Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

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  • Comduklakis
    MVP
    • Oct 2005
    • 1887

    #1

    Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

    I'm adding what I've discovered at the beginning of my post here. You can read the process and some more detail through the thread.

    After running a few more tests I think I'm relatively comfortable with what I'm seeing.

    Some issues that seem to pop up regardless of sliders:

    1. Howard, Millsap and Wade sign for too much and for multiple years

    2. A couple teams will always sign guys I don't recognize to fairly hefty contracts ranging from 1/8m to 2/13 or 14m. I'm guessing this has something to do with the G league progression I've heard some about.

    3. Certain players seem hardcoded to get paid. The most prominent are Harry Giles, Alan Williams and Georgios Papagiannis. No matter the sliders, with potential way down, minutes down (which as was said earlier does seem to work in reverse of what you would think) they get signed to 2/13 or 14m deals despite not actually playing much during the season.

    4. Teams still are apt to stockpile at a position. The teams most prone to this seem to be the Clippers and Pacers, probably due to cap space/players available in that mid range/non max level.

    5. Options for top players are limited due to a lack of trades to open up cap space. As a result Klay usually winds up in Atlanta or staying in GS. Kemba, Kawhi, Butler, all stay in Charlotte, Toronto, and Minnesota (I know, I know) respectively. Trades that I see (I don't allow them, but I like to see what is being offered) are still largely player for player type deals. Picks being offered are limited. Teams aren't trying to blow it up or get cap space and really teams aren't even trying to add a piece for the playoff run. Next up I will mess with trade sliders and see if this can be improved. I'm not optimistic because this seems to be a limitation of sports games (I see it in the Show as well as 2k). But I'll give it a shot.


    I tried experimenting with some other suggestions in this thread. I didn't care for the "zero" sliders because I found some top guys signed for a bit too little and a few solid players sat in FA at the start of season. But honestly after simming a bunch, As long as you keep the potential slider way down, the minutes slider down (it is counter intuitive I know), player fame low, I don't know that the salary curve, Durability, non-financial ambitions make much difference. Each Sim looked overall decent with some head scratchers and always a couple guys you know would be signed IRL. But as I said above, certain issues are going to be hard to fix even with sliders.

    Min Rating 50
    Max Rating 60
    Salary Curve 40
    Player Potential 10
    Player Durability 40
    Player Minutes 35
    Player fame 20
    Player non-financial ambitions 50







    Looking to find if anyone has simmed a bunch of seasons to find what Sliders work best for free agency and contracts.

    I tried these sliders:

    Min Rating: 20
    Max Rating: 40
    Salary Curve: 50
    Player Potential: 50
    Player Durability: 50
    Player Minutes: 50
    Player Frame: 40
    Player non-Financial Ambitions: 65

    Here is how the off season went and some VERY EARLY extensions went. Sticking with the big names and some "eye openers" for me.

    Now keep in mind when you see some of these guys signing that Klay Thompson and Julius Randle didn't sign until a game into the season and both took 1 year vet minimum deals.

    Philly signed Deyonta Davis 1/9.89m; James Young 1/7.5m; Shabazz Muhammad 1/7.31m; Khris Middleton 4/107.92m

    Milwaukee signed Dwyane Wade 1/15.59m; Ivica Zubac 1/8.92m; Bobby Portis 1/12.69m

    Chicago signs Alec Burks 1/7.37; Harry Giles 2/33.77m

    Cleveland signs Klay Thompson (1 game into the season) 1/1.57m; Sam Dekker 1/3.92m

    Boston extends Horford 4/110.24m; Hayward 3/108.58m

    Clippers sign Cheick Diallo 1/10.75m; Michael Kidd-Gilchrist 1/9.86m; Donta Geiger (i'm guessing a generated non-drafted player???) 1/7.37m

    Memphis signs Demarre Carroll 1/7.43m; Justin Anderson 1/7.29m; Dj Wilson 1/10.32m

    Atlanta signs Jamal Crawford 1/7.07m, extends Bazemore 2/23.4m

    Heat sign Justice Winslow to qualifying offer 1/4.67m; extend Whiteside 4/122.5m, extend James Johnson 2/24.57m

    Hornets sign Wade Baldwin 1/11.76m; Frank Kaminsky qualifying offer 1/4.67m; extends Batum 2/29.6m; extends Marvin Williams 2/11.11m

