Basketball is NOT Hockey

[Jano]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Lol my bad I was pretty vague on that here is the interview I was talking about:

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/sports/nbalive11/news.html?sid=6264429&mode=previews&om_act=convert&om_clk=previews&tag=previews;title;2

Here is the part on your question:

The shot is based on real life. You move the right stick up to start your shot and release it to release the ball. You have control of the accuracy and the distance. If you move the RS perfectly up to 12:00, your shot will go straight. If you miss left, the ball will go left. Miss it right, and the ball will go right. When you release the ball will control the distance. Release early, and the shot will be short. Release late, and the shot will be long. The system is so realistic that you can do manual bank shots by purposely aiming left or right and a bit long.

If people are concerned that because it is skill-based shooting you can make every shot, then you can relax. Shots are harder to make if you are further away from the basket, are being closely guarded, are a below-average shooter, or you have too much fade or momentum, among other factors.

[Da_Czar]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

[QUOTE=kgisyourfather;2041130334]

Yes in the past, EA regarding particually Live when they talk about change it doesn't mean they are going the right direction. But look at their other sports games and read what they are trying to change. This isn't 5 years ago. It sounds like there is a sim focus here and the title speaks to that. QUOTE]

Yeah right here sums up both sides they have talked about it before other games have made strides HOPEFULLY your right and we all win. I'm firmly planted in the Missouri camp... There gonna have to show me...LOL. But I got you !

[Playmakers]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Lol my bad I was pretty vague on that here is the interview I was talking about:

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/sports/nbalive11/news.html?sid=6264429&mode=previews&om_act=convert&om_clk=previews&tag=previews;title;2

Here is the part on your question:

Yeah that kinda sounds like you control the outcome of just about every shot....

I don't know if that is a good thing or not for those who prefer to have the actual ability of the players to dictate outcomes.

For example lets say a guy is extremely good and mastered the shot stick and then he's shooting mid range jumpers with Eddie Curry how much IMPACT on the shot does Eddie Curry's actual ability have in NBA Live Elite?

Or we can just throw out player skill and it basically revolves around the human players ability alone

[Jano]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Well it seems to me that ratings will still come into play here b/c the difficulty of the shot is determined by more factors then shot ratings alone.

You have to deal with being contested, how far away you are, and ratings. And the fact that you control the shot all the way down to whether or not it goes left or right will make mastering it a bit difficult.

Because with a guy like Curry you have to be wide open, move the stick at the perfect angle, and release the ball with the right type of power. I don't see too many people being able to abuse due to all the things you need to go your way.

The pressure of all this seems a lot tougher then it past games b/c its much more like real life shooting. And I'm not even factoring in sig jumpshots that will make it even more of challenge because you also would have to account for the animations limits too.

Its seems that having great shooters on your team will be much more important now more then ever. In this system it seems like you could knock down some shots off of skill alone but, for convenience sake putting the ball in a good shooters hand will be more beneficial.

And if all else fails we still got sliders to tweak too..

[kgisyourfather]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

[quote=Da_Czar;2041130376]

Yes in the past, EA regarding particually Live when they talk about change it doesn't mean they are going the right direction. But look at their other sports games and read what they are trying to change. This isn't 5 years ago. It sounds like there is a sim focus here and the title speaks to that. QUOTE]

Yeah right here sums up both sides they have talked about it before other games have made strides HOPEFULLY your right and we all win. I'm firmly planted in the Missouri camp... There gonna have to show me...LOL. But I got you !

I don't blame you. I want to see it myself. I hope this doesn't turn out to be something where it's always wait until next year. I'm so sick of that.

If it says Elite it better be ELITE!

Like has been said there is always that 1 year dev cycle when revamping a game. I hope we aren't back to madden 06.

[Da_Czar]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Yeah that kinda sounds like you control the outcome of just about every shot....

I don't know if that is a good thing or not for those who prefer to have the actual ability of the players to dictate outcomes.

For example lets say a guy is extremely good and mastered the shot stick and then he's shooting mid range jumpers with Eddie Curry how much IMPACT on the shot does Eddie Curry's actual ability have in NBA Live Elite?

