Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I think this is the real issue. Concerning "Floor General" and "Defensive Anchor" specifically, a Magic Johnson or a Dennis Rodman did have a residual effect on their teammates ... however, there should only be one Magic Johnson or Dennis Rodman in each generation. Charles Barkley was a great offensive force, but he did not have the same inspirational ability Magic did.

When it comes to the individual skills, if 2k further develops the system to allow a person to lose them over time, then I think it will enhance the experience. An example here is giving Vince Carter the finisher skill for his early career but having him lose it for his current skill set.

Exactly why I said that the only thing I could see them boosting in other players would be awareness. As for the one in each gen., umm, not sure about that, its debatable atleast.

I coulda sworn that in Assocs. players gain and lose sig skills. Have not started an offline assoc yet.

[mango_prom]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I don't like sig skills at all. What most people get wrong is the fact that it actually does NOT change the way the players behave, it only changes ratings and probabilities for certain shot types to go in.

So it's a completely idiotic statement to say it separates the way stars play from role players, because sig skills have no influence on tendencies at all.
A certain ratings boost or higher success rates of layups have nothing to do with how the player behaves at all.
For example if you remove all the sig skills from Kobe, he will still play the same, only his shot percentage might go down. He has the same tendencies and animations assigned to him, nothing changes at all.

Besides, I think instead of that gimmicky sig skill stuff, you could achieve the same thing by additional attributes that actually make sense,

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I don't like sig skills at all. What most people get wrong is the fact that it actually does NOT change the way the players behave, it only changes ratings and probabilities for certain shot types to go in.

So it's a completely idiotic statement to say it separates the way stars play from role players, because sig skills have no influence on tendencies at all.
A certain ratings boost or higher success rates of layups have nothing to do with how the player behaves at all.
For example if you remove all the sig skills from Kobe, he will still play the same, only his shot percentage might go down. He has the same tendencies and animations assigned to him, nothing changes at all.

Besides, I think instead of that gimmicky sig skill stuff, you could achieve the same thing by additional attributes that actually make sense,

Its not intended to change the way players behave, but more to mimic the intangibles that humans have. Such as Kobe (your example), no he doesn't play different with sig skills, but what it does is give him a boost in a clutch shot/situation, which is supposed to mimic his real life intangibles. That is the 'seperation' we are talking about. That little bit extra.

[zizoux]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

Cheesey, arcade-like. We need an option to disable them.

Seriously, Is there anything you like about this game?

[Taer]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

... What most people get wrong is the fact that it actually does NOT change the way the players behave, it only changes ratings and probabilities for certain shot types to go in. ...

I disagree. A player with "Corner Specialist" will be more likely moved to the corner to take his three point attempts, rather then just taken wherever. This in essence "changes" the way the player behaves. In 2k12, such a player would be taking his shots anywhere outside the arc; in 2k13, this same player would be located in the corners attempting his threes.

So it's a completely idiotic statement to say it separates the way stars play from role players, because sig skills have no influence on tendencies at all.

As shown above, it influences play more then you think, but think about association and coach modes - they most definitely separate players and make bench players like Jodi Meeks more likely to be used by the human players.

... Besides, I think instead of that gimmicky sig skill stuff, you could achieve the same thing by additional attributes that actually make sense,

But you can not. Taking your Kobe example: with the signature skills, he makes more of an impact on certain game situations then on others. With nothing but attributes, this impact in those situations is non-existent. In 2k13, Kobe will achieve better results in Closer situations than he would have in 2k12.

The differences the skills add to the individual player increase with the more basketball knowledge a human player posses, and this further enhances the game imo.

[mango_prom]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I disagree. A player with "Corner Specialist" will be more likely moved to the corner to take his three point attempts, rather then just taken wherever. This in essence "changes" the way the player behaves. In 2k12, such a player would be taking his shots anywhere outside the arc; in 2k13, this same player would be located in the corners attempting his threes.

I disagree with this. The reason a corner specialist spots up a lot is because he has a high "spot up" tendency assigned to him. Where exactly he will spot up is determined by the hotspots you can assign to him.
So if I give Brook Lopez the corner sig skill, he won't spot up more because of that because his tendencies suggest otherwise.
On the other hand, if Steve Novak has no offensive sig skills at all (I've tried this), he will still spot up just as much and shoot 3s because of his tendencies.

