NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

[alecast]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Most totally agree and it;s something I've said repeatedly. As unhappy as I am with the overall effort that's clearly been lacking in regards to the legends and their appearance/signature styles etc, I would rather have what we see now, than nothing at all.

I'm eternally grateful to 2k for even giving us this opportunity to use such incredible teams from yesteryear.

That said, as consumers, we shouldn't automatically give them a pass on this kind of thing. The legends have been visually lackluster since last gen, they've had 3 years to improve them so far, and we've not really seen much in that department.

I dunno, feels like we're damned if we give out constructive criticism, and damned if we don't.

Stop this thing "I`m glad..." 2k does not make the legends better because they don`t want to. They are being lazy since this gen started. Jordan looks so goofy that it is unbelievable. Unacceptable. Stockton does not resembles Stockton at all. Amateur work.
Their work has been so bad that they can`t even put the "Celtics" name right in a jersey. Instead, they put "Boston" in the 2008 squad`s chest. WTF??????

[cthurt]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Most totally agree and it;s something I've said repeatedly. As unhappy as I am with the overall effort that's clearly been lacking in regards to the legends and their appearance/signature styles etc, I would rather have what we see now, than nothing at all.

I'm eternally grateful to 2k for even giving us this opportunity to use such incredible teams from yesteryear.

That said, as consumers, we shouldn't automatically give them a pass on this kind of thing. The legends have been visually lackluster since last gen, they've had 3 years to improve them so far, and we've not really seen much in that department.

I dunno, feels like we're damned if we give out constructive criticism, and damned if we don't.

This is what scares me because I don't want 2k to think they are just wasting their time with classic teams because they think we don't appreciate what they do by bashing how the players look, but in the same breathe its VERY important how the players look esp, with how detailed these games are and with 4k gaming right around the corner it will only be more noticeable of the flaws if 2k doesn't correct it.


But with all that said fix Jordan's face and 2k wont hear a peep from me about anyone else lol.

[daveberg]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Stop this thing "I`m glad..." 2k does not make the legends better because they don`t want to. They are being lazy since this gen started. Jordan looks so goofy that it is unbelievable. Unacceptable. Stockton does not resembles Stockton at all. Amateur work.

Agree, they look absolutely awful, and nothing like their real life counterparts.

If the art team don't have enough time or resources to do a stand up job like they used to, then outsource it to the PC modding community. You hire the right guys, they'll smash it out of the park.

As discussed many times before, 2k is primarily about online & fantasy modes now, so things like the classic teams just get knocked to the back of the pecking order.

Sad, but looks to be true.

[daveberg]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

This is what scares me because I don't want 2k to think they are just wasting their time with classic teams because they think we don't appreciate what they do by bashing how the players look, but in the same breathe its VERY important how the players look esp, with how detailed these games are and with 4k gaming right around the corner it will only be more noticeable of the flaws if 2k doesn't correct it.


But with all that said fix Jordan's face and 2k wont hear a peep from me about anyone else lol.

Yeah, there's a fine line. We've gotta take it to them in a constructive manner or there's a chance they could just pull the plug all together - man that would be devastating for me. Dramatic, but I wouldn't buy 2k anymore if they dropped the legends.

I hear you on MJ - do that, and all is forgiven!!

[Scvllp]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

They won't pull the plug altogether. MyTeam is a bigger seller for them and legends are a big part of that.

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I feel like all the backlash is fuel for their marketing campaign because face scans is not a deal breaker for the major pop. of consumers.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

[cthurt]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

They won't pull the plug altogether. MyTeam is a bigger seller for them and legends are a big part of that.

But Madden does the same thing without actually having classic teams in the game so 2k could still get away with it, but for guys like me who don't play MYTEAM it would be of no use.

[VDusen04]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Just to go against the grain a little bit here, it seems 2k's biggest problem with the classic players is they don't look as good as last gens versions, I think we can all agree on that, but I ask the ones who feel like they totally dropped the ball on the current gen classic players, would you rather what we have now or nothing at all?

