Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

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  • sheva07
    Rookie
    • Dec 2008
    • 272

    #346
    Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

    Originally posted by Blasterhead
    Yeah! Alongside that I've also made a spreadsheet with average stats for positions based on your roster, and the overall/potentials of all the rookies for comparison. (if anyone wants to have a look I'll upload to google docs-it's ugly though!). Since I'm simply making fictional drafts I don't have raw data to draw stats from, so I've just been comparing them to the current roster.

    I've noticed for a lot of players, contrary to the guide, you are using freelance off ball screen tendencies on quite a few players. I've avoided using it because of your warning, but what's the latest word on this?

    i'm really interested..could you upload it?

    Comment

    • slimm44
      MVP
      • Sep 2005
      • 3253

      #347
      Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

      Originally posted by -CoL-
      I actually check synergy data for individual players all the time for free, what I don't get is access to their videos and stuff (assume the paid version also shows better rankings, sortable tables or I dunno tho).


      But anyway, regarding the inconsistencies on simulated stats, Of course I had injuries disabled and no trades and 40 minutes for Love, but I finally found out what was it, it's a problem with the way 2ksports handles the stats in sims, now I don't know if I can link another website but townknave made a great post titled "Comprehensive Simulated Stats Mechanics Guide" in NLSC, it explains how every stat relates to real life results, and how some stats have absolutely no input on simulated stats. I recommend checking it, it could come handy for the future.

      For example 99 block rating would only amount to a 4.9% block rating, so no matter what I do, I wouldn't get more than that; and rebounding itself for a player affects the distribution of rebounds for a team, he had the same problem with Love and by reducing the rebound rating for his teammates (mostly beasly and darko), Love's rebounds went up, worked for me too, again Seriously recommend reading that post to understand how the simulated games work in 2k12.
      I have absolutely no problems getting accurate numbers across the board during simultation except FG% and Blocks (14-15 RPB, 10-12 APG, 2-3 SPG, accurate metric stats, etc.) and have posted the data to prove it in this thread and others. I understand how the sim-engine works. What confuses me is why you can't get the same stats I do. I consistently get accurate stats and minutes (when the rotations are set properly) with how the roster is currently rated. By accuracy, I mean compared to last-years numbers. Remember, this roster hasn't been updated in accordance with this year's stats yet because I want more of a sample size before doing that kind of an update. I plan on doing one major rating/tendency update around the all-star break, then leaving that part of the roster alone. If you are comparing the sim-stats to this year's actual stats, they will be at least slightly to moderately off, but should still be in a range considered "realistic".

      I know the block % tops out at around 5-6% in the sim-engine. I knew this going in to rating the roster but based my block ratings on a 10% scale due to my intention of at some time having all classic rosters re-rated to the same scales as current players and wanting there to be clear separation between players. For example, Howard has a block% of around 5-6, but players historically have had a block% between 7-10. That's why I talked before about possibly having a second roster only to factor in the players in the league today, particularly in regards to the block rating.

      Thanks for letting me know you can see stats for free on synergy. I didn't know you can do that. I will definitely use that info in future releases of the roster.
      Last edited by slimm44; 01-26-2012, 09:42 AM.
      Acts 2:38. Let the truth be told.
      John 4:23. He is seeking a seeker.
      John 3:20. Say no to normal.

      Comment

      • slimm44
        MVP
        • Sep 2005
        • 3253

        #348
        Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

        Originally posted by ohvitser12
        Hey Slimm have you also adjusted and lowered players potential lvls, so it would have good effect on association?So there wouldn´t be 10 99 players after 3 seasons and so.
        Yes I have.
        Acts 2:38. Let the truth be told.
        John 4:23. He is seeking a seeker.
        John 3:20. Say no to normal.

        Comment

        • slimm44
          MVP
          • Sep 2005
          • 3253

          #349
          Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

          Originally posted by Blasterhead
          Yeah! Alongside that I've also made a spreadsheet with average stats for positions based on your roster, and the overall/potentials of all the rookies for comparison. (if anyone wants to have a look I'll upload to google docs-it's ugly though!). Since I'm simply making fictional drafts I don't have raw data to draw stats from, so I've just been comparing them to the current roster.

          I've noticed for a lot of players, contrary to the guide, you are using freelance off ball screen tendencies on quite a few players. I've avoided using it because of your warning, but what's the latest word on this?
          I don't know what you're saying in the second paragraph. Can you please explain?

