Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

Collapse

Recommended Videos

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • NYJets
    Hall Of Fame
    • Jul 2002
    • 18637

    #16
    Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

    How about we wait and see how often he actually uses this clause before we go nuts about it? I don't know how much he used it in Houston, but it's not like he's only going to show up on days he's pitching.

    He has it in there to have the option to do it, and I'm guessing he'll use it some of the time, but I don't think that means he'll be sitting at home watching tv 5 days a week and show up only when he has to pitch.

    If I'm wrong, then I'll agree that it's a problem, but I don't think it will be that big a problem. I think he'll take a couple of days here and there, but I don't think that's the biggest deal in the world
    Originally posted by Jay Bilas
    The question isn't whether UConn belongs with the elites, but over the last 20 years, whether the rest of the college basketball elite belongs with UConn

    Comment

    • Brandon13
      All Star
      • Oct 2005
      • 8915

      #17
      Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

      I've never disputed that Clemens is probably only doing this for the money. Is it selfish? Yes, but I place the blame with the organization here, not the player.

      I wouldn't have signed him to a contract like this, btw, I just don't really care that the Yankees did. If Clemens comes in and wins games you're not gonna here too many people griping about the contract.

      Comment

      • chippered
        MVP
        • Aug 2002
        • 1528

        #18
        Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

        I didnt take the time to read the other replies, but its up to the team as to whether he can get away with certain things. Its the same as contracts and the such. If a team doesnt offer it, the player wont get it. He didnt hold a gun to anybodies head and say, sign me, with these clauses, or I'll shoot! Not saying I like Clemens, but its amazing how the player is knocked for taking the deal, but the owner gets no blame.

        I feel the same way about the steroid controversy, but thats a whole other debate...
        GT = Chippered

        Brewers League Baseball
        Indianapolis Clowns

        Comment

        • NYJets
          Hall Of Fame
          • Jul 2002
          • 18637

          #19
          Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

          Originally posted by Knight165
          I agree with you shug.....
          and it makes the Yankees making that "cheap a$$" bid for Dice-K even more of a mystery.
          They knew they were going to need pitching.
          Dice-K looked/looks like the real deal and they underwhelm everyone with the bid. Granted...the Sox blew everyone out of the water...but with the B.S. contract for Clemens(who I don't think is that good anymore) is on par with signing a young obviously talented pitcher.
          Nuts.

          M.K.
          Knight165
          I don't think it was a cheap bid, nobody expected the bid to be anywhere near 52 million. Most expected it to be up to around 30 million, and even that seemed ridiculous, seeing as it was around 13 million for Ichiro I believe.

          I guess Cashman messed up, but I think it was because he didn't estimate the market correctly. Not because they didn't want him badly enough.
          Originally posted by Jay Bilas
          The question isn't whether UConn belongs with the elites, but over the last 20 years, whether the rest of the college basketball elite belongs with UConn

          Comment

          • Knight165
            *ll St*r
            • Feb 2003
            • 24964

            #20
            Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

            Originally posted by NYJets
            I don't think it was a cheap bid, nobody expected the bid to be anywhere near 52 million. Most expected it to be up to around 30 million, and even that seemed ridiculous, seeing as it was around 13 million for Ichiro I believe.

            I guess Cashman messed up, but I think it was because he didn't estimate the market correctly. Not because they didn't want him badly enough.
            My point is...the Yankees are bucking up BIG TIME to get a rental when they could have blew everyone away to get a piece of the puzzle. I just don't get it.

            M.K.
            Knight165
            All gave some. Some gave all. 343

            Comment

            • mjb2124
              Hall Of Fame
              • Aug 2002
              • 13649

              #21
              Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

              Originally posted by shugknight
              Yes I do blame part of the embarrassment to the Yankees, but cmon, this team basically had their 5th starter for their Single A team pitching for them. They had no choice. Even their top prospect pitcher, who they didn't want even coming up to the big leagues for another year or two, had to pitch for them, and then get injured. But you have to think about it like this...

              Lets say Clemens talks to Boston, New York, and Houston. Tells them that if they would like for him to pitch for their team, they have to agree to a few stipulations..

              a) get paid 4.5 million a month
              b) doesn't have to travel to away games with the team
              and
              c) gets to stay at home on days he's not pitching

              All 3 teams think among themselves, and each team thinks, "this guy is crazy for asking these ridiculous clauses, HOWEVER, we do need need a starting pitcher really bad."

              Don't you think that if the Yanks declined to offer him this ridiculous contract, one of these others teams would? simply because of what Clemens brings to the table?

              You also have to think about it as a strategic plan by the Yankees... By signing Clemens to this stupid contract, they've blocked their biggest rival, the Red Sox, from signing him. Which kinda kills 2 birds with 1 stone.