I ask this because I guarantee most of us would be a lot easier on 2k if they just started this classic teams and players thing in 2k14 on current gen instead of 2k11, the main thing we would say is I am just glad its in the game and since they cant scan their faces I understand, but what keeps the conversation going is the 2k11 and 2k12 versions of the classic players that looked so good.

I guess I am just glad 2k didn't say that the classic players don't look up to par with what we had last gen so lets just scrap the whole thing and hopefully the customers will understand, because they could have gone that route.

I understand where you're coming from and I agree. I would much rather have a Michael Jordan with a Bubba Gump face than no Michael Jordan at all.

In fact, 2K exceeded all my expectations when it comes to classic teams. I never thought they'd be possible in basketball because I figured it'd mean they'd have to go secure all the individual rights of players, since they couldn't skirt by with editable names and generic faces like historic teams in NFL 2K5 and NHL 2K tended to do.

Fortunately for all of us fans and gamers, 2K11 happened. And unfortunately for next-gen designers, 2K11 happened.



In all honesty, if 2K17 was the first time we'd ever received classic teams, I'd be thrilled. But we've lived through 2K11 (and 2K12), so you can't close Pandora's box. In this case, 2K is a victim of their own incredible commitment to detail. I mean, for crying out loud, they literally had cyber MJ turn to the viewer at home and ask, "Are you ready?" before running out of the tunnel at Chicago Stadium.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OGTnUCl4KYc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm still really happy the classics are still around (and not too many have been cut). It seems like they easily could have been left behind on last gen. That said, now that we've seen what they can be, it's tough to settle for less (in some cases, a lot less). 2K11's classics were such an incredible base that I figured the state of classic teams would have been otherworldly by the time we reached 2K17. Instead, it's almost as though we've gone in reverse (actually, that's exactly what's happened).

Consider a few of the things 2K11 offered during their inaugural classics push:

-18 classic teams (8 for the Bulls alone)
-Different jersey textures depending upon the era (1991 Bulls jerseys had that plastic shine on the numbers while the mid- to late-90's Bulls teams, correctly, did not)
-Wonderful bulk of custom Michael Jordan animations (cuff dunk, free throw line dunk, soaring one-hand leaner, two-hand pump, one-handed ball fake, wrist-slap reverse, etc.)
-Custom commentary for most classic starters and teams
-A mode devoted to classics
-Jordan's tongue
-The context-driven moments where Jordan would shrug his shoulders if he connected on six treys in the first half against Portland, or when Scottie Pippen would guide him to the sideline during the Flu Game

Then consider what was added in 2K12:

-Just about every one of the greatest NBA players of all-time accounted for (excluding a few such as Charles Barkley and George Mikan)
-A mode devoted to all those classic players
-36 classic teams
-Era-appropriate accessories (knee-high striped socks, Chuck Taylors)
-Era-appropriate scorers tables, basket stanchions, etc.
-Era-appropriate rules (one free throw for non-shooting defensive fouls in the 60's, jump balls after each quarter, etc).
-Era-specific filters and audio (black & white with tin can audio in 60's, standard def with generic computer overlay graphics in the 80's, just-about-modern-but-not-quite in the 90's (NBC-ish).
-Current players retro-fitted to match their younger likenesses (Tim Duncan had his '98 haircut and goatee, Frobe, etc)
-Signature dunk and layup packages for many classic players, including but not limited to: Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, Dominique Wilkins, Karl Malone, Tim Duncan, Shaquille O'Neal and Shawn Kemp.
-A DLC 3-on-3 add-on that brought aboard even more classic players (with an XBox semi-hack ability of adding those players to actual rosters)
-The ability to download individual create-a-player DNA's to fill out the missing roster slots as needed (ex: former roster creator PortlandBlazer would crank out near life-like editions of guys like Nick Van Exel)
-Authentic arena music for the given era (organ, soundtrack, differentiating buzzer sounds)



On top of everything else, even without the benefit of face scans, most of the legends looked outstanding (save for a few longstanding issues like Vinny Del Negro and Mark Price).



