Top 10 Most Improved Teams

[Misfit]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

That maybe so, regarding the A's, but you can't say the team improved by losing two Cy Young cadidates and replacing them with unproven guys. Yes, Haren and Meyer have the potential to be quality big-league pitchers but right now you can't say their addition, along with the subtraction of Hudson and Mulder, improves the team.

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

That maybe so, regarding the A's, but you can't say the team improved by losing two Cy Young cadidates and replacing them with unproven guys. Yes, Haren and Meyer have the potential to be quality big-league pitchers but right now you can't say their addition, along with the subtraction of Hudson and Mulder, improves the team.

The A's upgraded there biggest weakness last year (the bullpen) by adding Calero, Yabu, and Cruz--as well as having a healthy Dotel for opening day. The A's were the worst team in holds/saves 2nd to the Indians in the AL last year, the bullpen was downright terrible, they have tons of depth now, with quality arms not only on the current 25 man roster, but big prospects like Street and Garcia (waiting to step in if needed)

Beane is implementing a new philosophy, building the rotation from the back up, considering arms in the bullpen are much cheaper then those in the starting 5. Duke, Cruz, Yabu--all 3 of those guys could be in the back end of a major league starting rotation, but will be put in long relief while the A's work in the "The Little Three" (Haren, Meyer, Blanton) 3 guys who could all turn into atleast 'effective' pitchers this season. I doubt any of them will be throwing more then 90 pitches, but the A's have enough depth in the bullpen and on the 40 man roster to afford to baby them in the majors. All ratio's point to "The Little Three" being ready in the majors though, and if there's one thing Beane has done successfully in his career: work in and get the most he can out of his young arms.

The A's also upgraded from Damian Miller/Melhuse a catcher platoon who was a serious offensive liability to one of the top offensive options in the league. they also added a bonafide "top of the order" batter with the addition of Jason Kendall (which they desperately needed) his career OBP is .387 with a BA over .300 that upgrade is huge with in itself.

The A's will also have a healthy Bobby Kielty this season, along with more outfield help in Nick Swisher, another A prospect projected to be a star. Bobby Crosby will be going into this season with a full year of service under his belt, while a healthy Mark Ellis at 2B along with Ginter(utility man with 30 HR power brought over from milwaukee) all add a significant upgrade offensively, i think last year with Chavez and Ellis out, the A's almost won there division with Mark(40yr old)Mcclemore @ 3B, and Scutaro at 2b for 5 weeks lol

Anyway, dont watch an episode of baseball tonight and listen to the stupid so called "experts" tell you a team has declined without thinking objectively, if you really disect the #'s and look into it, the A's actually have a much better all around team minus 2 super-star arms that have been more than made up for in other area's of the team, as well as in the restocking of young-cheap talent.

How many superstars have the A's lost since 2000? guys who went on to make huge contracts with other clubs, (the A's still managed to win on average 96 wins over the course of the last 5 years) this is just another bump in the road, again....dont be like all the other fools in the media who constantly doubt this team...think objectively.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me 5 times? just blow my brians out.

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

That maybe so, regarding the A's, but you can't say the team improved by losing two Cy Young cadidates and replacing them with unproven guys. Yes, Haren and Meyer have the potential to be quality big-league pitchers but right now you can't say their addition, along with the subtraction of Hudson and Mulder, improves the team.

The A's upgraded there biggest weakness last year (the bullpen) by adding Calero, Yabu, and Cruz--as well as having a healthy Dotel for opening day. The A's were the worst team in holds/saves 2nd to the Indians in the AL last year, the bullpen was downright terrible, they have tons of depth now, with quality arms not only on the current 25 man roster, but big prospects like Street and Garcia (waiting to step in if needed)

Beane is implementing a new philosophy, building the rotation from the back up, considering arms in the bullpen are much cheaper then those in the starting 5. Duke, Cruz, Yabu--all 3 of those guys could be in the back end of a major league starting rotation, but will be put in long relief while the A's work in the "The Little Three" (Haren, Meyer, Blanton) 3 guys who could all turn into atleast 'effective' pitchers this season. I doubt any of them will be throwing more then 90 pitches, but the A's have enough depth in the bullpen and on the 40 man roster to afford to baby them in the majors. All ratio's point to "The Little Three" being ready in the majors though, and if there's one thing Beane has done successfully in his career: work in and get the most he can out of his young arms.

