A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

[nip83]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

A bit OT but since the mechanism of player styles is already there (in the game design) ,this article refines those player styles in greater detail:

http://www.wired.com/2012/04/analytics-basketball/

Also to be fair i've seen stretch 4's from generated classes.The problem lies that they usually fall in the top 5 or top 8 max ,as the OP identified.

[algeron04]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

I used to spend countless hours editing draft classes for my associations. I still added some of the players before the season but I only edit a couple sharpshooters and maybe one superstar. The draft classes are much improved from years past. Draft classes aren't perfect but there are a lot of small things that do not appear, which is great. Example we don't see 7 ft PGs or 300 lb SFs. Also the player progression IMO is very good. I applaud 2k for that.

But there are a few things that could be improved upon. As stated there needs to be more sharp shooters. When I look at the draft class every year there is only 1 or 2 guys whose mid range/3pt shooting is about 75. There's at least 1 or 2 J.J. Reddick and Kyle Korvers per year. More bigs that can shoot from mid- 3pt range. 1 or 2 late 1st-early 2nd round picks that contribute immediately. Whether it be just slashing with athleticism or defense or just a 3 point shooter. I do understand that when most rookies come into the league there shooting percentages are low, but that is because they don't have the offensive awareness, shot IQ, and consistency that NBA veterans have. So one possible solution be to have the ratings slightly higher for rookies but have offensive awareness, shot IQ, and offensive consistency slightly lower so that the percentages are average for NBA rookies.

as the person most responsible for generating the draft classes, and coincidentally the one that wrote the code for generated players in choops as well, i'm super interested in how the generated players in choops were so much better than the players generated in nba 2k15, because i spent a good deal of time last year making the draft classes a lot more interesting and i guarantee you that it does a lot better job of providing variety and interesting prospects than choops ever did.

and fyi, having a discussion about draft classes without bringing up player progression is pointless. what a player's initial attributes are is somewhat interesting but what's really important is where that player's attributes are in 5-10 years, when he will be expected to be at the top of his game and maybe the league. what was james harden's rating when he was a rookie, compared to now? where was steph curry 5 years ago? rookies are almost never the best players at anything. they're rookies, they need years of playing to perfect their skills and develop specialties.

the player generation and progression work together in 2k15 to make by far the best looking league 20 seasons down the road that nba 2k has ever had and miles ahead of other games that you mention.

[pacers101]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Some minor tweaking could be done, and I'm sure it will. The lack of specialist shooters who aren't stars is a good point and something I hadn't noticed (bigs as well as wings). But its massively better than what has gone before. I have had an absolute blast this year doing 3 minute quarters, 14 game seasons and rolling through the drafts, and finding some really fun players to use. And now the regression is sorted, the progression really comes into its own.


And its much better than many other games I have played, including a couple on that list (FIFA, NHL, PES). It must be incredibly difficult to get players to generate 'realistically' without blatantly using templates / regens.

[pacers101]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Just to add very briefly to my earlier post, one area that requires improvement is the appearances of the generated players. They stand out like a sore thumb on the court next to the real players. Also the amount of Charlie Villanueva lookalikes is surreal!! :-)

[nickthemajin]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

I think the biggest problem with the draft classes are as the above poster said. The likenesses and appearances of these guys are atrocious. It sort of comes stems from the character creator in nba2k being unable to produce anything other than cavemen looking people but after about 5-10 years in a franchise the entire league is taken over by cavemen looking people in various ethnic flavors that all sort of look the same.

An example of this. Check out Langston Galloway on the Knicks and Tarik Black on the Lakers. They look godawful. Obviously they weren't face scanned but it says something when even the officially created players by 2k look absolutely terrible.

[Sam12345]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

I think the biggest problem with the draft classes are as the above poster said. The likenesses and appearances of these guys are atrocious. It sort of comes stems from the character creator in nba2k being unable to produce anything other than cavemen looking people but after about 5-10 years in a franchise the entire league is taken over by cavemen looking people in various ethnic flavors that all sort of look the same.

An example of this. Check out Langston Galloway on the Knicks and Tarik Black on the Lakers. They look godawful. Obviously they weren't face scanned but it says something when even the officially created players by 2k look absolutely terrible.

Exactly. If 2k won't make them with detail how is the game meant to do it!

