2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

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  • CBoller1331
    It Appears I Blue Myself
    • Dec 2013
    • 3082

    #376
    Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

    Originally posted by p_rushing
    This loophole has got to be shut. No more deferring money, pay the contract and they really need to set a max years limit so they can't just get around the deferred rule.

    Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk
    Don't really think either side wants this to be "closed". Players are probably fine with it as they can get more total dollars and get paid after they are done playing, and teams are fine with it as they can spread out the total value of the contract over a long period or time - decreasing the "actual" value of the contract
    Chicago Cubs
    Michigan Wolverines

    Thanks Peyton. #18

    Comment

    • p_rushing
      Hall Of Fame
      • Feb 2004
      • 14514

      #377
      Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

      Originally posted by CBoller1331
      Don't really think either side wants this to be "closed". Players are probably fine with it as they can get more total dollars and get paid after they are done playing, and teams are fine with it as they can spread out the total value of the contract over a long period or time - decreasing the "actual" value of the contract
      The players should care but they are getting an increase to cover interest. It's enough money that taxes, inflation, interest, etc won't matter much but they should really take the money upfront.

      Teams definitely won't close it but MLB for a competitive advantage should close it. The top teams are using it to game the system.

      Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk

      Comment

      • TripleCrown9
        Keep the Faith
        • May 2010
        • 23669

        #378
        Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

        Originally posted by Jr.
        At least credit the guy on Twitter who made the joke you stole
        And return all the profit I've made from posting it here? I don't think so.

        Originally posted by countryboy

        lol


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
        At least credit the guy on Twitter you stole this from.
        Boston Red Sox
        1903 1912 1915 1916 1918 2004 2007 2013 2018
        9 4 1 8 27 6 14 45 26 34

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        • countryboy
          Growing pains
          • Sep 2003
          • 52706

          #379
          Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

          Yankees are acquiring LHP Victor Gonzalez and IF Jorbit Vivas from the Dodgers in exchange for IF Trey Sweeney
          I can't shave with my eyes closed, meaning each day I have to look at myself in the mirror and respect who I see.

          I miss the old days of Operation Sports :(


          Louisville Cardinals/St.Louis Cardinals

          Comment

          • Majingir
            Moderator
            • Apr 2005
            • 47466

            #380
            Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

            Originally posted by p_rushing
            That just says cheese sauce cup, it doesn't say the cheese sauce is included

            Sent from my SM-T970 using Tapatalk
            That's gotta be in the fine print.

            Cheese Sauce Cup *

            *Sauce not included

            Comment

            • TripleCrown9
              Keep the Faith
              • May 2010
              • 23669

              #381
              Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

              Ohtani is deferring 68 of his 70mil a year every year until the end of his contract, which means he's only getting 2mil every year for 10 years and will get the remaining 680mil at the end of the contract. The math allows to Dodgers a lot more money to spend throughout the contract.

              AS PER SEVERAL PEOPLE ON TWITTER
              Boston Red Sox
              1903 1912 1915 1916 1918 2004 2007 2013 2018
              9 4 1 8 27 6 14 45 26 34

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              • CBoller1331
                It Appears I Blue Myself
                • Dec 2013
                • 3082

                #382
                Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread



                Ok I didn't expect this to be how Shohei's contract was laid out.

                EDIT: TripleCrown beat me, but there's a link incase you don't believe him....

                This is baffling
                Chicago Cubs
                Michigan Wolverines

                Thanks Peyton. #18

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                • LowerWolf
                  Hall Of Fame
                  • Jun 2006
                  • 12268

                  #383
                  Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                  My question is: does the deferred money count against the tax when it’s paid out in 2034-2043?

                  Comment

                  • Majingir
                    Moderator
                    • Apr 2005
                    • 47466

                    #384
                    Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                    Originally posted by CBoller1331
                    https://x.com/JeffPassan/status/1734...606697220?s=20

                    Ok I didn't expect this to be how Shohei's contract was laid out.

                    EDIT: TripleCrown beat me, but there's a link incase you don't believe him....

                    This is baffling
                    I feel like this will be the Ilya Kovalchuk situation all over again, but in the MLB.

