The 100-pitch limit

[Blzer]

Are all 100-pitch counts equal?

I'm sitting here thinking of the parameters that made us decide 100 pitches should not be the true barometer for seeing if a guy is tired. There are obvious ones such as the fact that not all pitchers are built equally, but consider the other types of throws that aren't even factored into the pitches, such as:

• Warm-up pitches between innings
• Warm-up pitches in the bullpen
• Pick-off throws
• Throwing a ball back to the umpire

You get where I'm going this, but the simple fact is that pitches are not the only throws they have in the day, and depending on the pitcher the amount of total throws might be even different by another 50 throws or so.

Now, I understand that the majority of these throws aren't as taxing on the arm, so now we should consider how those pitches might be thrown differently.

• Fastballs
• Breaking balls
• Off-speed pitches
• Intentional walk throws (don't worry, next year this won't be an issue... but I do wonder if these get added to their pitch total)
• Throwing from the windup
• Throwing from the stretch

These things both matter and differentiate other pitchers' totals.

Finally, I'm curious whether a pitcher who throws 100 pitches in seven innings is any different than a pitcher who throws 100 pitches in twenty innings. Meaning, if it's the thirteenth inning and they have only thrown 80 pitches, are the "back and forth" breaks a factor of sorts for these pitchers, plus those pitches in-between innings? I do wonder.

I just don't why 100 ends up being the number, when it's not only clearly not the number of throws they have for the entire day and there are so many other things to break down with it.

And I'm not even saying it is too few of pitches, maybe it is too many pitches as well. Maybe they have numbers on this that I just haven't seen that shows a dip in velocity and consistency, and if so I will step aside. I just don't think all pitchers are the exact same though where this is where all should be looked at for this mark, especially when the days of yore had them throwing 150+ pitches in back-to-back games (and I'm not saying we should go back to that).

Curious what you think.

[Chip Douglass]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

Because 100 pitches generally matches up pretty well to a pitcher facing the opposing hitters for the 4th time (27 PAs times 3.8 pitches per PA - the 2015 rate - equals 102.6 pitches), which is when a pitcher's effectiveness falls off the cliff.

[Jr.]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

I've always looked at pitches per inning, rather than total pitches. If a guy is throwing his 100th pitch in the 5th inning, it's a lot different in terms of wear and tear than throwing the 100th pitch in the 8th inning. Typically as you go about 15-17 pitches in an inning, a guy will get tired within that inning (think of anaerobic stamina vs aerobic, though that isn't really what's going on) and his mechanics may break down just from exertion in that inning.

There is also the amount of effort exerted on each pitch. Pitches from the stretch generally require more effort (because of the lack of momentum gained from the rocker step/turn in the windup), so that's usually taken into account as well.

Along with what Chip said.

[SPTO]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

I've always looked at pitches per inning, rather than total pitches. If a guy is throwing his 100th pitch in the 5th inning, it's a lot different in terms of wear and tear than throwing the 100th pitch in the 8th inning. Typically as you go about 15-17 pitches in an inning, a guy will get tired within that inning (think of anaerobic stamina vs aerobic, though that isn't really what's going on) and his mechanics may break down just from exertion in that inning.

There is also the amount of effort exerted on each pitch. Pitches from the stretch generally require more effort (because of the lack of momentum gained from the rocker step/turn in the windup), so that's usually taken into account as well.

Along with what Chip said.

You basically said what i'd say in a much more elegant manner.

In short, teams need to realize that 100 pitches isn't equal every time out.

[Jr.]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

You basically said what i'd say in a much more elegant manner.

In short, teams need to realize that 100 pitches isn't equal every time out.

I'd say that the teams know this stuff, and more. Analysts/Commentators, maybe not.

[slickdtc]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

Interesting thoughts Blzer. Good explanations followed, but I think 100 is a nice, round number and that's a big reason why it's the benchmark. With the advancement in stats and real time analytics I think this is an area that can and should be explored farther.

[KSUowls]

Re: The 100-pitch limit

Former Braves pitching coach Leo Mazzone contributes to a local radio show. Every time the subject of pitch counts comes up he immediately goes into a tirade about how not all pitches are created equal. It's all about "stress" pitches and innings. Someone who has thrown 60 pitches with some high stress innings is much worse off than someone who has thrown 90 pitches without laboring.