NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

[WTF]

Let me preface this with a large warning - KEEP THIS THREAD ON TOPIC. THREAD DERAILERS WILL BE MET WITH A BAN.

The NBA Live Development team has been having some interaction with the community as of late, with the OGSPORTS chiming in, NBALIVE_Fernando, EASPORTS_AJ all posting with our members. I figure they're here on OperationSports to get involved with the "Sim" community and hear our opinions.

Let's talk Gameplay. Let's throw graphics out of the way, as I'm sure that they will come strong with their updated player models, head scans, and jersey updates. Assuming the overall visuals are drastically updated, what is important to you guys a SIM basketball title?

I know that OperationSports has changed over the past number of years since I've been here, so I'm interested in seeing what is important to our members now.

If NBA Live 15 came with next generation graphics and simulation gameplay, would you consider it a buy?

I know back in the day, graphics and gameplay are the two key factors in determining if a game warranted a purchase from the community.

If yes, comment on what you think determines what is Simulation Gameplay. What elements make up that term (team specific AI, Superstar Tendencies, Playbooks/playstyles, etc)? In addition to that, if you played Live 14, what tweaks or enhancements would you need to make your experience better or the court?

If Gameplay and graphics are not enough to warrant a purchase, post on what would make the game warrant a purchase. i.e.-Modes, Sliders, Customization, etc.

I'm curious to see how our demographic has evolved over the years. I know in the past, a simulation title would definitely at the top of everyone's list. I'm wondering if this still holds true.

Again, no EA or NBA Live Bashing, or NBA Live needs to come strong after last year, EA needs to focus on Streetball, etc. Keep this on topic and hopefully give our community a voice since we have some interaction.

[JODYE]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

I think a large factor of what goes into "simulation" gameplay is the immersion factor the game possesses. That can be attributed to a number of things.

For me, I look at a few things when determining whether a game is truly a sim experience. Now I know the term "Sim" is very subjective, and the word gets throw around an awful lot, but this is what I expect.

One, is the accurate portrayal of player athleticism. Now, to be fair, both games lack this (2k a little moreso IMO), but a simulation should be able to represent every aspect of player movement fairly accurately. Whether it be the speed, the explosion, the agility, the leaping ability. Both games have failed in this department and should be one of EA's top priorities. This allows everything else to really fall into place. Fast breaks, Half Court motion in offensive sets, defense, rebounding, etc. All these facets of the game are affected by player movement. This includes, player contact and how that affects player movement.

Secondly, accurate ball physics are a must. They made strides with the dribbling technology, and I know it's not realistic to expect the ball to truly be "free" at this point, but I do expect on shots for the ball to carom in a realistic fashion, and to not warp to the rim, or warp to a players hand upon attempting to rebound or steal.

Thirdly, and this is self explanatory but true offensive sets, and team tendencies need to be in place. This includes player tendencies as well. The Spurs should play the like Spurs, LeBron should play like LeBron etc.

Obviously player likenesses, accurate shooting form animations, presentation, atmosphere etc all contribute to a title being a "Sim" but those first three are a must.

[WTF]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

All excellent feedback 13, much appreciated.

I can agree with everything that you listed there. So far we're at 4 "YES", Simulation gameplay is most important votes right now. Hopefully those others will chime in and list their thoughts as well.

I know that Synergy "should" get the tendencies right for each player. I'm wondering if there is a "team level" synergy approach as well.

I've continually wanted a true Sim gameplay experience, including the things that you listed above. As an offline gamer 99% of the time, I could care less about the online functions, extra modes (Dynasty/Season are good for me), editing, etc. I want a fun Simulation experience that represent the teams/players that I'm playing against.

The explosion and athleticism are sorely missing.

I agree that SIM is subjection and gets tossed around without a definition, that's really why I wanted to start this thread. I want a voice for OS, and a better description on what is SIM, and "how important is it".

If the gameplay is really good, and delivers a simulation experience, is that good enough in this generation? For me, it is. The "if it gives you full editing" thread made me think of this. Back in the day, I could care less about tweaking the game, editing players and tendencies, etc. Inside Drive introduced this editing the gameplay to your liking, but 9/10 times, I didn't even use it. They had accurate tendencies pretty much nailed out of the box. Guys like Rip running off of 3 or 4 screens per possession to get open. If guys are hitting their spots, and reacting accordingly, that is what I want.

