NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

[Comduklakis]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

off ball defense is the excuse for the weak players with slow reaction times. In a online game, on ball defense is the best way to play. Play off ball against the cpu all you want but when you control the PF and i pass it to my pf in the post just to see you run away to a guard I will quit and go play someone else that can play good on ball defense. This is basketball not hot potatoe

Well again i don't play online, but offline against the CPU, I will switch to guard in the post even if I was guarding someone else. But as far as guarding on ball, you just can't stay in front of the PG well enough to make it worth it. I tend to chase after the SG and SF so as to prevent those backdoor cuts and switch to the post D as needed.

[BrianMeinders]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I'm going to sound rude and snappy here, but seriously, this whole "OMG THIS IS NOT SIM I'M DISGUSTED AT YOUR CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP TACTICS AND YOU SUCK AT THE GAME" thing is getting ridiculous.

Excuse me, but wasn't it you that posted your guide on how people should play? Wasn't it you who stated FACTS, that you claim will help people play realistically? How is it when I disagree with that and comment on it, my opinion is disgusting, but you obviously know more?

Well, you see, the thing is that playing on-ball defense is needlessly difficult, because the ball handler usually skates all over the court and the defensive controls don't respond nearly as well as they should.

First, it isn't as hard as you seem to think. It may not be immediately possible to stop anybody until you improve, but the game would definitely be broken if it were that easy. I prefer a little difficulty, so that the player can actually IMPROVE and that improvement in play shows up on court. Second, the ballhandler does not skate, that's a term that was used for getting stuck in an animation, but continues to move on the court, that issue was resolved a few years ago now. You seem to forget that the difficulty you have in controlling a defender is being experienced by the offensive player as well. After playing for awhile you learn when and where certain animations occur, and it doesn't seem as difficult. Maybe you don't notice it on offense as much, considering you're controlling that guy on every possession of every game you ever play. Had you done that on defense as well, you would have learned the same type of control.....instead you'd rather believe defense is broken because you're not immediately good, and will never improve because you spend the of your time avoiding playing, rather than improving.

Additionally, there is no real footplanting and momentum in 2K10, which gives the attacking player even more of an unfair advantage. You can offset that advantage by letting the CPU player guard whomever is controlling the ball, because the CPU does not have to rely on broken defensive controls in order to defend effectively.

Honestly....this is an excuse. There is momentum. Explain what you mean by footplanting, it seems like a big-word catchphrase thrown in to make your opinion sound more intelligent. I know what you're talking about as far as mechanics go, but see absolutely no reason this would mean you cannot successfully guard the ballhandler.

And guess what? You're playing a -video game-. That's right. You're not playing real life basketball, so to say that you will lose respect for somebody just because they don't have the twitch reflexes of a seasoned FPS veteran that are required for perfect on-ball defense is just baffling to me.

Again, your overstating how hard it is to play defense. And yes, we are playing a video game. Are you telling me there is no way that you can lose respect for a gamer, based on the way they play, just because it is a video game? It seems like your original blog is aimed at teaching people a certain way to play....don't you respect gamers that play that way more?

Are you seriously telling everyone that it's not "sim" to play off ball defense? I ask, how is that relevant? What does that have to do with playing sim? It's not like we're talking about lunging into passing lanes everytime or something.

That is exactly what I am saying. The first requirement for a sim game is for both players to be playing on the ball. Why is it that you would feel lunging into the passing lanes everytime is apparently obviously not sim, but playing off the ball is OK. That seems like a random judgement call based on just your game, no real logic.

We're "taking advantage of off ball defense", as you say. Well, in that case, you're taking advantage of the lack of a proper footplanting system. It works both ways.

Ummm, you can be mad at me for calling out you using a nonsensical word to defend your point earlier.....but this statement proves my point. Earlier, it was the lack of "footplanting" that made it impossible to play on the ball defense.....now you're using it to say people guarding the ballhandler are taking advantage of the lack of "footplanting"?!?!? Obviously, you have no clear idea of what footplanting is, or how it would be implemented in a videogame, and you're clearly not sure whether the lack of it makes it impossible to guard the ballhandler, or whether it gives them an advantage.

Stop playing vigilante and let others enjoy their game the way they want to, if they're not spoiling online play by using exploits or playing arcade basketball.

Again, I'm pretty sure it was you that made the blog telling others how to play. Am I not allowed to comment on it? Does that make me a vigilante and you apparently a spreader of truth?

And if you're getting so upset by people playing off ball, then improve your offense, it's that simple.

Doesn't that sound like the exact same rationale of anybody trying to justify any other technique you deem not to be sim? If you don't like it, get better....I'm pretty sure I've heard that defense for somebody saying it is OK to score 100% of your points in the paint. If you don't like it, get better.

[kwabalicious]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

Enjoy getting your DNFs.

True sim ballers don't care about win %s as much as they care about having a realistic gameplay experience.

[CX1329]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

It's amusing how the resident vigilantes here don't even know what "sim" means. The term "sim" means "a realistic representation of the sport being emulated". How playing off ball defense alters the representation of the sport in any way is beyond me.

