Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

[Illmatic1909]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

I've sold Paul Pressey, Horace Grant, Jerry West, Pistol Pete, Tim Duncan, Gary Payton, World B Free Pro (in beta)..

These aren't high-end cards.

I've sold Legends.. I sold Epic Pro Rodman.. I've sold enhancements.. I've sold all sorts of stuff.

It may not be going well for you, but that doesn't mean there's a 5% sell rate, because you say so.

There is a little more to this than just putting your cards up for the min and hoping for the best, then trying to cut deal where you get nothing back for your cards. People doing all these deals are part of the problem. They're undercutting the market, and harming everyone's prospects. I'm still doing OK though.

I'm not saying I'm Warren Buffet or anything, but maybe you're putting the wrong cards up at the wrong time, with the wrong pricing.

Again.. That's not to say AH is perfect. There are clearly some things that are wrong with it... I just don't think it's possible to KNOW what they are yet, and I know you can't just tinker with a market, every time some mitigating force pops up, or a trend starts to take shape.

Let stuff play out for some time.

I'm done with this argument, the proof's in the pudding. Just search star, legendary, epic and look at the next 20 and see for yourself. I'm not saying they can't be sniped...but look at the complete lack of bids. Just because you got lucky with some of your sells doesn't make you the norm. I know I could sell my Pippen Star at any moment, I'm talking about my McHale, Williams, World B Free, Mourning, Lucas, Conley, etc...I even put up 5 Star Pros at minimum and nothing went. If people sell, they are either pre-arranging deals, getting lucky, or selling premium cards/training fodder. How hard is it to admit that the minimums are too low, and that a card will reach it's natural price point in an unrestricted economy?

[ActionJack]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

Again... I've sole ALL sorts of stuff. You can ignore that to make your point, but you've gotta understand when it rings hollow.

As for Lucas, Conley, et al. some cards' value just falls under the minimum. That's it.

There's just a fundamental difference in what people think the AH is supposed to be. That colors how people feel about it.

It seems like you think the AH is supposed to serve as a means for you to retrieve SOME value from everything you pull. Value you can obtain, then trade for something that you want.

That's not what it is. The way you guys want it, if Mike Conley is worth 3000 credits, you should be able to sell for 3000 credits. That's dumb. If Conley goes for so little, guess what? Everything else comes down, because hell Lebron Pro isn't THAT much better than Conley. Everyone would Pro everything, because prices would be driven down. In a matter of days, EVERYBODY would have teams of ALL Star Pros. It would basically be a trading house, where the value of everything I'd almost zero.

That's not what the Auction House is. That's not what it should be.

If CD actually listened to people here, we'd just have a trading house, everyone would have perfect lineups in a week, and the game would be pointless.

Oh, and nobody would have to pay for anything ever, either.

It's not gonna happen, and it's silly to even want it that way.

In this game, some cards are better than others, and some cards just don't have the value necessary to be viable in the AH. Oh well.

[eVizions]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

Again... I've sole ALL sorts of stuff. You can ignore that to make your point, but you've gotta understand when it rings hollow.

As for Lucas, Conley, et al. some cards' value just falls under the minimum. That's it.

There's just a fundamental difference in what people think the AH is supposed to be. That colors how people feel about it.

It seems like you think the AH is supposed to serve as a means for you to retrieve SOME value from everything you pull. Value you can obtain, then trade for something that you want.

That's not what it is. The way you guys want it, if Mike Conley is worth 3000 credits, you should be able to sell for 3000 credits. That's dumb. If Conley goes for so little, guess what? Everything else comes down, because hell Lebron Pro isn't THAT much better than Conley. Everyone would Pro everything, because prices would be driven down. In a matter of days, EVERYBODY would have teams of ALL Star Pros. It would basically be a trading house, where the value of everything I'd almost zero.

That's not what the Auction House is. That's not what it should be.

If CD actually listened to people here, we'd just have a trading house, everyone would have perfect lineups in a week, and the game would be pointless.

Oh, and nobody would have to pay for anything ever, either.

It's not gonna happen, and it's silly to even want it that way.

In this game, some cards are better than others, and some cards just don't have the value necessary to be viable in the AH. Oh well.

Yes, the model works for so many other games, but it wouldn't work for this one. Let's ignore all of the bigger, more successful companies who provide an open market and have profited significantly and instead pretend that CD is the master of what a virtual economy should look like.