Or we can just throw out player skill and it basically revolves around the human players ability alone

Playmakers you are more familiar with live than probably anyone with this new news man what do you think ?

[Da_Czar]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Lets not forget Ncaa b-ball no longer exist, so they might have a big team working on Elite 11.

that team wasn't that big mharlem and a few of them already worked on both titles anyway. So I'm sure you get some boost out of that by them working full time on it but don't know how much more. Its sounds from that article though that they put some more money into it so the team could be huge now.

[Da_Czar]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

[QUOTE=kgisyourfather;2041130412]

I don't blame you. I want to see it myself. I hope this doesn't turn out to be something where it's always wait until next year. I'm so sick of that.

If it says Elite it better be ELITE!

Like has been said there is always that 1 year dev cycle when revamping a game. I hope we aren't back to madden 06.

EXACTLY !!!! Fam... EXACTLY !!! Were on the same page.

[Playmakers]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Playmakers you are more familiar with live than probably anyone with this new news man what do you think ?

Honestly, I don't know what to think or expect Czar

I wasn't happy with Live 10 but that doesn't mean it was a bad game.....just my expectations of playing the game for many years might have been higher than most guys who enjoyed Live 10

From reading the information i kinda understand what they are attempting to do....whether it works or not we'll have to waite and see.

My biggest worry is that they'll make every thing more user controlled and take away the actual skill set of the players themselves on the floor. I kinda enjoy having games play out based on the players on my roster not my ability to hit shots all game.

But they did turn around the Hockey Franchise big time even though this is basketball i can see how some the stuff that worked great in NHL 09 and NHL 10 can help the NBA Live franshise I mean NBA Elite

[kgisyourfather]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

The major question with that quote is are ratings going to play a role as well. Will it depend on if you are shooting a 3 with ray allen vs a lesser 3 pt shooter. I could be misinterpretting what he's saying but i would be amazed if the game doesn't account for player differences, where you are on the court etc. If you are shooting a half court shot with kendrick perkins thats obviously not going ot be an easy shot to make. At least I would think they aren't that stupid.

I think czar is taking it out of context when he says entirely skill based although he does say "entirely skill based". But i'm assuming he means the person playing the games skill, plus the player you are controllings skill as well.

Assume nothing. Inquiring minds want to know.

[Jano]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

I think czar is taking it out of context when he says entirely skill based although he does say "entirely skill based". But i'm assuming he means the person playing the games skill, plus the player you are controllings skill as well.

This is the way I see it playing out..

[Playmakers]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

The major question with that quote is are ratings going to play a role as well. Will it depend on if you are shooting a 3 with ray allen vs a lesser 3 pt shooter. I could be misinterpretting what he's saying but i would be amazed if the game doesn't account for player differences, where you are on the court etc. If you are shooting a half court shot with kendrick perkins thats obviously not going ot be an easy shot to make. At least I would think they aren't that stupid.

Thank you!

That's what I'm worried about......no one has mentioned yet if the shot even takes into account the ability of the player.

I don't want a poor outside shooter knocking down shots just because I have good stick skills.

Maybe they should give two options one for Human skill ability and the other for CPU ability.

That way anyone who wishes to make shots based on their own stick skills can have that option.....but those who choose to rely more on the actual players ability should not be locked into that style of play.

I'm really big on players performing to their actual ratings not me making that player better just because i have good stick skills

[mvb34]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

Thank you!

That's what I'm worried about......no one has mentioned yet if the shot even takes into account the ability of the player.

I don't want a poor outside shooter knocking down shots just because I have good stick skills.

Maybe they should give two options one for Human skill ability and the other for CPU ability.

That way anyone who wishes to make shots based on their own stick skills can have that option.....but those who choose to rely more on the actual players ability should not be locked into that style of play.