You don't see points being scored in the paint all the time in the NBA, and you don't see players jumping passing lanes on every play. To avoid doing things that don't happen in the NBA is to play "sim", and that's it. There's no more to it. How I'm going to control my players is entirely up to me to decide, as long as what happens on my screen stays faithful to a real NBA game.

You people act as if you could see red and blue circles under players in real NBA telecasts. You're so caught up in your feverish support for on-ball defense that you fail to realize this is a video game, and as such, can be "controlled" in whichever way the player sees fit.

If I'm playing as the Suns, and I play exactly the same way the actual Suns play in the NBA, then by definition, I am playing "sim", regardless of whatever petty, unreasonable arguments you can come up with. I will say it again, to play "sim" is to represent the sport faithfully, and playing off-ball defense does not affect my ability to do so. Do you see red and blue circles under the players in a telecast? I didn't think so. But you don't see 100 points in the paint being scored every game, or teams abusing the paint every night without any regard for defense.

Oh, and by the way, I take it My Player can never be sim then, since you'll always be forced to play a lot of off-ball defense in that mode. Just further proof that this nonsense doesn't make for a very good discussion, given that it's strictly a matter of preference. Do you like playing on-ball defense? Then great, more power to you. But there's absolutely no way you can say that me playing off-ball defense will make my virtual depiction of Suns basketball resemble its real life counterpart any less.

[Greene_Flash03]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

And btw, I wrote the blog, not CX.. I appreciate your input though brian. I wrote that blog mainly towards players who are having trouble playing on-ball d.

[TheKasmar]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I think there's a difference between somebody who chooses to play 1 position on defense and somebody who constantly clicks away from the defense.

[INVALID]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I think there's a difference between somebody who chooses to play 1 position on defense and somebody who constantly clicks away from the defense.

Hilarious. I've actually chased a defender by passing the ball to each individual he switched to, isn't that silly.

I believe in on-ball defense, however I also feel if you play it 100% of the time, prepare to get screwed on plays. If I'm goofing I'll run plays, or rather screens and picks just to mess with the opposition. I use it less as this year it's less effective, but last year coming off a screen was almost automatic for a shot. The screens seem a bit different this year, but some of them still seem automatic based on the animation... even far or just ridiculous threes.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I think there's a difference between somebody who chooses to play 1 position on defense and somebody who constantly clicks away from the defense.

That cracks me up everytime when I see that.

Whenever I see that, I'll just pass the ball around the key and get a shot clock violation on purpose for a couple of trips.

Thats my own little way of mocking the dude.

[jeebs9]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

^^I've done that soooo many times lol^^

But just like teebone21 said a page ago. I would rather quit and play the next opponent then waste my time with someone playing off-ball all game.

But guys again....I don't play 100% on-ball defense. I would say I probably play about 90 to 96% on-ball.

I don't know about the other things you guys are arguing about...lol I just want to play you.

[kwabalicious]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

My 2k profile says I play on-ball 92% of the time, and I definitely think that anywhere from 88 to 95 percent is going to get you the best defense if you take into account pick and rolls, off ball screens, and all that stuff.

[D_Money]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

It's amusing how the resident vigilantes here don't even know what "sim" means. The term "sim" means "a realistic representation of the sport being emulated". How playing off ball defense alters the representation of the sport in any way is beyond me......

In human vs. human online, many play zones where it may make sense to stick to a single player. But what doesn't make sense is when the controlled player is roaming all over the court. Use Kevin Garnett as an example in a 2-3 zone. Some online exploiters will run Garnett all over to block shots, get steals, and wreak havoc as a whole. Some would say it's not a 2-3 but a "box-in-one". Fatigue-factor...? Simulation?

Wrong... In the NBA, team's don't play Box-in-one so where's the sim? Another off-ball contradiction is with 2K's limitation where the Center in 2-3's doesn't leave the paint. So Perkins/Wallace sit in the paint without consequence, while the human-off-ball controlled Garnett tirelessly flies all over. Sim-gaming where? That's taking advantage of the video game.

Often in human matches, I've purposely stood on top of the circle with the ball for more than 5 seconds on the clock, told my human opponent to move his center seeing that 3-seconds is broke. They claimed they don't mess with the center. Hmmm... I wonder why.... Simulation-baller?

I also wonder why do off-ballers always use a PF more often than not? Off-ball players be honest, what virtues do you see using a PF versus a SF or any other position?

In the end, it is a video game, but the reality's of game playing competitively, stimulate most folks to gravitate to one's perceived competetive advantage. Whether cheese or exploit it doesn't matter to some.... use it to win.

What's truly amazing though, is listening to the rationalizations about being a sim-baller in this discussion. The analogy I see is real men vs wise men. A 'real' man plays on-ball defense while a 'wise' man plays off-ball defense. Real or wise, which is it for you?

