NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

ive had nba league pass for the past 5 years, the odds of you watching more games than me is very very low

Uh. I've worked in basketball for 8 years, I've watched basketball since the early 80s, and I've had Synergy Scout since the 04/05 season. I also played in college.

you sound like a stat nerd with zero understanding of the game outside of numbers

Oh, really? Is this the default internet come-back to being proved wrong?

wtf does the number of "spot up numbers nash took inside the 3 point line" have to do with anything? we're talking about midrange jump shooting as a whole. if you think nash attepmpted 26 midrange shots over the course of an entire season, then lmao

It has everything to do with it, because that's where pure jump shooting skills come into play. When you start looking at isolation play, pick and rolls etc, you bring issues such as Shot of Dribble and Shot in Traffic into play. Spot Up is the only pure shooting skill play in the game.

the fact that you acknowledged that kobe takes "bad shots" shows how stupid your argument is. kobe takes bad shots and still puts up a comparable mid range fg% to lebron, who is taking easier shots.....what does that tell you?

I've never argued that Kobe's rating is too low. You're objecting to something I've never said.

kobes offensive awareness or shot selection rating should suffer, not his midrange. like you said, his percentage is a result of shot selection, not his ability to make shots

There's no shot selection rating. Which is really the biggest fault in 2K's rating selection. No offensive awareness doesn't do this.

anyone who believes that lebron is a better midrange jump shooter than kobe is ignorant

Did I ever say he was?

[houston911]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Uh. I've worked in basketball for 8 years, I've watched basketball since the early 80s, and I've had Synergy Scout since the 04/05 season. I also played in college.

Oh, really? Is this the default internet come-back to being proved wrong?

It has everything to do with it, because that's where pure jump shooting skills come into play. When you start looking at isolation play, pick and rolls etc, you bring issues such as Shot of Dribble and Shot in Traffic into play. Spot Up is the only pure shooting skill play in the game.

I've never argued that Kobe's rating is too low. You're objecting to something I've never said.

There's no shot selection rating. Which is really the biggest fault in 2K's rating selection. No offensive awareness doesn't do this.

Did I ever say he was?

i didnt object to something you didnt say. i never suggested that you said kobes rating is too low. YOU SAID kobe takes bad shots, I SAID that despite his bad shot selection, his percentage is still comparable to lebron who is taking easier, higher quality shots. Kobes mid range rating should not suffer because he takes bad shots. They should add in more rating categories to capture this. kobe is a better midrange shooter than lebron, point blank period.

regardless of what synergy sports tells you, if you let lebron james, steve nash and amare stoudemire shoot 100 wide open midrange shots, nash wins that contest every single time. those guys should not have a higher midrange rating than nash and they shouldnt have a higher midrange rating than kobe. you can't possible watch basketball and disagree with that

i have made numerous posts on 2ksports telling them about the categories they need to add to make the game more realistic

they also need a "create your own shot off the dribble" rating....theres no reason i should be isolating and scoring with ease using guys like kyle korver.

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

i didnt object to something you didnt say. i never suggested that you said kobes rating is too low. YOU SAID kobe takes bad shots, I SAID that despite his bad shot selection, his percentage is still comparable to lebron who is taking easier, higher quality shots. Kobes mid range rating should not suffer because he takes bad shots. They should add in more rating categories to capture this. kobe is a better midrange shooter than lebron, point blank period.

Fair enough, but his percentage isn't comparable to Lebron's though. He's a solid 7% below Lebron from 16-23ft. He's higher than Lebron between 10-15, but what's why he has a really high Shot Close rating.

regardless of what synergy sports tells you, if you let lebron james, steve nash and amare stoudemire shoot 100 wide open midrange shots, nash wins that contest every single time. those guys should not have a higher midrange rating than nash and they shouldnt have a higher midrange rating than kobe. you can't possible watch basketball and disagree with that

I can, mostly because unguarded, they're all automatic from mid range.

No disagreement with the rest of your post.

[houston911]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Fair enough, but his percentage isn't comparable to Lebron's though. He's a solid 7% below Lebron from 16-23ft. He's higher than Lebron between 10-15, but what's why he has a really high Shot Close rating.


I can, mostly because unguarded, they're all automatic from mid range.

No disagreement with the rest of your post.

i just read through the other pages of the thread and our viewpoints seem to be the same, ha.

anyway, i agree...2kinsider has got to go

my biggest gripe with the game rating wise is the on ball defense. jose calderon and steve nash both received a b-, the same grade as delonte west

delonte is one of the better perimeter defenders in the league, nash and calderon are two of the worst. im convinced the people doing the ratings do not watch basketball

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Yeah, and Delonte got guns too. Hmm, too soon?

[RedSceptile]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Nash actually had his best defensive season this treaty in terms of starting Point Guards and was a top 8 this past year in defensive efficiency overall. Hard to believe I know, Calderon of course was in the bottom half (27 or so last time I checked) but Nash actually played pretty good defense this year along with Grant Hill. Just people are so used to seeing our heating about his terrible defense.

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Point guard defense is highly overrated. Now, would it be nice if all your 5 starters are stellar defenders? Of course. But the overall game impact from the defensive skills of your point guard are absolutely negligible.

Guess this is a bit of a digression from the real thread though.

[RedSceptile]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Point guard defense is highly overrated. Now, would it be nice if all your 5 starters are stellar defenders? Of course. But the overall game impact from the defensive skills of your point guard are absolutely negligible.

