Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

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  • CM1847
    Bacon
    • Jul 2002
    • 5372

    #1

    Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

    I am going along in my Dynasty and I noticed something interesting today. I only play one game a week on my team's schedule just so I can make it through the season, and I realized I hadn't played a dominating big man yet. So I had the Spurs on one week, I decided to play it and see what Duncan did. In the first half he touched the ball TWICE and scored both times. The second half was a little better as he touched it 10 or 12 times, shooting 7/8 in the half. He ended up with 18 points on 9/10 shooting. My big men aren't good(I play as Orlando) and I expected him to handle Howard pretty easily, but he only touched the ball 15 times at most on offense all game. Ganobili and Parker both score over 20 and take 15-20 shots a piece. I won this game.

    I am a little annoyed(annoyed because they SHOULD have beat me, if Duncan got the ball more they would have won easy), but not really a big deal at this point, but I see the Heat on my schedule for the next week and go ahead and play that one to see what Shaq does. In the first half Shaq got the ball ONCE and scored, he had 2 points on 1/1 shooting in the entire half. The second half was a lot better, he got tons of touches but made some bad shots(he would settle for jumpers in the paint instead of trying to back me down). He ended with 14 points on 5-12 shooting (4-7 from the line). I was beating them by about 20 in the first half, but in the second they came back to win once Shaq started getting the ball. (little side note, anyone else noticing the Heat are terrible in their dynasty? they are like 3-18 in mine and were the same when I simmed through one).

    I don't have a chance to test this any further the next week since my schedule has the Knicks, Bucks and Bulls, I just play the Bulls to see their young guys and I already played both of the others this season. But a crazy thing happens, they goto Chandler and Curry ALL GAME LONG. Combined they have 30 shots, making 17 and scoring 39 points. Hinrich was the only other guy on their team to shoot more than 10 shots.

    Curry is a 67 and Chandler is a 66. Shaq is a 92 and Duncan an 89. Why does the CPU get two guys in the 60s on the same team more involved than two of the most dominating big men in the game? Duncan is 14 points higher than anyone else on his team, he should be the clear star of the team in this "superstar based" playing system EA is suppossed to have. Shaq has even more of a difference between him and the 2nd best guy on the team.

    This star based stuff works great for PG, SG and SFs, the best player at those positions almost always leads the CPU team in shots and points. But the way the CPU handles star big men is questionable at best. Duncan only misses one shot all game against an 18 year old rookie and he only gets a dozen touches? The CPU is, for the most part, really good this year, the superstar stuff does work when you're playing Kobe or TMac, but it just doesn't seem like the CPU can recognize when their best player is a big man.

    Just thought I would post that, obviously I want to play some more big time big men to see how it works, but I am really confussed right now. and BTW, I never really paid a whole lot of attention to the CPU's use of big men in previous games, but they were never the primary souce of offense, the Bulls game is the only time where the CPU has actually dominated me all game long with their big men.

    and please don't respond with a "some people look for any flaws they can find! people will find anything to bash Live!!!" or something like that, how I feel about this game has nothing to do with this, I just found this really interesting and I wanted to see if anyone else has gotten similar results.
  • Stu
    All Star
    • Jun 2004
    • 7924

    #2
    Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

    I don't think i've played a game against a dominating big man yet. I'll try one and let you know what I find out.
    Sim Gaming Network

    Comment

    • Stu
      All Star
      • Jun 2004
      • 7924

      #3
      Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

      I don't think i've played a game against a dominating big man yet. I'll try one and let you know what I find out.
      Sim Gaming Network

      Comment

      • Jistic
        Hall Of Fame
        • Mar 2003
        • 16405

        #4
        Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

        Shaq had 30 something points against me (I was also Orlando). Couldn't stop him, he just dunked...and dunked...and dunked. Seriously he got the ball at one point like 6 or 7 times in a row.

        Maybe they don't do it every time but he ate me up the one time we played him. Also when I played Garnett the same thing happened. Not granted he's a '4' but he busted it inside all night for 37 points. Maybe try playing him again and see what happens.

        Even Yao did pretty well against me, but TMac was high scorer for Houston.
        PSN: JISTIC_OS
        XBOX LIVE: JISTIC

        Comment

        • Jistic
          Hall Of Fame
          • Mar 2003
          • 16405

          #5
          Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

          Shaq had 30 something points against me (I was also Orlando). Couldn't stop him, he just dunked...and dunked...and dunked. Seriously he got the ball at one point like 6 or 7 times in a row.