          EDIT: In earlier builds of the roster, I used that tendency in conjunction with the Set Screen Tendency frequently but noticed that when you have players with more than a 0 in Set Screen Tendency, it caused a lot of screens to be set in the low post among big men and they would flash-screen in the low block. I hated that as it's completely unrealistic.

          What I've realized is players with a Use Screen Tendency above 0 will automatically "call" for a screen to be set when they want it. I would suggest using the Use Screen Tendency but not using the Set Screen Tendency. With the tendencies edited that way, players will use screens more appropriately but the inappropriate use of setting screens is minimized/eliminated.

          If you have any questions, let me know. I'm not sure if I've explained this clearly.
          Last edited by slimm44; 01-26-2012, 09:37 AM.
          Acts 2:38. Let the truth be told.
          John 4:23. He is seeking a seeker.
          John 3:20. Say no to normal.

          Comment

          • ruggedman
            Rookie
            • Oct 2009
            • 2

            #350
            Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

            Hi guys i know it is probably a stupid question but whats the right destination for all those files in the game directory. Can someone please help me out?

            Comment

            • rosque
              Banned
              • Aug 2011
              • 502

              #351
              Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

              C:\Users\xxx\AppData\Roaming\2K Sports\NBA 2K12\Saves

              Comment

              • pokerplaya
                MVP
                • Nov 2004
                • 1275

                #352
                Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                I sent you a private, Slimm - but I saw your likes on my additions to your set, so I'm leaving the file up, and of course you can grab and feel free to put it as your official if you wish. I do not wish for or need any credit I was just glad to be able to help out on this amazing project and have it be even more useful/realistic to others. As I said in private message, if I can do anything else with the free version of REGEdit, I am at your disposal.
                I'm just an old guy sports gamer...

                Comment

                • MrFireTurkey
                  Banned
                  • Oct 2011
                  • 7

                  #353
                  Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                  So, each year in an association - does every player's 3pt tendency go up? Or just the bigs?

                  It's a 3pt jack feast a few seasons in. The league-wide 3pt shooting % is horrible!

                  Comment

                  • slimm44
                    MVP
                    • Sep 2005
                    • 3253

                    #354
                    Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                    Originally posted by MrFireTurkey
                    So, each year in an association - does every player's 3pt tendency go up? Or just the bigs?

                    It's a 3pt jack feast a few seasons in. The league-wide 3pt shooting % is horrible!
                    I don't know about the 3pt Tendency. Haven't checked.

                    If you don't like the 3pt %, or any rating or tendency, edit them to your liking.
                    Acts 2:38. Let the truth be told.
                    John 4:23. He is seeking a seeker.
                    John 3:20. Say no to normal.

                    Comment

                    • slimm44
                      MVP
                      • Sep 2005
                      • 3253

                      #355
                      Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                      Originally posted by pokerplaya
                      I sent you a private, Slimm - but I saw your likes on my additions to your set, so I'm leaving the file up, and of course you can grab and feel free to put it as your official if you wish. I do not wish for or need any credit I was just glad to be able to help out on this amazing project and have it be even more useful/realistic to others. As I said in private message, if I can do anything else with the free version of REGEdit, I am at your disposal.
                      I think it would be the most helpful if you would either A. help create fictitious (or projected real) draft classes or B. start editing the classic teams. There's one poster who is working on draft classes, but I think either one would be great. I'll be able to update the ratings/tendencies fairly quickly when the time is right. Thanks for your help, man!
                      Acts 2:38. Let the truth be told.
                      John 4:23. He is seeking a seeker.
                      John 3:20. Say no to normal.

                      Comment

                      • pokerplaya
                        MVP
                        • Nov 2004
                        • 1275

                        #356
                        Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                        Originally posted by slimm44
                        I think it would be the most helpful if you would either A. help create fictitious (or projected real) draft classes or B. start editing the classic teams. There's one poster who is working on draft classes, but I think either one would be great. I'll be able to update the ratings/tendencies fairly quickly when the time is right. Thanks for your help, man!
                        Hmm, I might be able to look into classic teams... I really don't follow college enough to be any kind of authority. I guess I have to see what kind of data I'd have to crunch to do classic team edits. I'm old enough to probably be helpful there, just wasn't sure what else you had planned for these rosters as far as the current NBA. And you're welcome!
                        I'm just an old guy sports gamer...

