Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

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  • ehh
    Hall Of Fame
    • Mar 2003
    • 28962

    #16
    Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

    Are you guys using sliders or playing default? I'm still on default All-Star and don't see this it all. I run and gun with the Knicks and get tons of open J's and knock down plenty of them cept for the games where my team is ice cold - which is nice and realistic since the Knicks shot 7-41 and 5-31 from 3 in two preseason games.

    For the most part I'm hitting though, gone 6-8 from deep with Wilson Chandler in a game and 4-6 with Gallinari.
    "You make your name in the regular season, and your fame in the postseason." - Clyde Frazier

    "Beware of geeks bearing formulas." - Warren Buffet

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    • darrenp1518
      Banned
      • Oct 2003
      • 454

      #17
      Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

      Originally posted by michaeljordanjr
      I'm definitely not making this up.

      Even online I see my opponent missing wide open shots. It's gotten to a point where I see him shoot wide open and I don't care because I know most of the time he'll miss.

      For some reason it's either the releases that are random and don't have a good release point due to the addition of multiple shots or its DNA that's messing it up.

      NBA players mostly ALWAYS make wide open shots. And if its Ray Allen, he NEVER misses wide open.

      This is an issue if we get enough people testing it out you'll see.
      This is definitely not a true statement...nba players miss wide open shots all the time


      NBA Live does a great job of representing that

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      • michaeljordanjr
        Banned
        • Jun 2009
        • 972

        #18
        Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

        Originally posted by ehh
        Are you guys using sliders or playing default? I'm still on default All-Star and don't see this it all. I run and gun with the Knicks and get tons of open J's and knock down plenty of them cept for the games where my team is ice cold - which is nice and realistic since the Knicks shot 7-41 and 5-31 from 3 in two preseason games.

        For the most part I'm hitting though, gone 6-8 from deep with Wilson Chandler in a game and 4-6 with Gallinari.
        I'm using online sliders.

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        • Vinngadd
          Rookie
          • May 2006
          • 74

          #19
          Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

          NBA players do miss wide open shots all the time, but, those guys get paid plenty of money to knock them down. If these cats miss more open jumpers than they make, they shouldn't be playing. I think the point is that people feel as if they miss more wide open shots then they actually should. Ray Allen shot 48% from the field last season and 40% from 3-PT range, if someone is releasing the ball at the precise moment that it should be released, and he's wide open, there is no reason why He shouldn't make 48% of his shots inside the arc and 40% beyond. If he's shooting 30% from the field with Ray Allen taking wide open and releasing the ball at the correct point, then that's a problem. True, I don't know how many lay-ups Ray Allen took last season, but chances are that he took more Mid-Range J's than lay-ups, although he can put the ball on the floor, Ray's shots in the offense typically come from him getting off of screens and spot up jump shots. I can understand the oddity of it all.
          I will do today what you won't, so tomorrow, I can accomplish what you can't.

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          • jtdribbles25
            Banned
            • Aug 2003
            • 1415

            #20
            Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

            I played 4 games last night with the celtics and shot over 50% with ray in every game. Dude is butter. coming off screens and hitting long 3's. waited for the open looks no contest. definitely missed some shots, definitely got hot and cold. but shooting 19-30, 15-24, 17-35, 11-20.. no online games tho. interesting.

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            • Bornindamecca
              Books Nelson Simnation
              • Jul 2007
              • 10919

              #21
              Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

              Originally posted by ehh
              Are you guys using sliders or playing default? I'm still on default All-Star and don't see this it all. I run and gun with the Knicks and get tons of open J's and knock down plenty of them cept for the games where my team is ice cold - which is nice and realistic since the Knicks shot 7-41 and 5-31 from 3 in two preseason games.

              For the most part I'm hitting though, gone 6-8 from deep with Wilson Chandler in a game and 4-6 with Gallinari.
              this is where I'm at. With the players whose releases I have down(westbrook, Durant, Green, Kryptonate), I'm pretty wet. With the people whose releases I don't have(sefolosha, Harden, Duhon), it's brick city all of the time.
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              • TMagic
                G.O.A.T.
                • Apr 2007
                • 7550

                #22
                Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                Originally posted by Bornindamecca
                this is where I'm at. With the players whose releases I have down(westbrook, Durant, Green, Kryptonate), I'm pretty wet. With the people whose releases I don't have(sefolosha, Harden, Duhon), it's brick city all of the time.
                I'm sorry Born, but that just doesn't sit right. Do something bout that...LOL


                But I feel the same way you do. With the Magic, I'm money with Nelson and Carter. But Rashard and Pietrus can shoot me right out of a game.
                PSN: TMagic_01

                Twitter: @ThoseFools

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                • DW3
                  MVP
                  • Oct 2005
                  • 1056

                  #23
                  Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                  I'm not seeing these issues at all. I'm playing on default allstar and I shoot about 48% whe I concentrate. I just need help with the euro step and the pro hop lol
                  Xbox Live- YoKnos
                  PSN- YoKnos

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                  • moemoe24
                    Rookie
                    • Oct 2007
                    • 1996

                    #24
                    Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                    Some of you guys are hilarious...doing experiments to try and prove the game is scripted and all this and that. Why cant you just play the game and enjoy it?? If you feel its a bad game because you think its scripted, why keep playing it and commenting on it??

                    As far as it being scripted or that it is all based off percentages.....of course it is because its a video game. Like I said before, the only way to make a game without it being based on % is to have us smash real players into our console and control them.

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                    • michaeljordanjr
                      Banned
                      • Jun 2009
                      • 972

                      #25
                      Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                      Originally posted by moemoe24
                      Some of you guys are hilarious...doing experiments to try and prove the game is scripted and all this and that. Why cant you just play the game and enjoy it?? If you feel its a bad game because you think its scripted, why keep playing it and commenting on it??