              So you have to think about it like that.. If the Yankees declined to agree to all those clauses, don't you think some other team would?

              So you can't really blame the team. You blame the person that came up with the clauses first. The team just had to suck it up and sign him.
              I still blame the team in this circumstance. I don't care if the Yankees were down to their last resort or had their 5th starter for their single A team pitching for them (which is a pretty big exaggeration), they agreed to the clauses. There are other moves they could have made outside of this one and I'm sure they would have gone down that road if they weren't comfortable with these clauses. Fact is, they agreed to everything Clemens put on the table and agreed to pay him the salary they did. That's on the Yankees shoulders. They didn't have to sign him as you say. That was their choice.

              I don't like that teams allow Clemens to get away with this, but I don't fault him for it. It's the teams responsibility to decline the clauses they feel might be detrimental to the team (there are many in every baseball players contract that get rejected/approved). Like I said earlier, when I get offered a job, I don't accept the first salary offered. I negotiate for more. It's up to the company to say "This is our final offer".

              It was the same with Arod a number of years ago. Was it his fault Texas was willing to pay him 25 MIL per year? Nope. That fell on the shoulders of the Rangers organization.
              Last edited by mjb2124; 05-15-2007, 10:38 PM.

              Comment

              • shugknight
                MVP
                • Oct 2004
                • 4585

                #22
                Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                And we have our first case of this team only going downhill.. I can see this topic bring alot of animosity in the clubhouse and Farnsworth is the only one thats man enough to bring up the topic. I'm pretty sure he's not the only one with the same feeling..

                CHICAGO -- New York reliever Kyle Farnsworth thinks no one on the Yankees, not even Roger Clemens, should be allowed to leave the team when they aren't pitching.

                Farnsworth was on Chicago's 670 AM The Score on Thursday morning when he first criticized the so-called "family plan" clause in Clemens' one-year, $28 million contract that allows the right-hander to leave the team for personal matters when he's not pitching.

                Farnsworth reiterated his beliefs in the clubhouse before the Yankees' 4-1 loss to the White Sox.

                "As far as a teammate and a player, I think everybody should be here whether they're pitching or not," he said. "You don't see guys who are hurt not sit on the bench. They're always there."

                Even so, Farnsworth doesn't think it's going to be a problem and didn't foresee any clubhouse tension over preferential treatment for one of the game's greatest pitchers.

                "It's just an opinion of mine. I don't think it's a concern at all," he said. "You guys asked my opinion about it and I gave it."

                The 44-year-old Clemens could join the Yankees rotation against the Blue Jays on May 28 or 29 or at Boston on June 2 or 3.

                "Whether it's going to cause a problem, we'll see," Farnsworth said. "I don't think it will. We're all professionals here and we know how to go about our jobs. As far as friction, he's going to be here to help this team win. That's the only thing that everybody is worried about."
                http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2874138

                Comment

                • TarHeelMan
                  Th* H*mb*rg*r P*mp
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 7853

                  #23
                  Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                  I like Kyle Farnsworth (mainly for the way he punked Paul Wilson a few years ago), but I wonder if he'd have made those statements if he had been having a better year and not in danger of being gotten rid of. It just sounds to me like someone who knows their time is short and basically has the attitude of "Screw it, I'm gonna say whatever".

                  Comment

                  • Orion
                    Rookie
                    • Sep 2004
                    • 155

                    #24
                    Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                    Clemens didn't put a gun to anyones head. I don't see why anyone would have a problem with someone eles employment arrangement, other than jealousy.

                    If another employer called you and offered you a huge ammount of money and told you that you only had to work 1 day per week....that you would turn it down? No that wouldn't be fair to all the other guys in the office.

                    Comment

                    • Jimplication
                      MVP
                      • Aug 2004
                      • 3591

                      #25
                      Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                      I have a strong dislike for Roger, but more power to him for setting high demands and getting them.

                      If you were applying for a job and made high demands, would you feel bad if your employer not only employed you, but agreed to the terms of your employment offer?

                      Some of the replies in here seem to imply that Roger is somehow swindling, even robbing, his employer to get what he wants. The team/employer is the one ultimately making the decision in regards to one's salary and employment benefits. Are we supposed to feel bad for the Yankees because Roger got a deal that pays him well? They could have said no, but didn't. That's business, and while I really dislike Roger, I don't really see how he is in the wrong here.

                      Good workers that have a proven track record can name their price in other industries, and this is no exception. CEO's and other big corporate hires often are overrated flops, but the companies still invest heavily in them in hopes that they will perform well. To me, this just seems like someone being rewarded for their success in a profession. If teams don't want to sign Roger under the terms of his contract, then they can tell him to take a hike. I find it amusing that there are those that seem to think Roger is some sort of hustler or swindler breaking the law by getting a nice value for what he has to offer the market.