I know last year had quite a few bugs that some posters experienced more than others (late game AI, 3 in the key, etc), but I thought for the most part, under the hood reacted pretty well, which is what kept me coming back.

Graphically, I'm not worried about this title as I think they heard loud and clear last year. If they can get the animations in there, the explosiveness to truly represent the world class athletes that we're playing as, team and player specific playstyles, and good competitive gameplay, then I'm set, regardless of what else they're able to do this year.

Good stuff 13.

[JODYE]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

I was going to add that as well WTF, thank you for reminding me.

Synergy is "supposed" to be the driving force of player/team tendencies, but I think it has yet to work as intended. I'm not entirely sure why, but it has never functioned as advertised.

Personally, I really don't think that function is needed. At least for the sim crowd. We have a great community here, as well as an online presence that puts a lot of work into editing tendencies and player attributes to make the game feel right. The absence of editing options was a glaring misstep by the EA crew last year, and I pray that it has been addressed. One of the reasons the shelf life on Live 10 was extended, was because of all the great resources we had available that edited the game and changed the way it behaved drastically.

With the amount of data, and documentation on player and team behavior, there should be no need for day to day updates regarding it. That should all be in the game, out of the box. Just because a player gets hot for one game, that shouldn't affect a players attributes or tendencies. That player remains the same. Only updates I want to see on a day to day basis are roster moves or accessory updates.

[El_Poopador]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

I'm in the same boat; realistic gameplay and AI is key for me. But, as mentioned above, a lot goes into that.

Players have to be able to move, change directions, run, jump, etc. to their natural ability, and there has to be differentiation between players in all attributes, not just the numbers. Playing with LeBron should feel drastically different than playing with Brian Scalabrine. But he should also feel different than someone like Melo. And not just things like running and cutting. Passing is something that no game has really gotten down well. I think passing should be broken into multiple attributes. Pass strength is something I have never seen in a basketball game, and the accuracy rating can be broken into multiple components, like bounce pass accuracy, chest pass, etc.

Playing to a player or team's strength should be rewarded. If I'm the Spurs, and I move the ball well make smart passes, I should be rewarded with the open looks they see in real life. But I should only have those open looks because I'm the Spurs. Not every team plays the same way, so I shouldn't be able to do that with every team. The Spurs are smart enough to keep moving and get themselves open enough to help their teammates constantly. If I'm playing as another team, they may not be able to move as intelligently without the ball.

I would also like to see automatic playcalling really take advantage of in-game performance. Basically, if someone is lighting it up, more plays should be called for them until they cool down. And on the defensive side, adjustments should be made to try and get them out of rhythm faster. And that means more than just double teams. Instead, we should see different rotations on the pick and roll, different defensive assignments (think LeBron covering Tony Parker), etc. Sometimes it's hard to push the tempo when you're on a run because playcalling can take more than a few seconds.

To piggyback off of that and the athleticism points, plays should be run with more sense of urgency. Hard cuts, good screens, and explosive sprints can help plays develop quicker. If a play breaks down because of good defense or a missed queue on offense, it should be easy to quickly get another play going. In games past, it's been very difficult to get two plays in one possession without resetting the shot clock.

I may think of more, but those are kind of the main things I'm looking for. I want my in-game, on-court experience to really feel like what I see on TV.

[Mintsa]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

Honestly. I want option 1 and 3. I want a sim game bottom line. But I also want that to carry over to online play as much as possible because I'm a big online player. Playing the AI doesn't do it for me like it use too. I want to play online and for it to be as sim as possible. I don't think that was an option....LOL.

[Live2K]

Re: NBA Live Community - Let's Talk Gameplay

Same here. It's possible to be sim and on online player.. I'm hoping for a solid online franchise and other modes in addition to gameplay improvements. Hard to narrow down what needs the most improvement so ill just add in all around defense. There needs to be a counter to everything, adaptive AI and better paint D/physics.