Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

[2_headedmonster]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

I was going to say this, I've noticed the defense is more stout in the paint and blocks are borderline OP.

[allBthere]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

I think future I'd like to be able to confirm the features that matter to me work before I buy. The big one for me is zero broadcast elements in mycareer at the nba level - no instant replays, no broadcast elements at all like that.

I keep checking after updates and patches but it never got fixed. Now I pretty much know it won't - but I don't want to support this game moving forward unless I know for sure it's not like that. Has anyone actually returned a game before? like if I get a physical copy of '22 and I bring it back a couple of days later saying it's got bugs/broken features?

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

I think future I'd like to be able to confirm the features that matter to me work before I buy. The big one for me is zero broadcast elements in mycareer at the nba level - no instant replays, no broadcast elements at all like that.

I keep checking after updates and patches but it never got fixed. Now I pretty much know it won't - but I don't want to support this game moving forward unless I know for sure it's not like that. Has anyone actually returned a game before? like if I get a physical copy of '22 and I bring it back a couple of days later saying it's got bugs/broken features?

Once you buy it physically...it's a done deal. You can sell it back, or exchange it for the same exact title.

[Vni]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Oh yeah. There are definitely some things that are better on next-gen. Current-gen felt like it gave me more OTF control than next gen, and the shooting felt better to me. After playing so many "next-gen" games on the Series X, admittedly, I got sucked back in to next-gen NBA 2K21 due to the graphics. I couldn't ignore the side-by-side comparison any longer.

I admire those people who can go back and play older NBA 2K titles after they got the latest one. However, had they updated the rosters on NBA 2K20 to remove injuries, that might have been the only time that I would have played an older title. Sabonis and Lamb were too big of cogs to the team for me to ignore and not care about using them in PNO.

Ive been playing 2k18 on pc for a while. Few days ago I decided to get 2k20. And I realised how worse 2k got. There is nothing that is an improvement over 2k18 when it comes to offline play.
Player movement got worse, it feels clunky and looks wierd, transition defense is gone, no more space the floor d pad option so the spacing is messed up with unstoppable motion, the AI got a lot worse offensively, they also decided to add another button press to call for a p'n'r and run plays wich is just a mind blowing decision. I could go on. 2k release different version of the same game every year, certainly not better version.
How the game got this worse in a two year span is beyond me.

[Walt Frazier]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

They still tweak gameplay but don’t leave patch notes.

They 'tweak' issues the online community gets angry about...that is it.

Beluba and Da Czar have done absolutely nothing to fix the CPU P n Roll D, lack of double teams, mismatches not recognised, Embiid can post up and back down everyone and no help comes...

[m29a]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Oof. I think these threads that often contain hyperbolic unconstructive feedback is one of the reasons we don't get developers coming in here as often as they did even 5 years ago. Personally, it's why I've visited less and less, it ends up just being a waste of my time reading this stuff.

Honestly, none of it is in-depth, people usually keep it vague with "this is broken, fix it" "graphics are terrible" "game unplayable!" "this is trash" etc.

Yet, a developer would get far more benefit if people actually explained the areas that need attention and in specific ways. So if you are a person saying the graphics are bad, explain what parts of the game don't look great. The player models, the lighting/shaders, the courts and reflections? What specifically?

The game is bad? What parts? Offense or defense? *When* is it bad, when a pick n roll is called? When you're driving to the basket? When you're running plays? See what I mean here? Constructive feedback goes a long way, especially if you expect some type of interaction back.

I'm not saying that expecting more is a bad thing or that the game is perfect, but that fixing issues probably isn't going to be as simple as some think. Compared to 10-20 years ago, the game is likely far more complex to deal with. And the short development cycle doesn't help. They're likely deep into 2K22 by now. Of course, as a consumer next time around you can say "hey, 2K21 burned me, so I won't buy the next one".

