Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

[WTF]

Alright, the whole Nyjer Morgan debate has brought a lot of analysts out of the woodwork to say it was right to throw at him the 2nd time last night from Volstad because he stole 2nd and 3rd while down 11 runs.

Aaron Boone and others said that its an unwritten rule that when you're down that many runs, it's unprofessional and selfish to steal bases, and you're just asking for trouble.

Now... I may be old fashioned, but this makes absolutely no sense to me. As a competitor, I will do anything and everything I can to not lay down and take defeat, and try to get my team back in the game.

My question is, what is the "reasoning" that it's unprofessional and selfish to still play baseball when down that many runs. Being a Reds fan, I've seen some HUGE comebacks that were sparked by a sacrifice bunt here, a walk there, and then the game is close again. So... WHY?

Baseball enthusiasts, help me out here. And if there are any other "unwritten rules" in baseball, fill me in. I have NEVER heard of this, and I've followed the Reds since 86, when I was taken to my first game. Been a big fan every since, and I've not once heard of laying down because you're down. That's like telling an NBA team that if you're down 20 points, that you shouldn't try to make your free throws.

Thoughts?

[Blzer]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

We had a couple of threads around the time Rodriguez ran over the mound and Braden had an issue with it. There are definitely two sides of the coin to the whole "unwritten rule" arguments:

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...-my-mound.html

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...d.php?t=413388

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

You know, I can understand a few of those "rules", but some are just flat out ridiculous.

And I'm just dumbfounded about this incident last night. I mean, why not steal a base? They still have every chance to throw you out.

And don't swing at the first pitch after back to back HR's? Seriously? I get that the pitcher is out there to do a job... but if he gives up Back to Back HR's... learn to do a better job or throw a pitch in a different location. If he grooves another one, then that's on him. If he wants me not to swing, throw it outside.

I don't know, just doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

To further the Nyjer thing, it's an unwritten rule that you don't steal with a huge lead, and you don't bunt. Violate either and you're asking to be thrown at.

Joba Chamberlain has made a habit out of showing up hitters when K'ing them, regardless of the situation. All and all, it's really stupid on his part and he's one of the most hated players in baseball because of it. If he actually played in the NL, he'd probably of had his head taken off by now. Showing up the pitcher after a big HR is also a big no-no. There's a big reason why Prince Fielder gets hit every other game. He's another one of the most hated players in baseball.

Basically, if you're a young player in baseball, you should follow the unwritten rules. The vets know this, and they enforce it. It's a serious matter in baseball, whether the outsiders laugh at it or not.

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

They weren't the one with the lead though. They were down. I can understand if the guys are crushing the other team, don't steal and "run up the score" type deal. But to try to not be competitive and get back in the game? Why?

[Chef Matt]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Alright, the whole Nyjer Morgan debate has brought a lot of analysts out of the woodwork to say it was right to throw at him the 2nd time last night from Volstad because he stole 2nd and 3rd while down 11 runs.

Aaron Boone and others said that its an unwritten rule that when you're down that many runs, it's unprofessional and selfish to steal bases, and you're just asking for trouble.

Now... I may be old fashioned, but this makes absolutely no sense to me. As a competitor, I will do anything and everything I can to not lay down and take defeat, and try to get my team back in the game.

My question is, what is the "reasoning" that it's unprofessional and selfish to still play baseball when down that many runs. Being a Reds fan, I've seen some HUGE comebacks that were sparked by a sacrifice bunt here, a walk there, and then the game is close again. So... WHY?

Baseball enthusiasts, help me out here. And if there are any other "unwritten rules" in baseball, fill me in. I have NEVER heard of this, and I've followed the Reds since 86, when I was taken to my first game. Been a big fan every since, and I've not once heard of laying down because you're down. That's like telling an NBA team that if you're down 20 points, that you shouldn't try to make your free throws.

Thoughts?

Get this book. I've been reading it and it's great. A ton of inside stuff on the unwritten rules.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

They weren't the one with the lead though. They were down. I can understand if the guys are crushing the other team, don't steal and "run up the score" type deal. But to try to not be competitive and get back in the game? Why?

Oh, I meant to say up or down by a big deal, but yeah. I know what you're saying in that it doesn't make sense, I'm guessing it has to do with slowing the game down, like "Just accept that it's over instead of being lame about it" type stuff. Which whether you disagree with or not, is hilarious.

