Hall or Not?

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  • dmoney24
    Rookie
    • Oct 2003
    • 143

    #61
    Re: Hall or Not?

    I'm not saying if he is HOF worthy or not. I'm saying it's a discussion on where the balance needs to be between defense vs offensive production. If you are going to penalize the 80's players for not having offensive numbers comparable to the 90's players. I think you must penalize the 90's players for not playing as sound defense.

    Piazza is a DH in my opinion. I don't think he calls a good game. He doesn't throw worth a flip. I feel he is one of the worst catchers in the history of the game. I'm just curious how others look at him.

    I'm sure he will get in because of his #'s and the market he played most of his career. I just hope when he goes to punch his ticket that he is criticized for his major flaws. He is going in as a catcher that basically can't play the position.

    Comment

    • jt45
      All Star
      • Apr 2003
      • 5074

      #62
      Re: Hall or Not?

      Is Frank Thomas HOF worthy??

      I was looking at his numbers and they are a lot better than I expected. He will undoubtedly get 500 homers, but is that enough anymore?

      495 HR...1600+ RBI...career .303 average...more walks than K's

      Plus he's a two-time AL MVP and four-time Silver Slugger.

      Is he a lock or am I just an idiot?

      Comment

      • Scottdau
        Banned
        • Feb 2003
        • 32580

        #63
        Re: Hall or Not?

        Originally posted by jt45
        Is Frank Thomas HOF worthy??

        I was looking at his numbers and they are a lot better than I expected. He will undoubtedly get 500 homers, but is that enough anymore?

        495 HR...1600+ RBI...career .303 average...more walks than K's

        Plus he's a two-time AL MVP and four-time Silver Slugger.

        Is he a lock or am I just an idiot?

        Yeah I think he should be in 500 HR's aren't like they used to be, but the MVP's help and still 500 is a lot of HR's.

        Comment

        • TheLetterZ
          All Star
          • Jul 2002
          • 6752

          #64
          Re: Hall or Not?

          Originally posted by jt45
          Is Frank Thomas HOF worthy??

          I was looking at his numbers and they are a lot better than I expected. He will undoubtedly get 500 homers, but is that enough anymore?

          495 HR...1600+ RBI...career .303 average...more walks than K's

          Plus he's a two-time AL MVP and four-time Silver Slugger.

          Is he a lock or am I just an idiot?
          He's one of the 5 best first basemen to ever play baseball.

          Comment

          • BunnyHardaway
            Banned
            • Nov 2004
            • 15195

            #65
            Re: Hall or Not?

            Originally posted by jt45
            Is Frank Thomas HOF worthy??

            I was looking at his numbers and they are a lot better than I expected. He will undoubtedly get 500 homers, but is that enough anymore?

            495 HR...1600+ RBI...career .303 average...more walks than K's

            Plus he's a two-time AL MVP and four-time Silver Slugger.

            Is he a lock or am I just an idiot?
            I think he's a first ballot lock for sure.

            Comment

            • joeysosa
              MVP
              • Apr 2005
              • 1051

              #66
              Re: Hall or Not?

              Originally posted by jt45
              Is Frank Thomas HOF worthy??

              I was looking at his numbers and they are a lot better than I expected. He will undoubtedly get 500 homers, but is that enough anymore?

              495 HR...1600+ RBI...career .303 average...more walks than K's

              Plus he's a two-time AL MVP and four-time Silver Slugger.

              Is he a lock or am I just an idiot?
              HoF, hands down. The two-time MVP number is enough for me, but he's had a fantastic career, despite his injuries. One of the most underrated first basemen ever.

              Comment

              • SportsTop
                The Few. The Proud.
                • Jul 2003
                • 6716

                #67
                Re: Hall or Not?

                Originally posted by ZXLT
                He's one of the 5 best first basemen to ever play baseball.
                Originally posted by joeysosa
                HoF, hands down. The two-time MVP number is enough for me, but he's had a fantastic career, despite his injuries. One of the most underrated first basemen ever.
                I'd buy that if he played first base the majority of his career, but he now has more games as a DH than he does at first base (he's played first 46% of his total games played). He only played first base regularly the first eight years of his career and hasn't even played more than 100 games there since 1996. Let's face it, first base isn't the most grueling of positions to play either.

                He was an offensive machine for a long, long time but he needs to be measured against other DH's as well.