Now that's for freelance situations. While running set plays, the position of the players is only determined by the play you run. I can make Dwight get corner 3s all game if I run corner plays for him.

I get your argument about intangibles, but I just think the current way is not really a great idea. The closer skill increases all offensive attributes, but it's simply false that for example Kobe is a better 3pt shooter in clutch situations.
The idea of giving players more indviduality is great, I just think it's poorly implemented.

Besides, we had clutch ratings for offense and defense for years. 2k removed this in favor of 1 magic ability you either have or not.
So they essentially dumbed it down.

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

@mango,

agreed, it needs to be implemented better, instead of giving a boost to all shooting areas, the skills need to be more situational and exact instead of broad as it is now.

[BezO]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I love the idea, like the implementation, but definitely think it could use some work. I think they tried to implement it in a way that the average user could take advantage of.

I like JW's comment about only boosting awareness of other players with floor generals or def anchors. They'll get you in position, but that's about it. But it's the tangible aspects that "boost" other skills. You might shoot a bit better because the floor general gets you the ball at the right time, in the right place, but not simply because HE passed you the ball.

The problem is not every user will get that result. If you're late with a pass to a shooter coming off a screen, you basically nulify the floor generalship. Boosting the shooting % of the receiver is a way that everyone can benefit.

But you can not. Taking your Kobe example: with the signature skills, he makes more of an impact on certain game situations then on others. With nothing but attributes, this impact in those situations is non-existent. In 2k13, Kobe will achieve better results in Closer situations than he would have in 2k12.

This is something else they need to adjust. Depending on what situations you consider clutch, Kobe's % isn't any better than during other parts of the game. In fact, it's worst. But he's a great, confident scorer willing to take the challenge, getting a lot of chances by being THE man on a team in a lot of notable clutch situations.

IMO, it would be best to reverse this & lower shooting % for non-clutch players to represent the nervousness or unwillingness to shoot in those situations.

But I think it's a great start. No doubt in my mind they'll improve on it next year.

[VoItage]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

Can we get a Sacre/Turiaf dancer sig skill please?

[JerzeyReign]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I don't even pay attention to the skills lol. Have no idea where the cry to get rid of them comes from.

[ojandpizza]

Combined signature skills make some things in this game absolutely ridiculous.. For example, I was messing around using the Heat the other night playing on superstar difficulty with my 3pt sliders set to 45..

Posted with LeBron who has the dimer skill and passed out to Ray Allen who went 15/17 from 3...

That's the problem with the signature skills.. When they are used together, 3 or 4 skills for each shot its almost automatic..

[Rensational14]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

Yeah, on a team with a Floor General on the floor.. A dimer passes it to a spot up shooter in the corner with deadeye. +4 All ratings, +10% shot percentage, +30% easier release, + 5% shot percentage, -100% penalty

[EAGLESFAN10]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I think they need to be tuned and refined but they are a great addition to the series

If they took this out and added something that nobody cares about yall WILL be like why didnt they just keep Sig Skillz

[jayska23]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

I'm enjoying sig skills a lot. I admit that initially I thought this might be a little too arcadey/cheesy/Live-ish (yeah, I went there), but after seeing and using them for myself, I think it really does add another whole dimension to the gameplay.

Only thing is that sometimes I get TOO wrapped up in seeing which skills I trigger and cause to light up that it almost takes me out of my game. So every now and then I just have to remove the HUD from the screen for awhile, LOL. :o

But for those who don't like 'em, I could see it being an on/off option for '14 as was suggested upthread. I guess technically we could remove 'em now, but it'd be tedious to edit each and every player in the game (at least those who have sig skills) like that.

There is no removing the signature skills from players once there on the player there on there for good. You can switch them out for another signature skill but that's it.

[ffaacc03]

Re: Why are there fans who want Signature Skills removed and not return next NBA 2K?

There is no removing the signature skills from players once there on the player there on there for good. You can switch them out for another signature skill but that's it.

that is the point ... this is the cause of the confusion: "remove" ... not to take their implementation out of the series but to give us the option to remove it from players, not just switch them ... why ? just because of the poor default assigns made but not because they substract to the experience ... I love them and just need little tweaks ... in fact, I forsee further expansion, as they add that much to the game.