                    For those who don't know, in the NHL the New Jersey Devils tried getting around the NHLs hard cap by structuring his deal in a way which lowered his annual cap hit so that they wouldn't go over the limit (in their case it was the reverse of the Ohtani deal, they paid so much in the first few years and made it a 17 year deal so that the average annual value was lower, and when he retires before the deals done, he won't be losing much money anyways) . The NHL came down on them and fined them and they lost draft picks including a first rounder.

                    There's no way this Ohtani deal is legal is it? And regardless, surely the MLB will make a new rule out of this like the NHL did for theirs? Make it something like a player must recieve at least a certain percentage of his total salary per season so teams don't insanely front or back load a deal.

                    Teams definitely will be complaining to the MLB about this too. Does this mean Dodgers will pay over 600m to Ohtani in year 10 or something? They need to void that structuring right now because if they allow this, you know others will start doing it *cough* Boras *cough*
                    Last edited by Majingir; 12-11-2023, 07:14 PM.

                    Comment

                    • DieHardYankee26
                      BING BONG
                      • Feb 2008
                      • 10178

                      #385
                      Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                      Originally posted by G Perico
                      If I ain't got it, then I gotta take it
                      I can't hide who I am, baby I'm a gangster
                      In the Rolls Royce, steppin' on a mink rug
                      The clique just a gang of bosses that linked up

                      Comment

                      • CBoller1331
                        It Appears I Blue Myself
                        • Dec 2013
                        • 3082

                        #386
                        Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                        Originally posted by LowerWolf
                        My question is: does the deferred money count against the tax when it’s paid out in 2034-2043?
                        I don't think it does....but I've realized I know much less about MLB's luxury tax rules than I thought I did
                        Chicago Cubs
                        Michigan Wolverines

                        Thanks Peyton. #18

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                        • Bard
                          YouTube: NHBard
                          • Oct 2010
                          • 7803

                          #387
                          Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                          Deferred money is limitless. So, no, this won't affect them ever.

                          Smart.

                          Sent from my SM-S908U1 using Tapatalk
                          Come hang with me on YouTube! I stream/make videos on a variety of games from sports, to action, to adventure!


                          https://youtube.com/@nhbard?si=kOpLZu8evi-aFsnG

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                          • Majingir
                            Moderator
                            • Apr 2005
                            • 47466

                            #388
                            Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread



                            Just seems ridiculous

                            Comment

                            • reyes the roof
                              Hall Of Fame
                              • Mar 2009
                              • 11525

                              #389
                              Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                              Originally posted by LowerWolf
                              My question is: does the deferred money count against the tax when it’s paid out in 2034-2043?
                              It does count, the Mets still have Bonilla and Bret Saberhagen counting against their tax total and the Red Sox have a few guys with deferred money counting against theirs too. I’m curious how the amount that counts is calculated though. He’s being paid $2 million per year for the next ten but I’ve seen he’s going to count $46 million per year against the tax threshold

                              Comment

                              • CBoller1331
                                It Appears I Blue Myself
                                • Dec 2013
                                • 3082

                                #390
                                Re: 2023-2024 Hot Stove Thread

                                Originally posted by reyes the roof
                                It does count, the Mets still have Bonilla and Bret Saberhagen counting against their tax total and the Red Sox have a few guys with deferred money counting against theirs too. I’m curious how the amount that counts is calculated though. He’s being paid $2 million per year for the next ten but I’ve seen he’s going to count $46 million per year against the tax threshold
                                If the internet is right - particularly this article (and lets face it the internet's never been wrong) - then the CBT salary is calculated as the Average Salary over the duration of the contract ($2M in Ohtani's case) plus the Present Value of the average annual deferred money in the last year it is deferred (so the $68M due in 2043 in present value is $44,081,476 assuming the interest rate referenced in the article is correct - and assuming this Google search on how to calculate present value is also correct).

                                So in essence, Ohtani's contract will be valued at 10 Years, $460M.
                                Chicago Cubs
                                Michigan Wolverines

                                Thanks Peyton. #18

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