[daflyboys]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Not that's it's pro ball, but I always hated going to my son's H.S. games and you'd run across these (imo) cheesy, bush league things:

Fans on the opposing team, yell out "watch out for the curve ball" when your team is up to bat.

Opposing team dugout players making some stupid noise right as your pitcher is releasing the ball.

3rd base coaches yelling instructions to his runners right at the time pitchers are releasing the ball.

All garbage.

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Appreciate the book recommendation chef. Does it happen to have that particular rule in their? Not running when down big?

I'll look for it the next time I go up to Florence.

Like Riggleman said "The Marlins don't say when we run, We decide when we run..."

That's the "rule" that I'm just at a loss about.

[Chef Matt]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Appreciate the book recommendation chef. Does it happen to have that particular rule in their? Not running when down big?

I'll look for it the next time I go up to Florence.

Like Riggleman said "The Marlins don't say when we run, We decide when we run..."

That's the "rule" that I'm just at a loss about.

I don't now about running when DOWN big, but I did read the one on running while UP big. I'll dig into it a little and see if I can pull some quotes out of it on this when I get home.

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Oh, I meant to say up or down by a big deal, but yeah. I know what you're saying in that it doesn't make sense, I'm guessing it has to do with slowing the game down, like "Just accept that it's over instead of being lame about it" type stuff. Which whether you disagree with or not, is hilarious.

Yeah, if you're down 11 with 2 outs in the 9th inning, then well, probably just chalk up the loss... But it was only the 4th inning. There is a LOT of baseball left to be played.

But it's still not slowing the game down. It still goes pitch by pitch. Just so happens that the guy is running during the pitch, lol.

[SPTO]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Yeah I never heard the version where it's forbidden to run when down big but i've heard it in regards to when you're up by a lot. Me thinks the Marlins are just trying not to look like crybabies about it. What's two stolen bases in the grand scheme of things?

One of my favorite unwritten rules is "never bunt for a hit in the 9th inning of a no-hitter". I think that's pretty self explanatory. I mean, how can you be proud of breaking up a no hitter when you resort to something like that?

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

I don't now about running when DOWN big, but I did read the one on running while UP big. I'll dig into it a little and see if I can pull some quotes out of it on this when I get home.

Sweet. I've been looking for a good book to delve into, and that looks like it would be some good literature.

I can totally understand being up big, and not running, although I personally still don't see the problem with it, can see where others might. It's not like you're saying "I'm stealing this base, don't throw the ball..." The team in the field can still throw the runner out. If they can't achieve that, then they are the problem, not the runner.

I don't think I've ever seen Rickey Henderson not take a base when he thought he could steal, just because it may upset someone.

[WTF]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

Yeah I never heard the version where it's forbidden to run when down big but i've heard it in regards to when you're up by a lot. Me thinks the Marlins are just trying not to look like crybabies about it. What's two stolen bases in the grand scheme of things?

One of my favorite unwritten rules is "never bunt for a hit in the 9th inning of a no-hitter". I think that's pretty self explanatory. I mean, how can you be proud of breaking up a no hitter when you resort to something like that?

Yeah, I can see the "don't bunt" thing. But then again, if it's a 1-0 game, and the no hitter is intact, I have Drew Stubbs at the plate, notorious for getting things started with small ball, I give him the go ahead.

Lay it on the defense to make the play. I don't like these Unwritten rules, saying that you can't "play the game of baseball". Some of the things, I can see... but one baserunner is all it takes to spark a run.

In a tight pennant race, Chris Carpenter has a no-no going into the 9th with a score of 1-0 or 2-0, Stubbs up to bat... Drag bunt single. I'm fine with it. He represents the tying run at that point. Lay it on the defense to keep you off the basepad and backup your pitcher.

If you're down 6-7 or it's a no-implication game, then yeah, try to hit instead of breaking up the game with a bunt. It may be my competitive nature, but at what point do you stop playing the game, and start catering to the other teams needs?

[HustlinOwl]

Re: Baseball's Unwritten Rules & Why?

there is no rule when down 11 and being hit by the pitch. Morgan felt being hit by the pitch was unnecessary for playing the game hard and running over the catcher the night before, Volstad hit him and Morgan stole 2 bags being down 11 in the 4th.