Guess this is a bit of a digression from the real thread though.

Indeed it is ahaha. I found a pretty good blog post about the eating that everyone is up in arms about http://spgmg.blogspot.com/2011/09/ho...ge-rating.html as well as Rashidi's own take on everything http://thereal2kinsider.blogspot.com...s-changes.html

I think it's a fair assessment.

[nogster]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

What about the 3pt ratings.
they are horrible this season.

In 2k12. many players are ranked higher in 3pt ability than mid range. Im talking tony parker, westbrook etc....
This will entice an overabundance in 3pt shooting as what is the point in trying to get in better range when a 3pter is the better shot to take rating wise.
Just look at Chris Pauls 3pt rating. [86] That means he is a superstar 3pt shooter.
his mid is 80 or something.
So when controlling Paul, why bother playing like he does. by trying to penetrate the d, find the cracks and if the D gives him some room take the pull up J. No. instead play him like a prolific 3pt shooting pg tim hardaway style and launch 3s off screens or in iso's.
Its really ridiculous. Paul took just over 2 3's a game last season. and shot under 40%. how on earth does that justify an 86 which in NBA 2k12 means elite 3pt shooter. The 3pt shot is not a weapon Paul utilizes. his shot selection from downtown is conservative.

What about Tony Parker? his 3pt rating [78] is higher than mid and [from memory] close. This is ridiculous.

This 3pt attribute scale has to be lowered to emphasize realistic gameplay and shot selection.

[RedSceptile]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Nogster I'm guessing this all applies to the quality of shot versus shot release thing. Last year it didn't matter if you got your shot contested really, if you had the release perfect more times than none it was going in. Not to mention last year online 3pt shooting was horrendous like have to stand wide open in one spot horrendous. 2K claims that this year there's more a focus on the quality of the shot than the actual release. If that's the case even with an 85+ rating if you're taking a bad shot (designated by this new shot feedback) you're going to get bad results so dribbling around until you get some air space probably isn't as effective as it sounds as people have been surprised at how good the CPU plays on even lower difficulty. Only time will tell, we're looking at the numbers too much without seeing how they translate to gameplay.

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Just look at Chris Pauls 3pt rating. [86] That means he is a superstar 3pt shooter.

Well, he's at 41.7% from 3 on Isolation, 42.2% from 3 on P&R, 40.8% on 3 from Spot up. 46.7% on 3s in transition.

I'd say he deserves to be in the mid 80s.

So when controlling Paul, why bother playing like he does. by trying to penetrate the d, find the cracks and if the D gives him some room take the pull up J. No. instead play him like a prolific 3pt shooting pg tim hardaway style and launch 3s off screens or in iso's.

But ratings and tendencies play different roles.

What about Tony Parker? his 3pt rating [78] is higher than mid and [from memory] close. This is ridiculous.

Well, better question, although keep in mind that ratings are not percentages.

If you have 85 Mid and 85 3PT, that doesn't mean your chance of scoring is the same, regardless of the distance.

[nogster]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Tendencies have no effect on a human controlled team/player.
No. Paul shouldn't be that high in 3pt. Certainly not higher than his mid. Just because he is effecient at 3's doesn't make him a 3pt specialist.
and within the game I do think that the attribute ratings have equal standings in regards to the chance of the shot's success.

[Ken North]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

Tendencies have no effect on a human controlled team/player.

There's nothing 2K can do about the way humans play the game. That's a silly point to even bring up.

No. Paul shouldn't be that high in 3pt. Certainly not higher than his mid. Just because he is effecient at 3's doesn't make him a 3pt specialist.
and within the game I do think that the attribute ratings have equal standings in regards to the chance of the shot's success.

No, they most certainly don't. But that clarifies why you think his rating is too high.

[nogster]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

There's nothing 2K can do about the way humans play the game. That's a silly point to even bring up.

Yes they can. they can adjust the attributes to actually show the risk and reward in playing a certain away with a certain player. while we are discussing the 3pt attribute, that is the perfect example. If pauls 3pt attribute is indicated as lower than his mid [and close], it will entice gamers to play the way paul actually plays. As it stands. it makes more sense to utilize paul as a prolific 3pt shooter than the way he really plays.

No, they most certainly don't. But that clarifies why you think his rating is too high.

Okay I concede that its easier to make inside shots than outside shots, but this is obvious. I was referring to mid to 3pters specifically, I shouldve specified.
In that sense they are on equal standing.
Im not talking about shot release timing. I realize a person skilled at the shot release of a stiff can make him a stud when "shot timing" is activated.

[DukeC]

Re: NBA 2k12 Ratings Reasonable Explanation

In regards to the rating thing...the specific rating (such as Mid, 3pt and so forth) mean almost nothing when not supported by other sub ratings like shot off dribble, shoot in traffic, and most importantly, consistency.

In 2k11, you can have a 85 in mid range, but with consistency at 25....you aren't making anything.

Now, say you had something like a 68 or 69. With consistency at 99 the odds of you putting up 50% from that range drastically increases.

So..in other words...consistency has more of a direct impact than the rating (3pt/mid) itself.

Edit: In regards to the ratings being equally important (such as 85 for mid and 3, or 69 for mid and 3) you can test out whether that is case. And, it is most sincerely is not. There is a world of difference shooting from mid range with a 69, and shooting from 3 with a 69 (rating of course). You can at least regularly make mid range jumpers in the 40 - 45% range. With 3pt at 69..your percentage dips to around 29 - 33%.