[ActionJack]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

Yes, the model works for so many other games, but it wouldn't work for this one. Let's ignore all of the bigger, more successful companies who provide an open market and have profited significantly and instead pretend that CD is the master of what a virtual economy should look like.

You know the financials on these games? You're on the email list for quarterly reports?

What people have been asking for here, since the BEGINNING is financially asinine.

Let's recap:

A) Free credits
B) No minimums

In what world is a dev gonna make money when THEY provide the currency to participate in their market, AND they allow people to set their own prices for the goods?

"Let the market dictate".

The way you guys are acting, NO cards would have any value.

Edit- oh I forgot RttC too!

We want the mode to be new and challenging! But not so challenging that we ALL can't beat it! It's not " fair" that we all can't get top rewards! Only people that pay can win! Those of us who have never spent a dime, or spent enough time to develop good decks as free players should also be able to reap all the benefits because... reasons!

Basically, you're all asking for the game to just give you all the cards you want, for free, with as little effort as possible. And somehow, you all don't realize how silly it sounds.

[eVizions]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

You know the financials on these games? You're on the email list for quarterly reports?

What people have been asking for here, since the BEGINNING is financially asinine.

Let's recap:

A) Free credits
B) No minimums

In what world is a dev gonna make money when THEY provide the currency to participate in their market, AND they allow people to set their own prices for the goods?

"Let the market dictate".

The way you guys are acting, NO cards would have any value.

Edit- oh I forgot RttC too!

We want the mode to be new and challenging! But not so challenging that we ALL can't beat it! It's not " fair" that we all can't get top rewards! Only people that pay can win! Those of us who have never spent a dime, or spent enough time to develop good decks as free players should also be able to reap all the benefits because... reasons!

Basically, you're all asking for the game to just give you all the cards you want, for free, with as little effort as possible. And somehow, you all don't realize how silly it sounds.

I've never asked for, or wanted, everything for free. I've dropped hundreds of dollars (likely more... I'm too afraid to actually tally it up) on this game. I've grinded pretty hard, as well. What I want is a true virtual economy, not this restricted thing they want to pass off as one. I've outlined a bunch of suggestions in a brand new post. Feel free to go check it out to see exactly what I'd do to change it and why. You act like opening up an economy would cost CD money. No, just the opposite. Commerce models have shown over and over and over again that the short-sighted money grab ultimately leads to limited financial gain and eventual failure. Ever wonder why FIFA's FUT is so insanely successful? 5% tax, no listing fee, one-hour listings, low minimums, etc. They promote an open economic model. They want people to buy and sell and trade and work the system. They want free players involved. THEY know what they're doing, and years after they launched it, they've kept it very limited with restrictions. Learn from those who do what you do better.

[jasrulz63]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

As someone who was sitting in UR tier in RttC, I was able to grind out and win the epic card without using credits so I thought the difficulty was quite fair on me. I did go from winning every single +7 game in UR to struggling to win games on +2 in epic, but that's got to do with the balance (or lack thereof) of my team I feel.

[eVizions]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

As someone who was sitting in UR tier in RttC, I was able to grind out and win the epic card without using credits so I thought the difficulty was quite fair on me. I did go from winning every single +7 game in UR to struggling to win games on +2 in epic, but that's got to do with the balance (or lack thereof) of my team I feel.

Yeah, RttC is interesting. It definitely rewards higher level players (I blew through it in the first day), but I imagine that it must suck for lower level players, since you're capped at what you can earn. Everyone can't earn Hakeem, but does it create a further divide between higher and lower level players?

[Illmatic1909]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

ActionJack, no offense, but you have no clue what you are talking about. Competition in any market is what drives prices up from the consumer side, and lowers prices from the supply side. It's why power companies and cable companies can charge insane amounts...because there is no competition from the supply side. Likewise, competition from the buyer side will drive prices up. A market with low minimums and high BIN's will not allow for trading, because the card will always go to closing time unless the seller is willing to bypass and pay the high BIN.

I have never asked for free credits...I've put more than enough money into this game. I think the daily bonus was enough to give people a start. I'm telling you that you are an outlier in terms of sellers. All you have to do is hit "search" in the auction house...