    Jazz sign Mario Hezonja 1/8.88m; extend Crowder 2/32.28m

    Kings Sign J.J. Redick 1/11.13m; Tyler Ullis (!!!) 1/8.81m; Wilson Chandler 1/4.61m; DeMarcus Cousins 3/98.2m

    Knicks sign Kevon Looney 1/7.27m; extend Hardaway Jr. 2/26.31m

    Lakers sign Jonothan Motley 1/10.7m; Georgios Papagianis 1/11.1m; Jimmy Butler 3/98.2m

    Magic sign Patrick Beverly 1/8.89m; KCP 1/8.24m; extend Fournier 2/32.77m; extend Simmons 3/35.3m; Rajon Rondo 3/45.45m

    Mavericks sign Dedmon 1/7.73m; Dinwiddie 1/12.71m; Seth Curry 1/8.35m; extend Barnes 3/68.2m; DeAndre Jordan 4/127.43m; Nikola Mirotic 3/45.46m

    Nets sign Mike Scott 2/13.98m; Rashad Vaughn 1/9.36m; andrew Harrision 1/8.02m/ DeAngelo Russell 5/149.11m; Isaiah Thomas 3/66.78m;

    Nuggets sign Gerald Green 1/7.32m; Paul Millsap 3/76.78m (coming off 9.7ppg 5.1 RPG)

    Pacers sign Ante Zizic 1/13.32m; Darren Collison 1/8.49m; Marc Gasol 4/130.8m; Malcolm Brogdon 3/52.91m; Lance Stephenson 2/15.52m;

    Pelicans signs Carmelo Anthony 1/19.07m; Noah Vonleh 1/8.45m; Cameron Payne 1/9.65m; Nikola Vucevic 3/65.28m;

    Pistons (me) sign Stanley Johnson to qualifying offer 1/4.67m; Luke Kornett 1/1.4m; Tim Frazier 1/1.57m; Jerian Grant 1/8.94m (backup PG market was extremely tight and crazy)

    Raptors sign Delon Wright 1/3.64m; extend Ibaka 3/56.2m, Kawhi Leonard 3/94.68m; Jonas Valanciunas 4/102.36m; Fred Van Vleet 1/9.28m;

    Rockets PJ Tucker 2/16.32m;

    Spurs sign Myles Turner 3/81.83m; extend DeRozan 3/108.9m; Pau Gasol 1/16.0m; Gay 3/38.4m

    Suns sign Alan Williams 1/7.09m; Greg Monroe 1/11.4m; Markieff Morris 1/8.95m

    Thunder sign Alex Abrines 1/6.82m; extend Roberson 3/40.91m

    Twolves sign Elfrid Payton 1/10.78m; Nerlens Noel 1/8.16m (coming off a lost season with a broken leg no less); Julius Randle (one game into season) 1/2.07m; extend Teague 2/24.89m; Tyus Jones 3/41.94m; Gergui Deng 2/33.52m; Josh Smith 1/1.57m

    Blazers nothing of note

    Warriors signs Joffrey Lauvergne 2/6.70m; Extend Iggy 2/17.94m; Green 4/131.61m; Livingston 2/13.4m; Kevin Durant 5/195.43m; Jordan Bell 2/30.51m

    Wizards sign Tyreke Evans (one game into season) 1/1.57m; Dwight Howard 4/142.8m; Kelly Oubre Jr. 3/44.89m

    Still sitting in Free Agency at the all star break season 2: Rondae Hollis-Jefferson, Thaddeus Young, Austin Rivers, Kostas Koufos, Trevor Booker, JaVale McGee, Michael Beasley, Kenneth Faried, Kyle O'Quinn; Robin Lopez, Derrick Rose, James Ennis, Justin Holiday, Omri Casspi, Jeremy Lamb, Ed Davis, Trevor Ariza, Tyson Chandler, Garrett Temple; Cory Joseph, Luc Mbah A Moute, Terrence Ross, Wesley Mathews, Danny Green, Corey Brewer, Nick Young, Nick Stauskas, Tyler Ennis, Devin Harris, Jared Dudley, Michael Carter Williams, Anthony Tolliver, Luol Deng, Ramon Sessions, Jerryd Bayless, Darrelo Arthur, Aaron Aflallo

    Horrific. I didn't tinker largely with the sliders just to see what would happen. Obviously potential matters FAR too much. At the same time some of these signings are just amazing head scratchers. Guys like Cameron Payne and Tyler Ullis who have no potential and are scraping to stay out of the G league are signing for 9 million.

