Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

[younggrease]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

I was talking about the topic, not you directly. I'm not arguing on the internet, but maybe you should give 2k11 a chance. That's all I have to say about that. People have always disagree with one another, people will continue to disagree. So I'm not going to try to prove to you how 2k11 was better than 2k8 because 2k8 is better in your opinion.

I meant I don't understand the bolded sentence. It does not make sense.

[jersez]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

I meant I don't understand the bolded sentence. It does not make sense.

I was saying that People that have been playing 2k for years, are used to the animations where you lose control of the player.

[Humble_Thyself]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

2K sold 5.5 million copies because it was an INCREDIBLE basketball game that far exceeded ANY other sports game created IMO.

Also, they did an incredible job marketing the product (as they're doing this year).

Not over-hyped or over-rated...in fact, over-exceeded is a better word...I'm blown away by what this company does.

[Armor and Sword]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

Let's put it another way.

NBA2K11 = NBA Live Killer.

And I was a Live guy on last gen. NBA Live 2005 was the best B-Ball title I ever played till 2K11.

[rockchisler]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

A previous game cant be overrated based on the new version... So should we rerate all old games based on the newer version??

[Cynical]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

2K sold 5.5 million copies because it was an INCREDIBLE basketball game that far exceeded ANY other sports game created IMO.

Also, they did an incredible job marketing the product (as they're doing this year).

Not over-hyped or over-rated...in fact, over-exceeded is a better word...I'm blown away by what this company does.

these are the worste ways to compare i have ever heard. using nba players. were does jordan w/ the wizards go compared to 2k.smh how much did madden sell? cuz we all know madden is up there with 2k. do yall get what im saying? it can be the best ever to you but still be overrated. how can it not be overrated when half the gameplay was unsim. it was great when you got it. then you see all the unsimness(lol) change of heart. on the other hand i can see how you can rate it a 10 after months of gameplay if you never played or understand bball. this is the best my player ever it couldnt be improved. my people my player didnt even work.

help me understand were you guys are coming from. name a game that was overrated.

[Brinkybon]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

I think you're articulating your view well, but you do seem to be making a bit of an apples/oranges comparison. There are very few (if any) sports games that remain viable to play 10yrs out (especially console sports games). I'm guessing Starcraft and Counterstrike have benefited from being on the PC platform and mods. I know MVP is a game that can be considered a classic title that's been updated on PCs.

I remember when Mario 64 released, it was one of the first games I remember universally being rated a "10". It's not that it was perfect, you're also looking at what it's impact was at the time. Same for games like GTA III, Halo, etc. None perfect but all impactful/influential for their time. It's part of the reason NFL2K5 is held in high regard imo; as flawed as it is football gaming never evolved much beyond what that game was introducing. Either way obviously I don't agree that NBA2K11 was overrated.

Thank you for at least reading my reply; there seems to be a lot of tl;dr in this thread. And the point you make is fair and reasonable one, and its a point I'd like to elaborate on to clarify my opinion. Yes, NBA 2k11 when it came out was a big deal, but the impact of the game, while certainly setting a standard for presentation and polish, didn't actually change much on the gameplay front which for a game with yearly iterations, should be the primary focus. The new improved post game has once again been redone for 2k12, old flaws were simply replaced with new ones and I would argue 2k10 with the introduction of My Player was a bigger game changer than 2k11 was.

And I'm not expecting sports games to last 10 years, the reality is its incredibly rare cases of any types of games that last even half that long. But
the point is, the games that do have this extended shelf life have it for a reason, and I'm inclined to think they have much stronger core gameplay that makes them better games. I'm not satisfied that 2k11 was the best a series of incremental improvements, but still has so many issues in its fundamental gameplay.

But nonetheless, I respect your argument and you do make some pertinent points. Of course it comes down to personal taste and opinion as someone else mentioned. Like I mentioned, I'll weigh it against all other games, not just other sports games; and the result is I may judge it on a slightly harsher scale.

I really don't mean to come off like a jerk when I say this, so no harm intended.

You ask a question ("Was NBA 2k11 overrated?"), then it seems as if you don't like the answers--what the heck? A lot of people are saying, "No", then giving you reasons, but you're not taking the reasons--you're going against them...so why ask the question? You would have been better off naming your thread NBA 2K11 was overrated and then explaining why.

It wasn't overrated by any means. Michael Jordan, for instance, was good in '91 but got better in '92--do you think he was overrated in '91? If yes, you need to stop smoking that stuff. If no, you will apply that reasoning to NBA 2K11.