[POINT GOD]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Tell me what you guys think about this idea, I think that 2k16 should include the option to use premade draft classes with story lines to go along with them, random draft classes, or the ability to download draftclass from other players. What do yall think?

[zrohman]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Tell me what you guys think about this idea, I think that 2k16 should include the option to use premade draft classes with story lines to go along with them, random draft classes, or the ability to download draftclass from other players. What do yall think?

You can download draft classes from other players. Lol. That's why I only use real draft classes with real players. Only negative thing about that is I'm sure their faces aren't the best.

[POINT GOD]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

You can download draft classes from other players. Lol. That's why I only use real draft classes with real players. Only negative thing about that is I'm sure their faces aren't the best.

I know that you can download classes from other players, I'm talking about having that feature and also a 2k draftclass with story lines as well.

[thedream2k16]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Op seems as though you have forgotten what video games are for....... Its not your second job to do what you do. As a bball fan this game shouldn't be collecting dust till someone else hold your hand and makes a roster to their liking. For a game you are a little obsessed it seems

[Sam12345]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Op seems as though you have forgotten what video games are for....... Its not your second job to do what you do. As a bball fan this game shouldn't be collecting dust till someone else hold your hand and makes a roster to their liking. For a game you are a little obsessed it seems

Do you use user generated draft classes? Or 2k generated? If you use the former then you have no point, if you use the latter. Fair enough.

[nip83]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Tell me what you guys think about this idea, I think that 2k16 should include the option to use premade draft classes with story lines to go along with them, random draft classes, or the ability to download draftclass from other players. What do yall think?

Have you ever played pro evo soccer? This series had a whole pre-made generation of created young players that have since achieved cult status in the community.The drawback is that sometimes you might get bored with the same names and faces after a while.But it's a good idea, although i don't see 2k going into that level of detail for a mode that is not called mycareer/myteam.

[joosegoose]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Have you ever played pro evo soccer? This series had a whole pre-made generation of created young players that have since achieved cult status in the community.The drawback is that sometimes you might get bored with the same names and faces after a while.But it's a good idea, although i don't see 2k going into that level of detail for a mode that is not called mycareer/myteam.

They would if they charged VC for the classes...

[pacers101]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Have you ever played pro evo soccer? This series had a whole pre-made generation of created young players that have since achieved cult status in the community.The drawback is that sometimes you might get bored with the same names and faces after a while.But it's a good idea, although i don't see 2k going into that level of detail for a mode that is not called mycareer/myteam.

As a massive Pro Evo fan, I would urge 2k to never, ever look in the direction of Pro Evo for inspiration for its rookies! 2k is far more advanced than Pro Evo in player recreation. Pro Evo has been rolling out the same terrible set of made up players + regens (i.e. Kobe Bryant retires, then jumps straight back into the draft the next year with the same name, ratings etc) since probably the early 2000's. It is incredibly amateur and kills the realism if you try and do a long term franchise (Master League) mode.


It is an absolute disgrace to what could have been a great sporting franchise. The only thing that keeps that game going is the gameplay, and its ever dwindling fanbase who have been playing the franchise since the days it was truly great (of which I am one ).

[pacers101]

Re: A Frustration Amongst Greatness: NBA2K Generated Draft Classes

Tell me what you guys think about this idea, I think that 2k16 should include the option to use premade draft classes with story lines to go along with them, random draft classes, or the ability to download draftclass from other players. What do yall think?

You can get the pre-made classes with the stories from here at OS. They are good fun especially if you plan on playing 3-4 longer seasons rather than 15-20 shorter seasons (which is what I do). To be fair to 2k, I think they are trying to develop the story development side with the way you scout players over the course of a season, and get the injury warnings etc. Its fairly limited, but this is sports simulation not RPG. I'm sure it will get more advanced over time.


One criticism I possible have of the current system, aside from the appearances which I have already mentioned, is that it is too easy to scout players to a very, very accurate level. All but removes the chances of drafting a bust. I often turn on auto-scouting just to create some uncertainty for the draft.


However I did draft a bust the other day with the #2 pick, when I got a very highly rated PG with great potential, but he had the worst shot release I had ever seen in the game- super slow to get into the shot, but then suddenly a quick action that was really difficult to time... had to trade him straight away!! :-) Reminds me that I did like the old workout feature on old 2k games to test players out for real in scrimmages (even though you could cheat and use that to look at their ratings- not cool!).