    And per usual teams stock up on too many of the same spots, not recognizing position fit or system fit. you can see from the FA pool that again OVR is king (and potential) and guys that have specialties are ignored. Quality vets ignored for no names with potential.

    Overall a huge disappointment.

    So if anyone has tinkered with this and come up with a set of sliders that rewards performance, has guys signing for multi year contracts, rewards vets, etc., I would love to see them.
    Last edited by Comduklakis; 09-22-2018, 09:50 PM. Reason: adding sliders after testing
    http://www.operationsports.com/forum...y-cant-we.html

    http://www.operationsports.com/forum...ow-2012-a.html
  • Mikelopedia
    The Real Birdman
    • Jan 2008
    • 1523

    #2
    Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

    Go the other way with min and max rating and have max rating a little higher than min. Drop curve slightly. Drop potential wayyy down. Decrease player minutes (this slider actually seems to be reversed), this will allow guys who might normally command more money but who miss the whole season with an injury take a cheaper make good deal. Keep player fame at default.

    Try that and see how it feels.
    Die hard Heat and Dolphins fan since '89

    PSN: MiiikeMarsh

    Comment

    • 8KB24
      MVP
      • Jun 2012
      • 2106

      #3
      Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

      How about this guys


      Comment

      • 8KB24
        MVP
        • Jun 2012
        • 2106

        #4
        Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

        These are the contract values


        Spoiler

        Comment

        • michdb8
          Rookie
          • Jan 2017
          • 282

          #5
          Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

          Originally posted by 8KB24
          These are the contract values


          Spoiler

          looks like this is one of the closets to real I see until now but I m curious why Irving or Porzingis, Karl-Anthony Towns get such low salaries (last two maybe cause low potential value) looks difficult to find a perfect spot even with the slider

          Comment

          • jetsman92
            Rookie
            • Jan 2010
            • 388

            #6
            Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

            Ummmmm why did the pacers sign so many centers to big money contracts???? Seems like the team management logic is still awful... They committed so much of their cap space to two players at the same position

            Comment

            • 8KB24
              MVP
              • Jun 2012
              • 2106

              #7
              Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

              Originally posted by michdb8

              looks like this is one of the closets to real I see until now but I m curious why Irving or Porzingis, Karl-Anthony Towns get such low salaries (last two maybe cause low potential value) looks difficult to find a perfect spot even with the slider

              Irving actually signed max contract https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2018/06/...or-201819.html


              7-9 yrs 132/4 which is what Irving got with a new team.


              KP got slightly less than max

              0-6 max with own team is 147/5 and he signed 142/5 presumably because of durability. Maybe he missed games during regular season and did not get the full max.


              KAT only signed 4yrs deal 132/4 which I assume is supermax/Derrick Rose type contract for 4 yrs.

              Comment

              • jeremym480
                Speak it into existence
                • Oct 2008
                • 18197

                #8
                Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                Originally posted by jetsman92
                Ummmmm why did the pacers sign so many centers to big money contracts???? Seems like the team management logic is still awful... They committed so much of their cap space to two players at the same position

                Not to get off topic too far but Turner can play PF in a "Twin Towers" type of scenario. Yeah, the NBA is moving to a more mobile PF's who can stretch the floor. However, if you look up and down the depth charts at who's penciled in at PF for every team, there's only a handful that would give Turner a tough time on the defensive end. I actually had that same duo for the Pacers in 2K18. I'm sure position stacking is still prevalent for AI teams but for me that isn't a good example of it.

                Anyway, I'm really like what I'm seeing with that set 8KB24. I don't think everything with contracts is ever going to be 100% perfect. And while I still see a few head scratchers, it's still much better that what I saw in 2K18.
                My 2K17 Boston Celtics MyLeague

                Alabama Crimson Tide
                Green Bay Packers
                Boston Celtics

                New Orleans Pelicans

                Comment

                • Oba
                  Rookie
                  • Apr 2013
                  • 160

                  #9
                  Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                  Yeah those actually look quite good apart from the comments above.

                  Any way of tweaking that? I guess it would require a roster change for teams stacking up on certain positions or maybe it's just logic we can't affect?

                  Low deals for Porzingis/Towns are probably fixable with sliders.

                  Comment

                  • 8KB24
                    MVP
                    • Jun 2012
                    • 2106

                    #10
                    Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                    I always go through teams before first game and adjust lineups for that season for every team. So you don't have Ingram playing behind LeBron and Hart behind KCP and Lance. Instead Kuzma is backup for LeBron at the 4 spot, Lance is backup to Ingram at 3 spot and Hart backs up KCP. I move Beasley to center/PF because that's what he'll play this year.