          Maybe they don't do it every time but he ate me up the one time we played him. Also when I played Garnett the same thing happened. Not granted he's a '4' but he busted it inside all night for 37 points. Maybe try playing him again and see what happens.

          Even Yao did pretty well against me, but TMac was high scorer for Houston.
          PSN: JISTIC_OS
          XBOX LIVE: JISTIC

          Comment

          • CM1847
            Bacon
            • Jul 2002
            • 5372

            #6
            Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

            Originally posted by Jistic
            Shaq had 30 something points against me (I was also Orlando). Couldn't stop him, he just dunked...and dunked...and dunked. Seriously he got the ball at one point like 6 or 7 times in a row.

            Maybe they don't do it every time but he ate me up the one time we played him. Also when I played Garnett the same thing happened. Not granted he's a '4' but he busted it inside all night for 37 points. Maybe try playing him again and see what happens.

            Even Yao did pretty well against me, but TMac was high scorer for Houston.
            That's good news. Duncan played like that against me in the 2nd half of the game, but they just didn't goto him enough. He'd get the ball and either do a backdown for a dunk or lay in or hit a 5 foot jumper, it was impossible to stop (as it should be, Dwight Howard should have absolutely NO answer for Duncan). The Heat did start feeding Shaq a good amount, but he just took bad shots, too many jumpers, not enough back downs(I'm not really worried about that, i just don't understand him not getting the ball in the first half).

            I want to test it out more, hopefully I'll have the chance to in my next few games. My first handful of games went normal because I never noticed anything like this, so hopefully it was just a little weird stretch of games for me.

            Comment

            • CM1847
              Bacon
              • Jul 2002
              • 5372

              #7
              Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

              Originally posted by Jistic
              Shaq had 30 something points against me (I was also Orlando). Couldn't stop him, he just dunked...and dunked...and dunked. Seriously he got the ball at one point like 6 or 7 times in a row.

              Maybe they don't do it every time but he ate me up the one time we played him. Also when I played Garnett the same thing happened. Not granted he's a '4' but he busted it inside all night for 37 points. Maybe try playing him again and see what happens.

              Even Yao did pretty well against me, but TMac was high scorer for Houston.
              That's good news. Duncan played like that against me in the 2nd half of the game, but they just didn't goto him enough. He'd get the ball and either do a backdown for a dunk or lay in or hit a 5 foot jumper, it was impossible to stop (as it should be, Dwight Howard should have absolutely NO answer for Duncan). The Heat did start feeding Shaq a good amount, but he just took bad shots, too many jumpers, not enough back downs(I'm not really worried about that, i just don't understand him not getting the ball in the first half).

              I want to test it out more, hopefully I'll have the chance to in my next few games. My first handful of games went normal because I never noticed anything like this, so hopefully it was just a little weird stretch of games for me.

              Comment

              • Miles_Yuhas
                MVP
                • Mar 2004
                • 2689

                #8
                Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                Originally posted by CM1847
                I am going along in my Dynasty and I noticed something interesting today. I only play one game a week on my team's schedule just so I can make it through the season, and I realized I hadn't played a dominating big man yet. So I had the Spurs on one week, I decided to play it and see what Duncan did. In the first half he touched the ball TWICE and scored both times. The second half was a little better as he touched it 10 or 12 times, shooting 7/8 in the half. He ended up with 18 points on 9/10 shooting. My big men aren't good(I play as Orlando) and I expected him to handle Howard pretty easily, but he only touched the ball 15 times at most on offense all game. Ganobili and Parker both score over 20 and take 15-20 shots a piece. I won this game.

                I am a little annoyed(annoyed because they SHOULD have beat me, if Duncan got the ball more they would have won easy), but not really a big deal at this point, but I see the Heat on my schedule for the next week and go ahead and play that one to see what Shaq does. In the first half Shaq got the ball ONCE and scored, he had 2 points on 1/1 shooting in the entire half. The second half was a lot better, he got tons of touches but made some bad shots(he would settle for jumpers in the paint instead of trying to back me down). He ended with 14 points on 5-12 shooting (4-7 from the line). I was beating them by about 20 in the first half, but in the second they came back to win once Shaq started getting the ball. (little side note, anyone else noticing the Heat are terrible in their dynasty? they are like 3-18 in mine and were the same when I simmed through one).