Considering such a stellar two-year stretch, I think a lot of us were dreaming where 2K classics would be by 2K17. Maybe guys like David Robinson and Penny Hardaway would get themselves signature dunk packages by now too. Maybe the era-filters would be pre-game selectable options. Maybe shorts length and goggles would be selectable options in create-a-team or team/player edit. Maybe there'd be a new moments mode, where players re-create big moments (a la Jordan Challenge) but with everyone else, like 2K13's mobile game supposedly employed.



Instead, classic players and teams have become more and more generic by the year. Less authentic dribble moves, signature dunk packages biting the dust, Michael Rappaport taking over for Rod Stewart as a Larry Bird stand-in, less MJ moves, no more era-specific baskets, tables, sounds, filters, or rules. No mode incorporating historic moments. More stringent roster editing (from what I've understood, there was no single player download option and rosters kept on having to be loaded over and over). So on and so forth.

The cat's out of the bag. We've known what 2K's been capable of on the classic front. We understand if they aren't the priority year in and year out. I just wish they didn't have to go backward.

[daveberg]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I understand where you're coming from and I agree. I would much rather have a Michael Jordan with a Bubba Gump face than no Michael Jordan at all.

In fact, 2K exceeded all my expectations when it comes to classic teams. I never thought they'd be possible in basketball because I figured it'd mean they'd have to go secure all the individual rights of players, since they couldn't skirt by with editable names and generic faces like historic teams in NFL 2K5 and NHL 2K tended to do.

Fortunately for all of us fans and gamers, 2K11 happened. And unfortunately for next-gen designers, 2K11 happened.



In all honesty, if 2K17 was the first time we'd ever received classic teams, I'd be thrilled. But we've lived through 2K11 (and 2K12), so you can't close Pandora's box. In this case, 2K is a victim of their own incredible commitment to detail. I mean, for crying out loud, they literally had cyber MJ turn to the viewer at home and ask, "Are you ready?" before running out of the tunnel at Chicago Stadium.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OGTnUCl4KYc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm still really happy the classics are still around (and not too many have been cut). It seems like they easily could have been left behind on last gen. That said, now that we've seen what they can be, it's tough to settle for less (in some cases, a lot less). 2K11's classics were such an incredible base that I figured the state of classic teams would have been otherworldly by the time we reached 2K17. Instead, it's almost as though we've gone in reverse (actually, that's exactly what's happened).

Consider a few of the things 2K11 offered during their inaugural classics push:

-18 classic teams (8 for the Bulls alone)
-Different jersey textures depending upon the era (1991 Bulls jerseys had that plastic shine on the numbers while the mid- to late-90's Bulls teams, correctly, did not)
-Wonderful bulk of custom Michael Jordan animations (cuff dunk, free throw line dunk, soaring one-hand leaner, two-hand pump, one-handed ball fake, wrist-slap reverse, etc.)
-Custom commentary for most classic starters and teams
-A mode devoted to classics
-Jordan's tongue
-The context-driven moments where Jordan would shrug his shoulders if he connected on six treys in the first half against Portland, or when Scottie Pippen would guide him to the sideline during the Flu Game

Then consider what was added in 2K12:

-Just about every one of the greatest NBA players of all-time accounted for (excluding a few such as Charles Barkley and George Mikan)
-A mode devoted to all those classic players
-36 classic teams
-Era-appropriate accessories (knee-high striped socks, Chuck Taylors)
-Era-appropriate scorers tables, basket stanchions, etc.
-Era-appropriate rules (one free throw for non-shooting defensive fouls in the 60's, jump balls after each quarter, etc).
-Era-specific filters and audio (black & white with tin can audio in 60's, standard def with generic computer overlay graphics in the 80's, just-about-modern-but-not-quite in the 90's (NBC-ish).
-Current players retro-fitted to match their younger likenesses (Tim Duncan had his '98 haircut and goatee, Frobe, etc)
-Signature dunk and layup packages for many classic players, including but not limited to: Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, Dominique Wilkins, Karl Malone, Tim Duncan, Shaquille O'Neal and Shawn Kemp.
-A DLC 3-on-3 add-on that brought aboard even more classic players (with an XBox semi-hack ability of adding those players to actual rosters)
-The ability to download individual create-a-player DNA's to fill out the missing roster slots as needed (ex: former roster creator PortlandBlazer would crank out near life-like editions of guys like Nick Van Exel)
-Authentic arena music for the given era (organ, soundtrack, differentiating buzzer sounds)



On top of everything else, even without the benefit of face scans, most of the legends looked outstanding (save for a few longstanding issues like Vinny Del Negro and Mark Price).