College Hoops 2K8 was a good game that deserved all the praise it got, even though the graphics were an eye sore. If there was a CHoops 2K9, you can't go back and say 2K8 was overrated. See Jordan '91 example.

Consider how many of the comments posted have been throwaway one liners with a six word reason or "no, you're crazy", and then have proceeded to ignore the followup comments I have posted. What do you want me to say to those comments exactly? And surely the phrasing of a question vs. an opinion is a meaningless arbitration; I would have thought it was quite clear that I was looking to have a discussion rather than seeking an answer to a question I didn't know.

I was saying that People that have been playing 2k for years, are used to the animations where you lose control of the player.

I can be used to the animations (and I am) but that doesn't mean I like them, nor that the designer should be given a free pass for how they affect gameplay. Particularly since they've been a sticking point for the last few years.

I'm curious...What is Street Fighter doing competitivly that NBA 2k11 isnt doing? I know 2k has had some server issues, but I've been able to play more online games this year than any before. Exploits happen in most online games, but it's more on the players end. 2k tried to mitigate those issues with patches.

Its mainly about game balance more than anything. Games can be fun and designed well, but if they're not balanced, they can't be competitive. Now, with a sports game, it's a different kind of balance given you have teams and players that are outright superior to others, so the balance has to reciprocate player skill with the proper outcome. The existence of 'cheese' or exploits in a game is usually what tips it out of the competitive arena.

I don't want to harp on it, but I brought up 2k12 because the number of changes that are being implemented point to a number of issues in terms of things such as passing, rebounding, animations etc... which are core gameplay issues in NBA 2k11. Which is what has happened every year; in the end, I still think NBA 2k11 just turned out to be just another iteration of NBA 2k. Everyone keeps citing it as the best basketball game ever, but then of course 2k12 which is going to be an improvement on it is surely going to be the best basketball game ever, ad infinitum. Good enough shouldn't be taken to be the equivalent of excellence.

I played 2k11 as much as any of you (until my PS3 died, YLOD woo), and 2k10 and 2k9 before that. Basketball games were (and 2k12 will likely be) my game of choice for the year, and in that cycle, it rises and falls all the same, falling victim to a different gameplay issue each different year. I'm saying I think 2k11 was overrated because it didn't break out of this cycle, and before long the problems of the gameplay ultimately override the fun I can get from the game. For me, 2k11 wasn't a game changer; it was just another year.

And yes, I know, 2k11 killed NBA Elite. But let's face it; there are much stronger reasons than this for why you'd think NBA 2k11 isn't overrated.

[jersez]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

^^^^^^^ Thinking about it the only website that called 2k the best sports game ever was Ign. Correct me if I'm wrong I don't think Operationsports claimed it was the best sports game of all time. I just finish a game in my season mode with the Knicks, playing against the Heat on hall of fame difficulty and simulation sliders. I understand what your saying now(to the OP), since I'm familiar with the game, and I see things that when I first played the game I overlooked because it was new. Here they are.

1. Cheating AI. When I call a play the CPU knows this and begins to deny or my teammate doesn't excute the play. I'm talking about a new play, a play that wasn't run before, so it wasn't like i was running the same play every time down the court. They do little things to make the game harder and unbalance(CPU play)User-User is balance to me.

2. Player Movement. it was a huge step over past 2k games but compared to 2k12, the players seem to take longer to turn their heads and bodies, and it felt like the defense was a step slower than the offensive player.

3. Foul system. It feels unfair. Cpu hacks you no call, Play solid D foul called for Cpu. This is so, the game stays close and competitive. I also notice this when the Cpu tries a comeback and nails alot of three pointers contested or open. (default simulation sliders) While the user has to work for a good shot but it will most likely be missed and the CPU makes a terrible contested shot. Just so the game is close.

4.Intelligence. Teammates AI aren't on par compared to the heat(cpu). Teammates bringing defenders to you, not properly spacing the floor at times, players doing uncharatristic post up or cuts (Examp. Ronny Turiaf posting up when he is isn't a offensive threat.This runs time off the shot clock and disrupts the called play) not diving for loose balls when the ball is in front of them or they don't pick it up, and off ball defense is unreliable, and makes you switch from on-ball to off-ball through out the game.

5. Warping. Because the sliders are set on simulation there is more warping since the game doesn't want you to abuse the paint. Example: i had a lane to the basketball but Big Z rotated to the paint, so I wanted to do a step-back Jumpshot since I had the room, but instead got a different animation where lebron warps into melo resulting in a miss.