                I don't have a chance to test this any further the next week since my schedule has the Knicks, Bucks and Bulls, I just play the Bulls to see their young guys and I already played both of the others this season. But a crazy thing happens, they goto Chandler and Curry ALL GAME LONG. Combined they have 30 shots, making 17 and scoring 39 points. Hinrich was the only other guy on their team to shoot more than 10 shots.

                Curry is a 67 and Chandler is a 66. Shaq is a 92 and Duncan an 89. Why does the CPU get two guys in the 60s on the same team more involved than two of the most dominating big men in the game? Duncan is 14 points higher than anyone else on his team, he should be the clear star of the team in this "superstar based" playing system EA is suppossed to have. Shaq has even more of a difference between him and the 2nd best guy on the team.

                This star based stuff works great for PG, SG and SFs, the best player at those positions almost always leads the CPU team in shots and points. But the way the CPU handles star big men is questionable at best. Duncan only misses one shot all game against an 18 year old rookie and he only gets a dozen touches? The CPU is, for the most part, really good this year, the superstar stuff does work when you're playing Kobe or TMac, but it just doesn't seem like the CPU can recognize when their best player is a big man.

                Just thought I would post that, obviously I want to play some more big time big men to see how it works, but I am really confussed right now. and BTW, I never really paid a whole lot of attention to the CPU's use of big men in previous games, but they were never the primary souce of offense, the Bulls game is the only time where the CPU has actually dominated me all game long with their big men.

                and please don't respond with a "some people look for any flaws they can find! people will find anything to bash Live!!!" or something like that, how I feel about this game has nothing to do with this, I just found this really interesting and I wanted to see if anyone else has gotten similar results.
                One of the reasons the Bulls go down low is because on the detailed team ratings (the ones with Fastbreak/halfcourt/, outside/inside, physical/ fyniese (Spl) and one other) the bulls' rating has inside almost all the way. Therefore it is the team stategy or coaches stategy to pound the ball inside no matter who's in there.

                Comment

                • Miles_Yuhas
                  MVP
                  • Mar 2004
                  • 2689

                  #9
                  Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                  Originally posted by CM1847
                  I am going along in my Dynasty and I noticed something interesting today. I only play one game a week on my team's schedule just so I can make it through the season, and I realized I hadn't played a dominating big man yet. So I had the Spurs on one week, I decided to play it and see what Duncan did. In the first half he touched the ball TWICE and scored both times. The second half was a little better as he touched it 10 or 12 times, shooting 7/8 in the half. He ended up with 18 points on 9/10 shooting. My big men aren't good(I play as Orlando) and I expected him to handle Howard pretty easily, but he only touched the ball 15 times at most on offense all game. Ganobili and Parker both score over 20 and take 15-20 shots a piece. I won this game.

                  I am a little annoyed(annoyed because they SHOULD have beat me, if Duncan got the ball more they would have won easy), but not really a big deal at this point, but I see the Heat on my schedule for the next week and go ahead and play that one to see what Shaq does. In the first half Shaq got the ball ONCE and scored, he had 2 points on 1/1 shooting in the entire half. The second half was a lot better, he got tons of touches but made some bad shots(he would settle for jumpers in the paint instead of trying to back me down). He ended with 14 points on 5-12 shooting (4-7 from the line). I was beating them by about 20 in the first half, but in the second they came back to win once Shaq started getting the ball. (little side note, anyone else noticing the Heat are terrible in their dynasty? they are like 3-18 in mine and were the same when I simmed through one).

                  I don't have a chance to test this any further the next week since my schedule has the Knicks, Bucks and Bulls, I just play the Bulls to see their young guys and I already played both of the others this season. But a crazy thing happens, they goto Chandler and Curry ALL GAME LONG. Combined they have 30 shots, making 17 and scoring 39 points. Hinrich was the only other guy on their team to shoot more than 10 shots.

                  Curry is a 67 and Chandler is a 66. Shaq is a 92 and Duncan an 89. Why does the CPU get two guys in the 60s on the same team more involved than two of the most dominating big men in the game? Duncan is 14 points higher than anyone else on his team, he should be the clear star of the team in this "superstar based" playing system EA is suppossed to have. Shaq has even more of a difference between him and the 2nd best guy on the team.