                That being said, he'll likely make it in without a problem.
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                • ghm125
                  john14:6
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 2439

                  #68
                  Re: Hall or Not?

                  what about the HALL in general,if it takes a guy say like kent 5-6-7 tries to get in,is he really HALL worthy to begin with,not sayin he is or isnt was just wondering?...How long do you stay on ballot as far as years anyways?
                  VIOLATION!!!!!!!!

                  Comment

                  • bullpen
                    Rookie
                    • Oct 2003
                    • 348

                    #69
                    Re: Hall or Not?

                    If Thomas gets into the HOF...then you'll have to look at guys like Sheffield, McGriff, Thome, Ramirez, Bagwell.

                    Comment

                    • SportsTop
                      The Few. The Proud.
                      • Jul 2003
                      • 6716

                      #70
                      Re: Hall or Not?

                      Originally posted by bullpen
                      If Thomas gets into the HOF...then you'll have to look at guys like Sheffield, McGriff, Thome, Ramirez, Bagwell.
                      No, no, no, no, and no.

                      All of the guys you mentioned played the vast majority of their games at fielding position and not DH. And when I say vast majority I mean 85% and higher.
                      Follow me on Twitter!

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                      • Psyblast
                        2023 National Champions
                        • Jun 2003
                        • 42584

                        #71
                        Re: Hall or Not?

                        Originally posted by bullpen
                        If Thomas gets into the HOF...then you'll have to look at guys like Sheffield, McGriff, Thome, Ramirez, Bagwell.



                        You say that like Manny Ramirez shouldn't be considered at all for the HOF when his career is over?

                        Comment

                        • The Chef
                          Moderator
                          • Sep 2003
                          • 13684

                          #72
                          Re: Hall or Not?

                          My question, and maybe its a no-brainer for many here, but does Edgar Martinez make it and if so first ballot? He was a great DH, career batting average of .312, 514 Doubles, 309 HR's, 1261 RBI's, 1219 Runs Scored, Walked 1283 times while striking out 1202 times and for his career he had a .515 SLG, .424 OBP and a .939 OPS, to me he was a great player but playing his entire career here in the NW means some people may not have seen him play often, so I was curious what other may have thought.

                          EDIT- Here is a link to his year by year stats for anyone interested in checking them out...


                          Here is another link talking about his accomplishments, I had no idea that MLB changed the name of the DH award to the Edgar Martinez award, but anyways there is a bunch of good info there for anyone on the fence about him being hall worthy.
                          Last edited by The Chef; 06-10-2007, 05:07 PM.
                          http://www.twitch.tv/kitm9891

                          Comment

                          • DGetz
                            Pro
                            • Mar 2004
                            • 636

                            #73
                            Re: Hall or Not?

                            Originally posted by Scottd
                            Sure, but then I go back to my other point, Kent is no small guy and most small guys played second base. But what ever. I just find the position thing to be off. 2nd used to be the smallest guy on the field in the past it is changing now, but I wouldn't be shocked if Kent was the biggest 2nd basemen in the history of the game. Size does matter here. If he was putting up this kinds of numbers and he was a little guy then I would say yes he should be in, but you are rewarding Kent for a playing a base that he really isn't that great at and should be a first baseman. It is all good if he make it I will be happy, I like Kent even though he is a an ***, he his one hell of a hitter.
                            Size isnt the issue, people did not start taking position into account so they could get smaller players into the Hall of Fame. The reason people take position into account is that poisitions are more difficult to play than others. Middle infield versus left field - no comparison. Thus, the number of people who can even play the middle infield position at the major league level is much lower than the number of people who could play OF or 1B; thus by virtue of the their ability to play these more difficult positions they have more value than player who cannot. This added value is what factors in for the voting.

                            Since there have been fewer players capable of playing middlie infield or catcher than 1B or corner OF it makes sense that the top end of the talent distribution would not be as impressive from a raw offensive numbers standpoint and thus numbers that would put someone in the top 5 or 10 pcercent for 2B/SS/C would not rank them as highly were they playing a different position. It makes sense that the Hall recognizes someone who is in the top 5% of one of these more difficult position over someone who was in the top 15% at an easier one.
                            "Darth Vader doesn't cry, Peter."
                            "The guy was married to Natalie Portman and blew it. I mean, think about it."

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