[richie_r1ch]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

with no minimums people will never buy credits or packs again. It wouldn't be long before everyone starts selling everything at a bargain price just to make a sale. It would definitely get out of hand. Maybe in the next version where everyone starts fresh, but as it is now there are way too many cards out there to make that change this late in the game. Just like nerfing star rewards, it was too late to do that also, now everyone just getting into star is screwed and will take that much longer to compete.

[eVizions]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

with no minimums people will never buy credits or packs again. It wouldn't be long before everyone starts selling everything at a bargain price just to make a sale. It would definitely get out of hand. Maybe in the next version where everyone starts fresh, but as it is now there are way too many cards out there to make that change this late in the game. Just like nerfing star rewards, it was too late to do that also, now everyone just getting into star is screwed and will take that much longer to compete.

Regular pack sales are screwed anyway. People buy credits to a) buy auctions, b) buy MVP/AS/HOF packs, or c) buy hot streaks (and now game nights). Whatever CD is losing in sales of regular packs, they are most likely making up for with credits purchased for AH.

If there were no minimums and the tax were dropped significantly, prices would drop initially as they flooded, but then would pick right back up. As people sold stuff, they would buy stuff. I would dup more Star cards. Then I would try to sell my Star Pros (which aren't selling right now) and aim for MVP cards.

[wodkalol]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

u guys need to stop defending CD and all their greed

BUT THEY NEED TO MAKE MONEY

sure they do. but the prices are beyond redic. a HOF card costs more than an actual game
whats more content gta5 or a HOF card that doesnt make it into any star lineup?

think some people are losing sight of the real world here

[wodkalol]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

and for those people who think rttc is fine and it is only low tier decks crying...

my deck is star+ and only star dupes help me improve anymore. yet in rttc i could only get malone. won every +7 games no problem at all in malone tier but i cant win a +2 in ewing tier to save my life
doesnt make any sense. not even ewing would have made it in any lineup but i could dupe him later on

whats the point in rttc if it doesn help u improve your deck, not even in the long run?????

[richie_r1ch]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

whats more content gta5 or a HOF card that doesnt make it into any star lineup?

Depends how many slots the card has.

[ActionJack]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

ActionJack, no offense, but you have no clue what you are talking about. Competition in any market is what drives prices up from the consumer side, and lowers prices from the supply side. It's why power companies and cable companies can charge insane amounts...because there is no competition from the supply side. Likewise, competition from the buyer side will drive prices up. A market with low minimums and high BIN's will not allow for trading, because the card will always go to closing time unless the seller is willing to bypass and pay the high BIN.

I have never asked for free credits...I've put more than enough money into this game. I think the daily bonus was enough to give people a start. I'm telling you that you are an outlier in terms of sellers. All you have to do is hit "search" in the auction house...

Hitting search in the Auction House doesn't tell the tale. You can't see what cards are getting sold via BIN, and you can't see which cards ate getting sniped. Seeing as how that's how most cards seen to be selling... you're not getting any decent info at all by just "hitting search".

But again, I do agree that it is hard to sell some of the cards... but where we disagree is that I think that's fine. I don't believe the AH should be a place to just turn all your unwanted cards into free credits. If that's what it was, everyone would have a dream deck in a week. It'd be stupid.

As for the economics lesson, you're not saying anything I don't already know. Low minimums, and high BIN would not allow for trading in the strictest terms, but it would still create a market in which people got whatever they wanted for next to nothing. Not " trading" on a 1-to-1 with somebody, but we'd all essentially be trading with the house. The problem right now is that the market is overstated with EVERYTHING, except a small few types of cards. My argument is that, no matter what you do right now, that issue isn't gonna change. Now, CD COULD drop eliminate minimums, but then everyone would land a dream deck in a day or two. Then what?

Taking any action right now would be silly.

More importantly right now, low minimums and high BIN isn't what most people here even want. They want low/no minimums, and low BIN. They want a "free market" so they can get everything they want for nothing, set up trades, etc.

[richie_r1ch]

Re: Update 6 Release Notes - March 18th

whats the point in rttc if it doesn help u improve your deck, not even in the long run?????

True, I really hated that part of rttc. I don't mind having to grind it out if I have a weaker deck, but it was pretty much impossible to get the next tier card. Everything before that I could win without even looking. Needs some tweaking bad.

And I agree, the cost of some of these packs are ridiculous when you convert them to actual money. It's unreal to say the least.