                  This star based stuff works great for PG, SG and SFs, the best player at those positions almost always leads the CPU team in shots and points. But the way the CPU handles star big men is questionable at best. Duncan only misses one shot all game against an 18 year old rookie and he only gets a dozen touches? The CPU is, for the most part, really good this year, the superstar stuff does work when you're playing Kobe or TMac, but it just doesn't seem like the CPU can recognize when their best player is a big man.

                  Just thought I would post that, obviously I want to play some more big time big men to see how it works, but I am really confussed right now. and BTW, I never really paid a whole lot of attention to the CPU's use of big men in previous games, but they were never the primary souce of offense, the Bulls game is the only time where the CPU has actually dominated me all game long with their big men.

                  and please don't respond with a "some people look for any flaws they can find! people will find anything to bash Live!!!" or something like that, how I feel about this game has nothing to do with this, I just found this really interesting and I wanted to see if anyone else has gotten similar results.
                  One of the reasons the Bulls go down low is because on the detailed team ratings (the ones with Fastbreak/halfcourt/, outside/inside, physical/ fyniese (Spl) and one other) the bulls' rating has inside almost all the way. Therefore it is the team stategy or coaches stategy to pound the ball inside no matter who's in there.

                  Comment

                  • CM1847
                    Bacon
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 5372

                    #10
                    Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                    Another game, same frustration....

                    Played Minnesota, expecting Garnett to dominate....

                    While he did have 20 points, THREE other players had more shots than him. Cassell took 14 shots, scoring 14 points, Sprewell took 16 scoring 16 and Wally took 30 shots scoring 22.

                    Garnett was 9 of 13, with 5 of those makes in the 4th quarter. They finally started going to him and they came back and lost by 3(were down by 10 or so in the 3rd quarter). I thought it might be something with my defender's defensive awareness rating but Grant Hill was on Wally most of the game and he's got the 2nd highest D Aware rating on my team. Howard(who was guarding KG) has the lowest of my starters. The only reason I don't like this is because KG dominated whenever he got the ball, but they would hardley ever give it to him. If a guy is scoring everytime he touches it they won't stop giving it to him until the D stops him.

                    I've got the Rockets in the next week in my season, TMac will probably dominate but hopefully Yao will at least be a factor early in the game.

                    Comment

                    • CM1847
                      Bacon
                      • Jul 2002
                      • 5372

                      #11
                      Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                      Another game, same frustration....

                      Played Minnesota, expecting Garnett to dominate....

                      While he did have 20 points, THREE other players had more shots than him. Cassell took 14 shots, scoring 14 points, Sprewell took 16 scoring 16 and Wally took 30 shots scoring 22.

                      Garnett was 9 of 13, with 5 of those makes in the 4th quarter. They finally started going to him and they came back and lost by 3(were down by 10 or so in the 3rd quarter). I thought it might be something with my defender's defensive awareness rating but Grant Hill was on Wally most of the game and he's got the 2nd highest D Aware rating on my team. Howard(who was guarding KG) has the lowest of my starters. The only reason I don't like this is because KG dominated whenever he got the ball, but they would hardley ever give it to him. If a guy is scoring everytime he touches it they won't stop giving it to him until the D stops him.

                      I've got the Rockets in the next week in my season, TMac will probably dominate but hopefully Yao will at least be a factor early in the game.

                      Comment

                      • Furq
                        MVP
                        • Oct 2003
                        • 1236

                        #12
                        Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                        yeah i get the same thing where the computer barely shoots with their big men

                        Comment

                        • Furq
                          MVP
                          • Oct 2003
                          • 1236

                          #13
                          Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                          yeah i get the same thing where the computer barely shoots with their big men

                          Comment

                          • Alliball
                            MVP
                            • Aug 2004
                            • 2368

                            #14
                            Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                            Zack Randolph scored 50 points against me. Are you setting up the double team on thes guys in your matchups screen? That may be the issue, because the AI may be reluctant to go to them if they are double teamed.

                            Comment

                            • Alliball
                              MVP
                              • Aug 2004
                              • 2368

                              #15
                              Re: Curious CPU BIg Men AI....

                              Zack Randolph scored 50 points against me. Are you setting up the double team on thes guys in your matchups screen? That may be the issue, because the AI may be reluctant to go to them if they are double teamed.

                              Comment

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