                    KP and KAT basically signed 4yr max deals

                    Comment

                    • Comduklakis
                      MVP
                      • Oct 2005
                      • 1887

                      #11
                      Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                      Simmed a new offseason using the following sliders:

                      Min Rating 50
                      Max Rating 60
                      Salary Curve 40
                      Player potential 10
                      Player durability 40
                      Player minutes 40
                      Player Fame 20
                      Player non-financial ambitions 50



                      Contract extensions during season:
                      Kawhi Leonard 3/93.82m
                      Austin Rivers 2/15.95m
                      Jordan Bell 2/18.24m
                      Goran Dragic 2/28.15m
                      Jeremy Lamb 2/15.61m


                      76ers: Sefolosha 2/7.28m; Amir Johnson 1/1.57m; Bledsoe 3/38.51m, Redick 2/16.25m;

                      Bucks: Jamychal Green 2/9.63m; Ellington 2/6.18m; Darren Collison 2/14.73m; Brogdon 3/33.55m

                      Bulls: Dinwiddie 2/14.01m; Cousins 4/133.34m

                      Cavs: Dekker 1/3.92m; Nance Jr. 3/25.49m; Bojan Bogdanovic 3/24.4m

                      Celtics: Rozier 3/34.85m; Irving 5/165.87m; Taj Gibson 2/8.58m; Theis 1/1.72m

                      Clippers: Georgiois Papagianis 2/12.29m; Wade Baldwin 2/13.08m Justin Barker 2/8.24m; Portis 3/35.88m; Byron Hall 1/3.22m Byron Daugherty 2/12.29m

                      Grizzlies: AJ Whitehead 2/9.93m

                      Hawks: Wilson Chandler 2/6.81m; Bullock 2/9.90m; Vucevic 3/43.68m; Jabari Parker 3/60.73m

                      Heat: Gerald Green 2/8.31m; Winslow 2/19.11m

                      Hornets: Markieff Morris 2/12.09m; Kemba Walker 4/97.93m

                      Jazz: Rubio 3/29.21m; Elfrid Payton 2/15.89m; Kaminisky 2/15.71m

                      Kings: Cauley-Stein 3/32.63m; KCP 2/11.22m; Beverly 2/14.29m; JaVale McGee 2/8.56m; Stanley Johnson 2/17.18m; Deyonta Davis 1/1.93m

                      Knicks: Brook Lopez 3/25.88m; Porzingis 5/142.74m

                      Lakers: Klay Thompson 4/127.89m; Rondo 2/9.76m; Zach Randolph 1/2.68m; Gene Calloway 2/7.01m

                      Magic: Carmelo Anthony 1/1.57m (!!!); Tyreke Evans 3/27.28m; Tobias Harris 3/53.37

                      Mavericks: Lin 2/9.77m; joe johnson 1/4.49m; Hezonja 2/14.7m; Randle 3/50.37m; Jordan 4/112.71m

                      Nets: Myles Turner 3/62.9m; Russell 4/92.58m; Alan Williams 3/25.14m; Carroll 2/14.06m

                      Nuggets: Millsap 3/50.05m; Mirotic 3/28.17m; Lyles 1/4.67m

                      Pacers: Giles 1/7.45m (played zero minutes year before); Robinson III 2/9.97m; Hood 2/14.8m; Hollis-Jefferson 3/31.84m;

                      Pelicans: Monroe 2/10.96m

                      Pistons: Tyson Chandler 1/1.57m; Ariza 1/6.77m; Ish Smith 1/3.5m; Casspi 1/1.57m

                      Raptors: Delon Wright 2/10.48m

                      Rockets: Gay 2/9.69m; Marcus Morris 1/1.57m

                      Spurs: Kanter 3/29.95m; Brett McCleod 2/8.47m; Jaime Ramsey 1/3.09m

                      Suns: Thaddeus Young 2/12.96m; Kyle O'Quinn 2/8.55m; Moute 1/1.57m

                      Thunder: Michael Beasley 2/5.52

                      Twolves: Isaiah Thomas 2/14.46m; Butler 5/170.31m; KAT 4/111.12m

                      Blazers: Aminu 2/9.21m; Joseph 1/1.57m; Jeff Green 1/1.57m

                      Warriors: Durant 5/193.09

                      Wizards; Barea 2/5.47m; Oubre 3/25.86m; Satoransky 2/10.05m; Howard 4/85.04m

                      Last minute signings: at 1/1.57m Mathews, Shumpert, Black, Koufos, Lauvergne, Willie Reed, Muscala, Alec Burks Other deals Tyler Zeller 2/4.32m; Mike Scott 2/6.24m; Stephenson 2/3.95m; Dedmon 2/8.56m; Trey Burke 2/7.37m; Ed Davis 2/3.97m