                      As for Kyle Farnsworth's comments... They seem ridiculous to me. Low level workers work 40 hour weeks in a very structured schedule set by management; while those higher on the employment ladder have the ability to work when the want providing they are still able to adhere to the terms of their employment. If Farnsworth wants to be able to set his price and determine when he plays too, then he should bitch less and try to increase his market value. Since he has been performing so poorly and feels so strongly about others being overpaid, perhaps he should return some of the $17 million he was provided to do a job that he's proven to be marginal at best.
                      Enjoy football? Enjoy Goal Line Blitz!

                      Comment

                      • Picci
                        MVP
                        • Feb 2003
                        • 4517

                        #26
                        Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                        I have no love for Clemens. Can't hide that. However, lets just say for discussion the Yankees have a total collapse by August and are virtually near eliminated for the playoffs. What would the fans say seeing Clemens making $4.5M per month with a picture of him in the NY papers playing golf while the Yankees are on the road trip?

                        Comment

                        • aukevin
                          War Eagle, Go Braves!
                          • Dec 2002
                          • 14700

                          #27
                          Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                          I guess Clemens can ask for anything he wants, but it was the Yanks and Houston that have been giving it to him. I'm not a Clemens fan, but I can't really blame him for it. I don't think preferential treatment is right though but I'm sure there's no way they can make a rule against it.

                          Atlanta Braves
                          - Auburn Tigers - Nashville Predators

                          Comment

                          • snepp
                            We'll waste him too.
                            • Apr 2003
                            • 10007

                            #28
                            Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                            Meh, page me when Farnsworth has more than 1 decent season on his resume.
                            Member of The OS Baseball Rocket Scientists Association

                            Comment

                            • TarHeelMan
                              Th* H*mb*rg*r P*mp
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 7853

                              #29
                              Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                              Originally posted by aukevin
                              I guess Clemens can ask for anything he wants, but it was the Yanks and Houston that have been giving it to him. I'm not a Clemens fan, but I can't really blame him for it. I don't think preferential treatment is right though but I'm sure there's no way they can make a rule against it.
                              Yeah, same thing I said when it all became official, and people in the media were jumping on his case... Don't hate the playa, hate the game.

                              Comment

                              • shugknight
                                MVP
                                • Oct 2004
                                • 4585

                                #30
                                Re: Does anybody else think Clemens is a f'n baby?

                                Can you guys stop comparing this topic to regular jobs that you and I may have? That wasn't my point in making this topic. My point is that Clemens is ruining the game of baseball. Blame whoever you want, but it was Clemens who made the clauses.. It's Clemens who can decide to officially retire if nobody agreed to his crazy clauses. Yes the Yankees agreed to it, but if they didn't don't you think somebody else would?

                                HYPOTHETICALLY speaking, if Michael Jordan, in his prime, were to test free agency, and told the NBA that if a team wants to sign him, they would need to do all these crazy things for him, wouldn't you still sign him? EXACTLY MY POINT. Don't blame the Yanks cause they agreed to the clause, because I'm 100% positive that Houston or Boston would have been more than willing to sign him if the Yanks didn't.

                                Back to my point, just like what steroids has done to this sport, this "contract" will make things worst. Highly regarded players will want crazy clauses on their contracts during free agency, older players will have "outs" in possibly playing more years in the league, etc. It's all about integrity of the game, and Clemens just pissed on it.


                                **edit**

                                Hopefully this will make things much easier to understand. Stay with me for a second...

                                Ok you know how every off-season, you say "I can't believe the (input name of team here) paid so much for (insert name here).

                                Well it all started when A-Rod signed his contract with the Texas Rangers. After that, any free agent would demand a very lucrative contract. At first, teams thought those players were crazy for asking such high contracts.. but what happened? One team decided that it might be worth the risk to spend 20 million a year on 1 player, and so other teams started thinking.. If we don't sign so-and-so to that contract he's asking for, what if he signs with one of our rival teams? So what happens? Well teams decided to take the risk of overpaying a player to not only play for their team, but more importantly, so they won't play for their rival team.

                                Fast forward a few years later, and we have pitchers that would go 6-13 with a 6.33 era in the previous season, sign a 3 year 50 million dollar contract the next season, all because if that particular team doesn't sign him.. somebody else will.

                                So now what? Well just look at this past off-season.. I don't think I need to tell you how many teams overpayed for a particular player. Because well, there might be too many too count.

                                This is the same thing thats happening with Clemens. Next off-season, the biggest free agents will be asking to take days off on the days their not playing or some crazy clause, and if one team doesn't agree to their demands, I bet you some other team will.
                                Last edited by shugknight; 05-18-2007, 05:36 PM.

                                Comment

                                Working...