The A's also upgraded from Damian Miller/Melhuse a catcher platoon who was a serious offensive liability to one of the top offensive options in the league. they also added a bonafide "top of the order" batter with the addition of Jason Kendall (which they desperately needed) his career OBP is .387 with a BA over .300 that upgrade is huge with in itself.

The A's will also have a healthy Bobby Kielty this season, along with more outfield help in Nick Swisher, another A prospect projected to be a star. Bobby Crosby will be going into this season with a full year of service under his belt, while a healthy Mark Ellis at 2B along with Ginter(utility man with 30 HR power brought over from milwaukee) all add a significant upgrade offensively, i think last year with Chavez and Ellis out, the A's almost won there division with Mark(40yr old)Mcclemore @ 3B, and Scutaro at 2b for 5 weeks lol

Anyway, dont watch an episode of baseball tonight and listen to the stupid so called "experts" tell you a team has declined without thinking objectively, if you really disect the #'s and look into it, the A's actually have a much better all around team minus 2 super-star arms that have been more than made up for in other area's of the team, as well as in the restocking of young-cheap talent.

How many superstars have the A's lost since 2000? guys who went on to make huge contracts with other clubs, (the A's still managed to win on average 96 wins over the course of the last 5 years) this is just another bump in the road, again....dont be like all the other fools in the media who constantly doubt this team...think objectively.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me 5 times? just blow my brians out.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

Derek Lowe is a ground ball pitcher, if you can keep the ball down in dodger stadium your #'s will look godly, i expect him to take full advantage of this pitching at chavez ravigne.

Finley and Drew a wash? what are you smoking?

Finley: .271/.333/.490 (823 OPS)
Drew: .287/.391/.513 (904 OPS)

Considering Finley is on the tail end of his career, value - wise its not even close.

Drew dealed with nagging injuries and was in Larussa's doghouse in st louis--he got a bad reputation in the media because of it--but he showed last year he could be an elite everyday player.

The offensive upgrade from Cora to Kent is ridiculous, especially considering how badly the dodgers need a big right handed bat to replace beltre's power last year. and to get that kind of power from 2b makes it even better, considering its easy to find guys with good OBP/SLG/ISOp in the OF.

Also i believe the Dodgers will be platooning valentin/saenz at 3b, valentin shows nice power #'s against RHP, while saenz absolutely destroys LHP

Saenz against LHP: .328/.397/.602
Valentin against RHP: .252/.324/.514

Adrian Beltre: .278/.328/.495 (granted i used 3 year splits for examples so beltre's #'s should be infalated for progression) is not to far off.

considering the saenz/valentin combo is about 80 million cheaper, and not to far off in production (atleast using relevant offensive metrics) then its not as bad a downgrade as most people are lead to believe.

Depodesta knows what he's doing...amongst sabermetric communities using pecota formula alot of "stat heads" see the Dodgers finishing this season with the best record in the NL.

As for the A's.....yes they lost some major pitchers, but the team as a whole offensively/defensively/bullpen have been upgraded significantly....they also got 2 major league ready arms primed for breakout years (Haren, Meyer) as well as Blanton who showed he's ready for the bigs last year by destroying every level of the farm system.

Dont sleep on this A team seriously.

Derek Lowe is a good groundball pitcher, however, the only sure glove he's got behind him is Izturis so we'll see how that plays out in the infield.

I stick by my statement with Finley and Drew, it's a wash only if Drew stays healthy the whole year, four months won't cut it even if Finley is on the "decline" (where have I heard that here in San Diego so many times?)

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

Derek Lowe is a ground ball pitcher, if you can keep the ball down in dodger stadium your #'s will look godly, i expect him to take full advantage of this pitching at chavez ravigne.