[jeebs9]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I'm a "Really Wise Man"....lol

[CX1329]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

In human vs. human online, many play zones where it may make sense to stick to a single player. But what doesn't make sense is when the controlled player is roaming all over the court. Use Kevin Garnett as an example in a 2-3 zone. Some online exploiters will run Garnett all over to block shots, get steals, and wreak havoc as a whole. Some would say it's not a 2-3 but a "box-in-one". Fatigue-factor...? Simulation?

Wrong... In the NBA, team's don't play Box-in-one so where's the sim? Another off-ball contradiction is with 2K's limitation where the Center in 2-3's doesn't leave the paint. So Perkins/Wallace sit in the paint without consequence, while the human-off-ball controlled Garnett tirelessly flies all over. Sim-gaming where? That's taking advantage of the video game.

Often in human matches, I've purposely stood on top of the circle with the ball for more than 5 seconds on the clock, told my human opponent to move his center seeing that 3-seconds is broke. They claimed they don't mess with the center. Hmmm... I wonder why.... Simulation-baller?

I also wonder why do off-ballers always use a PF more often than not? Off-ball players be honest, what virtues do you see using a PF versus a SF or any other position?

In the end, it is a video game, but the reality's of game playing competitively, stimulate most folks to gravitate to one's perceived competetive advantage. Whether cheese or exploit it doesn't matter to some.... use it to win.

What's truly amazing though, is listening to the rationalizations about being a sim-baller in this discussion. The analogy I see is real men vs wise men. A 'real' man plays on-ball defense while a 'wise' man plays off-ball defense. Real or wise, which is it for you?

I don't do any of that stuff you described, though. If I'm playing as the PF, I'll guard the opposing PF and leave my assignment only to contest shots on the help side, same with the C position. I never park my players anywhere, or run all over the court with them.

In fact, I find it fun to guard players down low. I can deny the ball, protect the paint, box out more effectively and such. I'll also use off-ball defense to help my defenders get past screens, rotate, and deny star players the ball at other positions, such as Kobe at SG or LeBron at SF.

You're getting legitimate off-ball defense and foolish cheesing mixed up.

[BrianMeinders]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

I don't do any of that stuff you described, though. If I'm playing as the PF, I'll guard the opposing PF and leave my assignment only to contest shots on the help side, same with the C position. I never park my players anywhere, or run all over the court with them.

In fact, I find it fun to guard players down low. I can deny the ball, protect the paint, box out more effectively and such. I'll also use off-ball defense to help my defenders get past screens, rotate, and deny star players the ball at other positions, such as Kobe at SG or LeBron at SF.

You're getting legitimate off-ball defense and foolish cheesing mixed up.

Could you explain how you deny the ball?

For example, if I'm using the Lakers, and I see you playing defense as the SG trying to deny the ball to Kobe....what are you actually doing?

When you're denying the ball, I assume that means you're playing out of position, between the ballhandler and Kobe. You do realize that you're guarding a CPU player that does not respond to you playing defense out of position like that? How challenging is it to play out of position against a cpu player that doesn't recognize your gambling defense and make you pay for it?

Here's what I see when I'm playing against a guy who is allegedly trying to deny the ball to Kobe: the other player is only going to play defense as the SG, meaning in order for me to get player vs player game, I am FORCED to go to Kobe. I will icon lead pass Kobe towards the pass, and I guarantee no matter how hard you think you're denying the ball, he will come to meet the pass and get the ball in his hands. Your strategy to attempt to shut out one player actually backfires and gives your opponent no other real option other than to go to the guy you're "denying". Now what do you do? Quickly switch off and control your PF? Sad.

For all those things that you think you want to do off the ball....there are sliders and settings that will do the exact same thing. The way the game is designed, the off the ball players on offense are CPU controlled and indirectly controlled by the gamer through sliders, settings, and plays. On defense, the gamer has the exact same options, using sliders, settings, and plays to counter what the offensive CPU players are doing. Your "assignment" is the guy you chose to play against, the other gamer. He's controlling the guy with the ball....man up and stop him.

[CX1329]

Re: NBA 2K10: Defense and Offense Guide

Dude. Seriously. You're just looking silly, going on a tirade about how on-ball defense is THE ONLY WAY TO PLAY THE GAEM OMGWTFLOLBARBEQUE.

I've put forth all my arguments, and I'm not going to bother anymore. I'm not saying I "won" anything, because I'm not looking to "win" arguments on the Internet. I'm just saying that I'm going to continue to play the game my way, and you can continue to play the game your way.

Frankly, don't you realize I couldn't care any less about some person on the Internet telling me how I should control my players? You came here, to a thread the intention of which is to offer advice, and you started going on a crusade defending on-ball defense. For absolutely no reason at all, other than the fact it makes your e-penis bigger or something.

If you don't agree with me, then that's fine. Just don't think I'll agree with you regardless of how much you press the issue, because as far as I know, it was you who came here to preach about on-ball defense. There are other posters here advocating the use of on-ball defense and I don't have a single problem with them, because they're not crusading like you are. Try to be more personable on message boards.