Considering such a stellar two-year stretch, I think a lot of us were dreaming where 2K classics would be by 2K17. Maybe guys like David Robinson and Penny Hardaway would get themselves signature dunk packages by now too. Maybe the era-filters would be pre-game selectable options. Maybe shorts length and goggles would be selectable options in create-a-team or team/player edit. Maybe there'd be a new moments mode, where players re-create big moments (a la Jordan Challenge) but with everyone else, like 2K13's mobile game supposedly employed.



Instead, classic players and teams have become more and more generic by the year. Less authentic dribble moves, signature dunk packages biting the dust, Michael Rappaport taking over for Rod Stewart as a Larry Bird stand-in, less MJ moves, no more era-specific baskets, tables, sounds, filters, or rules. No mode incorporating historic moments. More stringent roster editing (from what I've understood, there was no single player download option and rosters kept on having to be loaded over and over). So on and so forth.

The cat's out of the bag. We've known what 2K's been capable of on the classic front. We understand if they aren't the priority year in and year out. I just wish they didn't have to go backward.

Man, you deserve a STANDING ovation for that dude.

Incredible post, covering all bases.

100% agree with everything here.

[23]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Just shows you what 2k is capable of.

[youvalss]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

Not sure how I missed it in the picture, but after seeing the trailer it's clear now: they gave MJ an elbow band. This has to be the first time ever.

[Culture Rot]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I couldn't believe this was real when I first saw it. What happened here?

[MarkWilliam]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I understood that Jordan and co. was a bit "bare bones" when gen 4 released. Totally cool with it considering.


It's merely the fact that it's been 3 years and counting and no ground has been made. It indicates its not as important to 2K as it is to so many of us.


Clearly they have the ability.


And this year it seems they are promoting the 92 Dream Team so I was hopeful this was the year it finally caught up..... but not so much (in Jordan's case anyway).


Just curious how they all MOVE. Fingers crossed for some signature stuff.


Call me crazy, but if they put the gen 3 face on the gen 4 body I'd be happier than this god awful version haha.

[daveberg]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I understood that Jordan and co. was a bit "bare bones" when gen 4 released. Totally cool with it considering.


It's merely the fact that it's been 3 years and counting and no ground has been made. It indicates its not as important to 2K as it is to so many of us.


Clearly they have the ability.


And this year it seems they are promoting the 92 Dream Team so I was hopeful this was the year it finally caught up..... but not so much (in Jordan's case anyway).


Just curious how they all MOVE. Fingers crossed for some signature stuff.


Call me crazy, but if they put the gen 3 face on the gen 4 body I'd be happier than this god awful version haha.

Again, spot on my friend.

I'm so disappointed with the new footage - most of the guys in the dream team I can deal with, there's even been some improvements to some of them but C'MON 2K - How are you going to KEEP giving us this watered down version of Michael Jordan???

We know what you're capable of, you had him looking right from 2k11 through to '13 - why on Earth has that changed for the worse?

As I mentioned in another post, if you got ANYONE right in this game, you'd like to think it would be The Goat. Of ALL players.

It pains me to think a 5ppg bench player in this game will receive better visuals than someone of Jordan's stature.....

C'mon 2k - we know you're good for it, give us some of that old magic from 2k11.

[Culture Rot]

Re: NBA 2K17 Screenshot - 1992 Dream Team with Charles Barkley

I understood that Jordan and co. was a bit "bare bones" when gen 4 released. Totally cool with it considering.


It's merely the fact that it's been 3 years and counting and no ground has been made. It indicates its not as important to 2K as it is to so many of us.


Clearly they have the ability.

The 'ability' and the 'will' are two different things entirely bud