The point is that after time has passed and we are familiarized with the game was it overrated? I still say no. Because at the time we didn't have anything to compare it too. But since 2k12 is on the horizon 2k11 doesn't seem so glamorous. I still love 2k11 expectually when it's a close game but the gameplay on higher difficulties and simulation setting makes the game unbalance, so 2k11 default=not overrated, 2k11 simulation= unbalance and frustrating gameplay at times. Please do not bring your not good enough into the conversation, because these are facts that you can visually see when you play the game. I won the game by the way against the Heat.

[DukeC]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?

Thank you for at least reading my reply; there seems to be a lot of tl;dr in this thread. And the point you make is fair and reasonable one, and its a point I'd like to elaborate on to clarify my opinion. Yes, NBA 2k11 when it came out was a big deal, but the impact of the game, while certainly setting a standard for presentation and polish, didn't actually change much on the gameplay front which for a game with yearly iterations, should be the primary focus. The new improved post game has once again been redone for 2k12, old flaws were simply replaced with new ones and I would argue 2k10 with the introduction of My Player was a bigger game changer than 2k11 was.

And I'm not expecting sports games to last 10 years, the reality is its incredibly rare cases of any types of games that last even half that long. But
the point is, the games that do have this extended shelf life have it for a reason, and I'm inclined to think they have much stronger core gameplay that makes them better games. I'm not satisfied that 2k11 was the best a series of incremental improvements, but still has so many issues in its fundamental gameplay.

But nonetheless, I respect your argument and you do make some pertinent points. Of course it comes down to personal taste and opinion as someone else mentioned. Like I mentioned, I'll weigh it against all other games, not just other sports games; and the result is I may judge it on a slightly harsher scale.



Consider how many of the comments posted have been throwaway one liners with a six word reason or "no, you're crazy", and then have proceeded to ignore the followup comments I have posted. What do you want me to say to those comments exactly? And surely the phrasing of a question vs. an opinion is a meaningless arbitration; I would have thought it was quite clear that I was looking to have a discussion rather than seeking an answer to a question I didn't know.



I can be used to the animations (and I am) but that doesn't mean I like them, nor that the designer should be given a free pass for how they affect gameplay. Particularly since they've been a sticking point for the last few years.



Its mainly about game balance more than anything. Games can be fun and designed well, but if they're not balanced, they can't be competitive. Now, with a sports game, it's a different kind of balance given you have teams and players that are outright superior to others, so the balance has to reciprocate player skill with the proper outcome. The existence of 'cheese' or exploits in a game is usually what tips it out of the competitive arena.

I don't want to harp on it, but I brought up 2k12 because the number of changes that are being implemented point to a number of issues in terms of things such as passing, rebounding, animations etc... which are core gameplay issues in NBA 2k11. Which is what has happened every year; in the end, I still think NBA 2k11 just turned out to be just another iteration of NBA 2k. Everyone keeps citing it as the best basketball game ever, but then of course 2k12 which is going to be an improvement on it is surely going to be the best basketball game ever, ad infinitum. Good enough shouldn't be taken to be the equivalent of excellence.

I played 2k11 as much as any of you (until my PS3 died, YLOD woo), and 2k10 and 2k9 before that. Basketball games were (and 2k12 will likely be) my game of choice for the year, and in that cycle, it rises and falls all the same, falling victim to a different gameplay issue each different year. I'm saying I think 2k11 was overrated because it didn't break out of this cycle, and before long the problems of the gameplay ultimately override the fun I can get from the game. For me, 2k11 wasn't a game changer; it was just another year.

And yes, I know, 2k11 killed NBA Elite. But let's face it; there are much stronger reasons than this for why you'd think NBA 2k11 isn't overrated.

All this is true. But from a graphical and gameplay standpoint...2K11 is the best basketball game made at that time. Is that 2k10,9,8, or 7 better than 2k11? How about NBA Elite 11, Live 10, 09, 08, 07, 06? I'm sorry to say but, Live (before '10) had been just straight garbage on next gen. They've (2K) expanded on the core gameplay (by implementing drifters, and leaners. Runners are still broken in the worst way however) to the point where if you try to play past 2k's, it becomes painful to do so.

Does it have flaws? Yes. As long as humans are the ones making video games they will always have flaws because some codes work in unexpected ways, or sometimes they may plain miss a glitch or forget to provide a counter in the game, making it unbalanced on either the offensive or defensive end.

All in all, I get what you're saying. But just because previous iterations have just not been on the level gameplay (even with its flaws) or graphics wise with 2k11 does not make 2k11 over-rated. It transcended what we expected from a basketball game (hence the praise), much like how NFL 2k5 transcended what we expected from a football game. 2K5 has already reached cult status, it won't be long before 2k11 does as well.

[qpc123]

Re: Was NBA 2k11 overrated?