Finley and Drew a wash? what are you smoking?

Finley: .271/.333/.490 (823 OPS)
Drew: .287/.391/.513 (904 OPS)

Considering Finley is on the tail end of his career, value - wise its not even close.

Drew dealed with nagging injuries and was in Larussa's doghouse in st louis--he got a bad reputation in the media because of it--but he showed last year he could be an elite everyday player.

The offensive upgrade from Cora to Kent is ridiculous, especially considering how badly the dodgers need a big right handed bat to replace beltre's power last year. and to get that kind of power from 2b makes it even better, considering its easy to find guys with good OBP/SLG/ISOp in the OF.

Also i believe the Dodgers will be platooning valentin/saenz at 3b, valentin shows nice power #'s against RHP, while saenz absolutely destroys LHP

Saenz against LHP: .328/.397/.602
Valentin against RHP: .252/.324/.514

Adrian Beltre: .278/.328/.495 (granted i used 3 year splits for examples so beltre's #'s should be infalated for progression) is not to far off.

considering the saenz/valentin combo is about 80 million cheaper, and not to far off in production (atleast using relevant offensive metrics) then its not as bad a downgrade as most people are lead to believe.

Depodesta knows what he's doing...amongst sabermetric communities using pecota formula alot of "stat heads" see the Dodgers finishing this season with the best record in the NL.

As for the A's.....yes they lost some major pitchers, but the team as a whole offensively/defensively/bullpen have been upgraded significantly....they also got 2 major league ready arms primed for breakout years (Haren, Meyer) as well as Blanton who showed he's ready for the bigs last year by destroying every level of the farm system.

Dont sleep on this A team seriously.

Derek Lowe is a good groundball pitcher, however, the only sure glove he's got behind him is Izturis so we'll see how that plays out in the infield.

I stick by my statement with Finley and Drew, it's a wash only if Drew stays healthy the whole year, four months won't cut it even if Finley is on the "decline" (where have I heard that here in San Diego so many times?)

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

How is it close? Drew's OPS is almost 100 points higher

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

How is it close? Drew's OPS is almost 100 points higher

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

So, that with one full season justifies him? And I thought everyone was iffy on Beltre's year.

I'm not saying Drew sucks, it's just that it's pretty risky... yet it can be rewarding if he does stay healthy.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

So, that with one full season justifies him? And I thought everyone was iffy on Beltre's year.

I'm not saying Drew sucks, it's just that it's pretty risky... yet it can be rewarding if he does stay healthy.

[Misfit]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

You still didn't give me any reason to say the A's are better now than they were at this time last year. Dotel wasn't exactly lights out for them last year and there's no guarantee he'll be better this year. I could see them potentially being better next year, or if things all fall into place better than expected and guys have career years they could be better than this year. However, there is no way you can put them in a list of top 10 most improved teams at this point. Let's also not forget that most of their new pitchers have to adapt from pitching in the NL to pitching in the AL, not an easy feat even for some of the game's better pitchers. They may have overcome the loss of talent before (though in reality they didn't overcome losing Tejada, as they weren't able to make the postseason last year) but one constant was always their big three in the rotation, and that constant is gone.

[Misfit]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

You still didn't give me any reason to say the A's are better now than they were at this time last year. Dotel wasn't exactly lights out for them last year and there's no guarantee he'll be better this year. I could see them potentially being better next year, or if things all fall into place better than expected and guys have career years they could be better than this year. However, there is no way you can put them in a list of top 10 most improved teams at this point. Let's also not forget that most of their new pitchers have to adapt from pitching in the NL to pitching in the AL, not an easy feat even for some of the game's better pitchers. They may have overcome the loss of talent before (though in reality they didn't overcome losing Tejada, as they weren't able to make the postseason last year) but one constant was always their big three in the rotation, and that constant is gone.

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

"the big 3" were rookies once too, i guess we'll just have to wait and see

[PlyrzNumber1]

Re: Top 10 Most Improved Teams

"the big 3" were rookies once too, i guess we'll just have to wait and see