                      available FA as of opening day: Noel, Mudiay, Holmes, Tyus Jones, Seth Curry, Zubac, Faried, Rose, Ulis, Payne, McConnell, Robin Lopez, Justin Holiday, McLemore, Jerian Grant, Looney, Aldrich, Babbitt, Speights, Temple, Vonleh, jennings, Acy, Tyler Ennis, Nick Young


                      So much better. Some contracts seem low though. Still a few crazy deals thrown at undrafted free agents (mostly from the Clippers) but a lot more multi year deals (may have option years, I just used the transaction screen), and a lot fewer 8 and 9 million dollar deals thrown at scrubs. No major FAs left unsigned, although I'm not quite sure why 2k seemingly hates Robin Lopez, who I highly doubt will be unsigned.

                      Going to tinker some more to try and get the mid to upper guys more contracts over 8-10 per season and into the 13-15 per season level. I'm thinking the signing of the undrafted rookies is more a draft class issue. I'm just generating a class and letting it auto draft.
                      http://www.operationsports.com/forum...y-cant-we.html

                      http://www.operationsports.com/forum...ow-2012-a.html

                      Comment

                      • jeremym480
                        Speak it into existence
                        • Oct 2008
                        • 18197

                        #12
                        Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                        ^^ I think that looks great.

                        My biggest issue in 2K18 were young guys who had proven nothing in the NBA asking for large amounts, then never coming off of those demands and remaining unsigned. That seems much, much better so far.

                        Now if one of you guys can figure out how to get Dwight Howard's contract down... I wouldn't have a problem with him getting a decent amount per year but I don't see any team giving him a 4-year deal. He could be an anomaly though because I really don't see anyone else like him getting that type of deal.

                        edit: well, Millsap seems high as well given his age but overall those look pretty good.
                        My 2K17 Boston Celtics MyLeague

                        Alabama Crimson Tide
                        Green Bay Packers
                        Boston Celtics

                        New Orleans Pelicans

                        Comment

                        • Comduklakis
                          MVP
                          • Oct 2005
                          • 1887

                          #13
                          Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                          Originally posted by jeremym480
                          ^^ I think that looks great.

                          My biggest issue in 2K18 were young guys who had proven nothing in the NBA asking for large amounts, then never coming off of those demands and remaining unsigned. That seems much, much better so far.

                          Now if one of you guys can figure out how to get Dwight Howard's contract down... I wouldn't have a problem with him getting a decent amount per year but I don't see any team giving him a 4-year deal. He could be an anomaly though because I really don't see anyone else like him getting that type of deal.

                          edit: well, Millsap seems high as well given his age but overall those look pretty good.
                          They do. And you picked out two of the worst deals. Even with fame dialed way down, I think those two (and Carmelo, but he only got a one year deal) were signed based on past performance, not expectations.

                          I'm going to try ratcheting up the non-financial ambitions and see if it removes someone like Carmelo from signing with Orlando like he did in my sim, while NOT having Klay take a 3/30m deal with Boston or something. Going to see if it recognizes that only older players should really be tossing away tons of money to chase rings.
                          http://www.operationsports.com/forum...y-cant-we.html

                          http://www.operationsports.com/forum...ow-2012-a.html

                          Comment

                          • TheBigTee
                            Do Your Job
                            • Nov 2006
                            • 464

                            #14
                            Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                            This work looks really promising. I appreciate your efforts and look forward to using your sliders when you feel they are finalized. Thanks!

                            Comment

                            • cleanjoey22
                              Rookie
                              • Jul 2018
                              • 8

                              #15
                              Re: Anyone Finding the Right Sliders for Contracts/Free Agency?

                              Originally posted by Comduklakis
                              They do. And you picked out two of the worst deals. Even with fame dialed way down, I think those two (and Carmelo, but he only got a one year deal) were signed based on past performance, not expectations.



                              I'm going to try ratcheting up the non-financial ambitions and see if it removes someone like Carmelo from signing with Orlando like he did in my sim, while NOT having Klay take a 3/30m deal with Boston or something. Going to see if it recognizes that only older players should really be tossing away tons of money to chase rings.


                              How did this work?


                              Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

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