                  • Jun 2005
                  • 1279

                  #9
                  Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                  Originally posted by SPTO
                  That's basically what happened with Randolph. IIRC he was ejected as well. I know you're a huge Dodger fan and trying to stick up for Little here but as rare as it is these complications can crop up elsewhere.
                  But that was a different situation when the Mets played us.

                  I believe Willie went out to talk to El Duque, went back to the dugout, and then came back out to talk to El Duque again. I might be wrong on that, but I'm quite sure that's what I saw.

                  This was a different situation. But just a lot of semantics being tossed around here.

                  Comment

                  • Chip Douglass
                    Hall Of Fame
                    • Dec 2005
                    • 12256

                    #10
                    Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                    Originally posted by SPTO
                    That's basically what happened with Randolph. IIRC he was ejected as well. I know you're a huge Dodger fan and trying to stick up for Little here but as rare as it is these complications can crop up elsewhere.
                    From what I saw during that game, Randolph went out twice on SEPERATE occasions.

                    I might be wrong, so feel free to correct me.
                    I write things on the Internet.

                    Comment

                    • CoRruPt-
                      MVP
                      • Jun 2005
                      • 1279

                      #11
                      Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                      Originally posted by Olson-for-Heisman
                      From what I saw during that game, Randolph went out twice on SEPERATE occasions.

                      I might be wrong, so feel free to correct me.
                      I believe it's the same inning that he did it, and you can't have two mound visits in the same inning because that 2nd visit signifies the manager is making a pitching change. Again, I'm not clear on this... the game was a while ago.

                      EDIT - Ah, I actually found the game wrap for that particular game SPTO and I were talking about. I quote from: http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/NASA...=.jsp&c_id=tor

                      Hernandez (4-7) threw one more pitch -- a high and tight fastball to Troy Glaus -- before being forced to leave the game. After the pitch, home plate umpire C.B. Bucknor issued warnings to both benches and New York manager Willie Randolph walked onto the field to discuss the call with the officials. When Randolph also spoke to Hernandez, he was charged with a second mound visit because Mets pitching coach Rick Peterson came out earlier in the inning.
                      Last edited by CoRruPt-; 08-24-2006, 08:00 PM.

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                      • Blzer
                        Resident film pundit
                        • Mar 2004
                        • 42520

                        #12
                        Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                        Not having read every post except the first one, I'll give my input on what I thought the rule was:


                        Once you make a mound visit, you have until the baseline to be able to go back and converse (of course, until your mound visit time expires). If you decide to make a second mound visit that inning, you are forced to pull out your pitcher. However, should you tell the umpire you want to make a double-switch, it must be made before crossing the baseline.


                        For some reason I always thought it had to do with the baseline. Perhaps I was wrong.
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                        • SPTO
                          binging
                          • Feb 2003
                          • 68046

                          #13
                          Re: Shocking: Grady Little doesn't know the rules of baseball

                          Thanks corrupt for the clarification. So I was a little off but the general principle holds true.
                          Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                          "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

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