I'm really big on players performing to their actual ratings not me making that player better just because i have good stick skills

From the gamespot interview

DL: In real life, shooting is skill based. Players practice every day to become better shooters. In basketball video games, shooting has not had much skill attached. Sure there is some skill to get it to your best shooter who is open for a shot, but that is more strategy than skill. Once a player shoots in almost every basketball game ever made, it is up to player attributes, how open he is, an under-the-hood formula, and a tiny bit of when you release the button to determine if the shot will go in. I do not feel very satisfied when I make a shot in basketball games. With the new shooting mechanic, it is all skill based, but at the same time it users player attributes. If you have played Tiger Woods golf, you have an idea of what the shooting mechanic is.
The shot is based on real life. You move the right stick up to start your shot and release it to release the ball. You have control of the accuracy and the distance. If you move the RS perfectly up to 12:00, your shot will go straight. If you miss left, the ball will go left. Miss it right, and the ball will go right. When you release the ball will control the distance. Release early, and the shot will be short. Release late, and the shot will be long. The system is so realistic that you can do manual bank shots by purposely aiming left or right and a bit long.
When you have the left stick towards the basket and you are close enough, moving the RS up will dunk the ball. Roll the RS up from the left, and you will do a left-handed layup. Roll it up from the right, and you will do a right-handed layup. Roll the RS up from a back down, and you will do a hook shot. The RS becomes an extension of your real-life hands, and it is not only realistic but incredibly satisfying when you hit a three to win the game. Even when you miss, you know it was your own fault. The sense of pressure near the end of a game becomes real, and you may miss a shot because of nerves.
So how do player attributes come into play? It's simple. Your tools become harder to work with. Here is an example of the sweet spot:
The green zone at the top is Shaq's sweet spot from the foul line.

The green zone at the top is Steve Nash's sweet spot from the foul line.




If people are concerned that because it is skill-based shooting you can make every shot, then you can relax. Shots are harder to make if you are further away from the basket, are being closely guarded, are a below-average shooter, or you have too much fade or momentum, among other factors.

[kgisyourfather]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

that's kicker is in the implementation. It all sounds great to me. How will it feel?? Will it play nice? This always sucks when news starts coming out and the game is months away. EA is starting their hype machine.

[kgisyourfather]

Re: Basketball is NOT Hockey

From the gamespot interview

DL: In real life, shooting is skill based. Players practice every day to become better shooters. In basketball video games, shooting has not had much skill attached. Sure there is some skill to get it to your best shooter who is open for a shot, but that is more strategy than skill. Once a player shoots in almost every basketball game ever made, it is up to player attributes, how open he is, an under-the-hood formula, and a tiny bit of when you release the button to determine if the shot will go in. I do not feel very satisfied when I make a shot in basketball games. With the new shooting mechanic, it is all skill based, but at the same time it users player attributes. If you have played Tiger Woods golf, you have an idea of what the shooting mechanic is.
The shot is based on real life. You move the right stick up to start your shot and release it to release the ball. You have control of the accuracy and the distance. If you move the RS perfectly up to 12:00, your shot will go straight. If you miss left, the ball will go left. Miss it right, and the ball will go right. When you release the ball will control the distance. Release early, and the shot will be short. Release late, and the shot will be long. The system is so realistic that you can do manual bank shots by purposely aiming left or right and a bit long.
When you have the left stick towards the basket and you are close enough, moving the RS up will dunk the ball. Roll the RS up from the left, and you will do a left-handed layup. Roll it up from the right, and you will do a right-handed layup. Roll the RS up from a back down, and you will do a hook shot. The RS becomes an extension of your real-life hands, and it is not only realistic but incredibly satisfying when you hit a three to win the game. Even when you miss, you know it was your own fault. The sense of pressure near the end of a game becomes real, and you may miss a shot because of nerves.
So how do player attributes come into play? It's simple. Your tools become harder to work with. Here is an example of the sweet spot:
The green zone at the top is Shaq's sweet spot from the foul line.

The green zone at the top is Steve Nash's sweet spot from the foul line.




If people are concerned that because it is skill-based shooting you can make every shot, then you can relax. Shots are harder to make if you are further away from the basket, are being closely guarded, are a below-average shooter, or you have too much fade or momentum, among other factors.

Thanks man. It sounds awesome to me. All it is is a new and improved shot stick that actually takes into account what you are doing with the stick and that they are actually analog, vs just pushing the stick a certain way and not taking into account what you are doing with it.

This should be applauded. We have been playing with gimped analog controls this entire gen. It's about time. This will help stop cheesers from just spamming buttons with thier best offensive player and drilling 3's and dunking it all game.