                      As far as it being scripted or that it is all based off percentages.....of course it is because its a video game. Like I said before, the only way to make a game without it being based on % is to have us smash real players into our console and control them.
                      Look bro Im loving Live and theres no conspiracy intended with this thread. Do you have any idea how frustrating it is to miss 2-3 wide open shots in a row after you work hard to get Ray Allen open? Then lose the game online cause it makes no sense?

                      All I know is what I saw, if I instantly release the ball or if I hold it for very long, the consistency is so terrible I have no idea what to THINK.

                      Maybe Mike needs to add a shooting meter like in Sony's NBA game?

                      Comment

                      • Jano
                        You Dead Wrong
                        • May 2004
                        • 3161

                        #26
                        Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                        I feel your pain jordan I was going through the same thing when I first started playing. Just keep shooting and watch the player as he shoots look for him to reach to top of his jump.

                        One thing I dislike about this game is how much a players release factors into a made/miss shot. With guys like Allen I should still be able to knock down shots even if I don't have the release down.

                        Right now if you don't have the release down you can go 0/8 off of open jumpers alone. This wouldn't be as much of a problem if the game had somewhere you could practice shooting w/ anyone you want.

                        Since it doesn't sometimes games can come down to who knows how to shoot w/ their players not who can get the best shots.

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                        • Bornindamecca
                          Books Nelson Simnation
                          • Jul 2007
                          • 10919

                          #27
                          Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                          Originally posted by TMagic
                          I'm sorry Born, but that just doesn't sit right. Do something bout that...LOL

                          BOOO!
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                          • blues rocker
                            MVP
                            • Sep 2007
                            • 1921

                            #28
                            Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                            Originally posted by ramzes93
                            Yeah this is really confusing to me, just like you said it seems like it is harder to make wide open shots then ones with a hand or two in your face. All so sometimes on fastbreaks i accidently launch for the three a few feet behind the line, and the shot almost always never hits rim, and almost looks like it rips the net.

                            It kind of feels like the game decides when you should make shots on a script, with nothing to do with how open you are or your position to the basket.

                            ^^^Yep...that's what I think. It seems like the game will forces misses or makes in order to get the stats it wants. Shot success does not seem to be related how open you are. Instead, the success of shots seems to be controlled by the game and it's scripted idea of how the stats should add up by the end. The whole thing feels very scripted, like the game is causing open shots to miss and contested shots to go in just to make the stats look correct. I have seen good shooters miss 3 wide open shots in a row, only to see them make 3 contested shots in a row - this tells me the game is not even recognizing if my shots are contested or open. I want shot success to be determined by how open I am.

                            If I get 10 wide open shots in a row, I should make 8 or 9 of them...but Live would never let that happen, because the game will cheat by making me miss open shots in order to keep my stats closer to that player's real life average.

                            Ray Allen might average 45% shooting overall, but the game needs to be more aware of contested versus open shots. The code doesn't seem to take this into account. It just seems like the game is programmed to get realistic stats by the end of the game, so it's going to force you to miss or make depending on how it wants your stats to be.

                            Ray Allen should make 85% of his open shots, 20% of his partially contested shots, and 5% of his highly contested shots. The success rate should gradually decrease in proportion to how hard the defender contests it. The success of a shot should be determined by a combination of that player's shooting ability, and how closely contested they are. Even a great shooter should usually miss if there is a defender right on him. But he should almost always make his wide open shots.
                            Last edited by blues rocker; 10-23-2009, 05:34 PM.

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                            • loadleft
                              Rookie
                              • Oct 2005
                              • 284

                              #29
                              Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                              Originally posted by Vinngadd
                              NBA players do miss wide open shots all the time, but, those guys get paid plenty of money to knock them down. If these cats miss more open jumpers than they make, they shouldn't be playing. I think the point is that people feel as if they miss more wide open shots then they actually should. Ray Allen shot 48% from the field last season and 40% from 3-PT range, if someone is releasing the ball at the precise moment that it should be released, and he's wide open, there is no reason why He shouldn't make 48% of his shots inside the arc and 40% beyond. If he's shooting 30% from the field with Ray Allen taking wide open and releasing the ball at the correct point, then that's a problem. True, I don't know how many lay-ups Ray Allen took last season, but chances are that he took more Mid-Range J's than lay-ups, although he can put the ball on the floor, Ray's shots in the offense typically come from him getting off of screens and spot up jump shots. I can understand the oddity of it all.
                              How is it that we know that we are releasing the ball at the precise moment with no shot meter? Why don't you look at the fact that you are missing open shots and say: "Boy I really can't shoot, look all these open shots I missed. We tend to look at this game and assume we are doing it right so something must be wrong with the game. I like that it's so dependent on release points because when I play the cheese heads and make them miss by properly challenging their shots they start to question their release points and they start to adjust it and miss more shots even when they're open, LOL. I love it! I admit it's frustrating trying to figure out the proper point to release but I don't think I would won't a shot meter, definitely not in the game but probably not in practice either. Although a nice compromise would be to have the option to have one in game like there is the option to have player names on.

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                              • ehh
                                Hall Of Fame
                                • Mar 2003
                                • 28962

                                #30
                                Re: Wide open shots miss more than contested shots

                                Live '11 definitely needs to have a mode to practice your release like 2K where you get feedback; good, early, late, perfect, etc.

                                I've probably played 50 Knicks games and still don't have a clue where Duhon's release point is.
                                "You make your name in the regular season, and your fame in the postseason." - Clyde Frazier

                                "Beware of geeks bearing formulas." - Warren Buffet

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