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Oof. I think these threads that often contain hyperbolic unconstructive feedback is one of the reasons we don't get developers coming in here as often as they did even 5 years ago. Personally, it's why I've visited less and less, it ends up just being a waste of my time reading this stuff.

Honestly, none of it is in-depth, people usually keep it vague with "this is broken, fix it" "graphics are terrible" "game unplayable!" "this is trash" etc.

Yet, a developer would get far more benefit if people actually explained the areas that need attention and in specific ways. So if you are a person saying the graphics are bad, explain what parts of the game don't look great. The player models, the lighting/shaders, the courts and reflections? What specifically?

The game is bad? What parts? Offense or defense? *When* is it bad, when a pick n roll is called? When you're driving to the basket? When you're running plays? See what I mean here? Constructive feedback goes a long way, especially if you expect some type of interaction back.

I'm not saying that expecting more is a bad thing or that the game is perfect, but that fixing issues probably isn't going to be as simple as some think. Compared to 10-20 years ago, the game is likely far more complex to deal with. And the short development cycle doesn't help. They're likely deep into 2K22 by now. Of course, as a consumer next time around you can say "hey, 2K21 burned me, so I won't buy the next one".

Feedback is not the problem. There are plenty of dedicated threads with active users on almost all things NBA 2K.

PNO (My mode of choice)
REC (Technically titled as a matchmaking thread, but it evolved)
MyNBA (Stickied thread too)
Art/Graphics (Their users are doing better sticking to their thread)
Gameplay Bugs (A stickied thread every year)
MyPlayer Builds (Another mis-titled thread, but it evolved)
Legends (Been going since NBA 2K18)

Like...at this point, how much more feedback they need? In some cases, people are still upset about yearly legacy issues. Getting feedback is the least of their issues. Developers can come into any one of the above threads, and I really believe that the active users are mature enough to hold a decent conversations about the problems. "Lack of constructive feedback" is no longer an excuse anymore.

[leoribas3]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Few other games have such an active community pointing out areas that need improvement in the game year in and year out. As a community, we DEFINITELY do our part in communicating to the devs what we feel. The problem is, money talks. Its just the truth. Look back at NBA 2k11, arguably the greatest of all time, and compare what they focused on that game and whats their focus now. It used to be all about realistic balanced gameplay, interesting and fun modes, NO VIRTUAL CURRENCY, no shortcuts to making your player overpowered.

Now its Badges, Green releases, paying for everything with VC, game breaking bugs in modes that aint fixed in YEARS

its pretty simple, online gives them the most money, so they milk it, and make everything else a distant bottom of the list afterthought.

Its the Business.

Thats what happens with no competition.

[simbayless]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Feedback is not the problem. There are plenty of dedicated threads with active users on almost all things NBA 2K.

PNO (My mode of choice)
REC (Technically titled as a matchmaking thread, but it evolved)
MyNBA (Stickied thread too)
Art/Graphics (Their users are doing better sticking to their thread)
Gameplay Bugs (A stickied thread every year)
MyPlayer Builds (Another mis-titled thread, but it evolved)
Legends (Been going since NBA 2K18)

Like...at this point, how much more feedback they need? In some cases, people are still upset about yearly legacy issues. Getting feedback is the least of their issues. Developers can come into any one of the above threads, and I really believe that the active users are mature enough to hold a decent conversations about the problems. "Lack of constructive feedback" is no longer an excuse anymore.

That's why I just laugh out my anger at the Madden feedback sticky every year and they have the nerve to bring the community manger asking for feedback to tell the Devs nothing against him that's his job but even he knows EA is full of it lol

2k Devs don't interact on here anymore because of constrictive crictism when 2k was in it's prime years (2k11&2k16) they didn't have no problem interacting with the community for feedback then because of the D-riding they was recieving now they are caught like a dear and the headlights so they hide

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Few other games have such an active community pointing out areas that need improvement in the game year in and year out. As a community, we DEFINITELY do our part in communicating to the devs what we feel. The problem is, money talks. Its just the truth. Look back at NBA 2k11, arguably the greatest of all time, and compare what they focused on that game and whats their focus now. It used to be all about realistic balanced gameplay, interesting and fun modes, NO VIRTUAL CURRENCY, no shortcuts to making your player overpowered.

