NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9 - Defense

[guesswhozbak17]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

there are good strategic reasons for playing offball D...for me, it's a way to make up for the poor help D of my AI teammates...my dumb AI bigs always leave the paint wide open for cutters, so i often feel i have to control my big man in the paint to defend the lead pass cutters. hopefully the improved teammate AI in 2k12 will make it easier to trust your AI teammates to stop the cutters for you.

That is understandable. But still, my point is that playing off ball allows you defend multiple things opposed to off ball defense which is focused on one person. It's easier to stand in one spot and guard the basket, your man who's by the basket and anybody cutting near the basket opposed to guarding the player with the ball who can pass, shoot or dribble to score. That's all I'm saying

[BRxSKINSx]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

Okay 2k...u keep amazing me day after day....sooner or later, you're gonna run out of stuff to give me....and when u do....I'll have te best damn sports game ever....2K12....dang I can't wait...

[Bingo King]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

they still need to add on to the fouls. They need to get a slap foul in there for late game situations. it's so annoying at end of games to see guys chasing the player trying to wrap them up when in real life it's a simple slap on the arm.

this still needs adjustments and is a huge pet peeve of mine.

[TUSS11]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

Off-ball defense as a primary strategy is...lame. Occasionally switching to get your teammates in better position to defend against, for example, the lead pass is fine. But camping with your center the entire game = fear.

I bet if 2K gave people the option to control the coach on defense, most people would.

And if your reason for playing off-ball is lag, keep practicing playing with lag and you'll get better at it. Every year at release I literally suck at on-ball D. I get burnt up real bad some games. But after a few months I can actually play competent D. I'd rather that than playing off-ball all year and never learning.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

Yes im the same way. I like playing off ball with d12


I agree. Some animations disable user controls for example in 2k11 when someone is fouled making a layup or in the paint, all the players are dead, and it wont let me jump up and block the shot even though the shot is blockable. Like you said on thing like the wrap up foul, hopefully it will let you finish the play if you have someone like tony parker trying to wrap up lebron.




However you want to put it, there shouldnt be no penalty/bonus or whatever at all. I play both onball d and offball. I like playing offball d because it is fun to playing d with d12. I dont camp in the paint, or do anything cheese with him. He is my favorite player and i simply like playing with him on d. Why do i have to be at a disadvantage because thats what i like to do. And yes it is a disadvantage. No matter how you put it. If the shot % went up .01%, you would still have an advantage playing onball d.


What you are trying to argue is playing styles. Some people prefer to play on way some dont. Its not cheese if done the right way so whats the problem. What may be fun to you may not be to the next person and vise versa. What if some people like the ratings to play out and be the determining factor with a defender guarding the ball handler?


What about the people who dont camp and play legit off ball defense? 2k is giving an advantage to onball d because they think it is more fun the play onball. But once again what is fun to one person may not be fun to another.

Now what i would have no problem with them doing is if you are playing offball and not away from you man for a certain amount of time then penalize you.

fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.)

But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

[NINJAK2]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

User conntrolled defender and shooter vulnerability sections were my favorites. I'm really glad they tried to address both those issues. Another great insight.

[guesswhozbak17]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.)

But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

"it's more manly to play on ball D." = it's a higher risk...therefore I agree with the reward. Thank you.

[Sam Marlowe]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.)

But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

From the man himself. Fair enough.

[DukeC]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

@beluba

While you're still here, I know it's probably too late for 2k12, but for 2k13 could you think of implementing the option of being able to stop And 1 plays with a close defender?

Say D-Rose drives to the hoop and gets bumped on the way by Rondo. While Rose is adjusting his shot in mid-air (the whistle having already been blown) someone like Garnett for instance would be able to rotate and swat away the ball, thereby negating the chance for an And 1 instead of the animation playing out and everyone is standing still?

Or is this already possible?

[eko718]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

I am just lost for words really. There has never been a basketball game with this much detail put into the defensive end of the floor.

[infam0us]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

@beluba

While you're still here, I know it's probably too late for 2k12, but for 2k13 could you think of implementing the option of being able to stop And 1 plays with a close defender?

Say D-Rose drives to the hoop and gets bumped on the way by Rondo. While Rose is adjusting his shot in mid-air (the whistle having already been blown) someone like Garnett for instance would be able to rotate and swat away the ball, thereby negating the chance for an And 1 instead of the animation playing out and everyone is standing still?

Or is this already possible?

I don't remember seeing this in 2k11 but in previous 2k games there were times where I would swat the ball away after the foul. Problem was they never took into account goaltending

[kolanji]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

well we will all stop the guessing and assuming game come Tuesday when the demo drops baby

[Kaanyr Vhok]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online.

I see what you mean. There were times when I was playing on ball against a player like Nowitzki or Derron Williams and it seemed like no matter what I was going to be late contesting so the only solution was to reach or double to throw off their rhythm. I can live with Dirk hitting some shots in a defender's face but what messed things up was the feeling that you couldnt even contest without pump fake fouling because you were a step slow and you couldnt time the pump fake with the steal (one of the few or only areas where 2k10 was better than 11).

[amedawg00]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

First Jerson in the insight, and now Beluba, validating the preeminence of on ball defense in user vs. user competition. Whose next Simballer?

On ball defense FTW again!

[Rdub33]

Re: NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9- Defense

Not sure if this has been addressed, but I assume that if you're playing defense with the hands up thing, that it makes you more vulnerable to get beaten by dribble penetration so that people can't just sit there with their hands up the entire game and make your shooting percentage much lower?

Exactly... That's why it's not an advantage to play on ball... It's just more manly! Any one who comes running out all willy nilly with their hands up should give up paint points and fouls. Making people pay for bad defense is not cheese. Playing bad on ball defense is.

With that said I do think if off ball is your thing, u should be free to do that, but u have to live with the results if your not willing to manually sway the results.