                        Comment

                        • Blasterhead
                          Rookie
                          • Jan 2012
                          • 9

                          #357
                          Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                          Originally posted by slimm44
                          In earlier builds of the roster, I used that tendency in conjunction with the Set Screen Tendency frequently but noticed that when you have players with more than a 0 in Set Screen Tendency, it caused a lot of screens to be set in the low post among big men and they would flash-screen in the low block. I hated that as it's completely unrealistic.

                          What I've realized is players with a Use Screen Tendency above 0 will automatically "call" for a screen to be set when they want it. I would suggest using the Use Screen Tendency but not using the Set Screen Tendency. With the tendencies edited that way, players will use screens more appropriately but the inappropriate use of setting screens is minimized/eliminated.

                          If you have any questions, let me know. I'm not sure if I've explained this clearly.
                          Thanks, it was in response to this line from the guide:
                          "All players get 0 in Use and Set screen. If not, it causes big men to set screens for each other at times which looks ridiculous."

                          I'll start occasionally adding use screen for versatile shooting guards and small forwards (sound about right?).

                          pokerplaya: I don't want to discourage you or anyone else from working on historical teams, but having another person working on draft classes would be great! It's a far bigger job than I thought it was (making four of five already seems crazy, more like one or two!).

                          I don't actually know a lot about college basketball myself (or basketball in general for that manner), so I'm also not the best person for the job. I'm learning a lot as I go. But the sooner there is a stockpile of draft classes the sooner people can start those dream franchises without the game getting so messed up.

                          Comment

                          • Blasterhead
                            Rookie
                            • Jan 2012
                            • 9

                            #358
                            Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                            Originally posted by sheva07
                            i'm really interested..could you upload it?
                            https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...VNJZUk4NE45WGc

                            It was just copied from the player cards in game, so is unfortunately missing some attributes/tendencies.

                            I'm making sure to only use it as reference alongside the slimm44's guide.
                            I was relying on it way too much at first and it makes the players less interesting, and is probably quite misleading. Wish I had data on player stats according to playstyle/height/weight/etc.

                            Potentials are interesting, and there has already been a lot of analysis of them. (here)

                            The key potential value seems to be 75, which determines whether the player will continue to increase their potential (confusing I know) after 24 years of age. Potential values 75 or over will likely end up as starters or better in the long run. Around 69-73 potential is the interesting point: depending on playing time and injuries within the first few years, the player might break 75 potential and become much better players than they otherwise would.

                            Comment

                            • pokerplaya
                              MVP
                              • Nov 2004
                              • 1275

                              #359
                              Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                              Originally posted by Blasterhead
                              Thanks, it was in response to this line from the guide:
                              "All players get 0 in Use and Set screen. If not, it causes big men to set screens for each other at times which looks ridiculous."

                              I'll start occasionally adding use screen for versatile shooting guards and small forwards (sound about right?).

                              pokerplaya: I don't want to discourage you or anyone else from working on historical teams, but having another person working on draft classes would be great! It's a far bigger job than I thought it was (making four of five already seems crazy, more like one or two!).

                              I don't actually know a lot about college basketball myself (or basketball in general for that manner), so I'm also not the best person for the job. I'm learning a lot as I go. But the sooner there is a stockpile of draft classes the sooner people can start those dream franchises without the game getting so messed up.
                              My question about the next rookie classes is if we're going to have to buy higher versions of REGEdit just to keep the contracts from being ridiculous like Irving's and Williams' were before I fixed them... also, I've noticed in some out of game box scores certain of my players being named other names... like Hansbrough's stats appear as Tyler Honeycutt in the boxscore. They still calculate right for the player card and all the stat boards, but its just weird man... I'd be interested in helping with draft classes, but I really have no idea what the community would want and would have to do a lot of research. I'm game, however...
                              I'm just an old guy sports gamer...

                              Comment

                              • ruggedman
                                Rookie
                                • Oct 2009
                                • 2

                                #360
                                Re: Realistic Rosters/Sliders/Coaching Tendencies *Complete Overhaul*

                                Wow really great work thanks to you slim and every other person involved.
                                Just wondered why D.Rose got only 70 and something in inside and near the basket scoring cause guys like conley got 80. Nonetheless great works feels really good to play and tweaking roses scoring attributes i'm able to handle that by myself^^.

                                Comment

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