Now its Badges, Green releases, paying for everything with VC, game breaking bugs in modes that aint fixed in YEARS

its pretty simple, online gives them the most money, so they milk it, and make everything else a distant bottom of the list afterthought.

Its the Business.

Thats what happens with no competition.

Lack of competition is not the reason. Unlike Madden with the NFL license (until last year anyways), any company can step in the ring and try to compete against NBA 2K. There's nothing to stop them, so for the moment...NBA 2K is its own competition.

Honestly, I think it's time that they SERIOUSLY look into changing the development cycle for the game. No, I'm not going to say the cliche comment about releasing a game every 2 years, because we all know by now that the NBA won't allow that. They genuinely may have to take the same approach that Activision does and that's having 2-3 studios working on the game.

Also, I think the Executives might be having just a tad bit too much input with the development direction of the game.

[tru11]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Lack of competition is not the reason. Unlike Madden with the NFL license (until last year anyways), any company can step in the ring and try to compete against NBA 2K. There's nothing to stop them, so for the moment...NBA 2K is its own competition.



Honestly, I think it's time that they SERIOUSLY look into changing the development cycle for the game. No, I'm not going to say the cliche comment about releasing a game every 2 years, because we all know by now that the NBA won't allow that. They genuinely may have to take the same approach that Activision does and that's having 2-3 studios working on the game.



Also, I think the Executives might be having just a tad bit too much input with the development direction of the game.

Doubt a 2K game will be made by another studio that aint 2K lol.

That is a lot of wishful thinking.

You are better then that.



Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[JUSTlFIED]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Doubt a 2K game will be made by another studio that aint 2K lol.

That is a lot of wishful thinking.

You are better then that.



Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Doesnt have to be a different studio but different teams, for example From Software have multiple teams who do the Souls Game. Avalanche Studios is another that comes to mind.

In fact they just acquired another company, HookBang, with 100s of devs to support NBA2K.

Let Mike Wang and his team build a framework, then start to rotate out with another, that way each team has a longer dev cycle.

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

Doesnt have to be a different studio but different teams, for example From Software have multiple teams who do the Souls Game. Avalanche Studios is another that comes to mind.

In fact they just acquired another company, HookBang, with 100s of devs to support NBA2K.

Let Mike Wang and his team build a framework, then start to rotate out with another, that way each team has a longer dev cycle.

This was exactly what I was talking about and HookBand seems to be the solution. The problem with NBA 2K, to me, is either they don't have enough people or they don't have enough time. Hell, it could be a combination of both. When I play NBA 2K on the next-gen, I really see a game that wasn't completed when compared to the copy/paste of current gen.

[JUSTlFIED]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

This was exactly what I was talking about and HookBand seems to be the solution. The problem with NBA 2K, to me, is either they don't have enough people or they don't have enough time. Hell, it could be a combination of both. When I play NBA 2K on the next-gen, I really see a game that wasn't completed when compared to the copy/paste of current gen.

I know calling it copy/paste is a negative way to describe it, but lets be honest, 2K19,2K20, and "current-gen" 2K21 are virtually the same game. Even some of art assets from 2K19 are still on 2K21. Hopefully, this acquisition is what they needed, even though I feel like upper management is the real issue

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: Why did 2k drop gameplay support for next gen?

I know calling it copy/paste is a negative way to describe it, but lets be honest, 2K19,2K20, and "current-gen" 2K21 are virtually the same game. Even some of art assets from 2K19 are still on 2K21. Hopefully, this acquisition is what they needed, even though I feel like upper management is the real issue

Yeah...I'm starting to put money on upper management being the problem too.