Your MVP candidates and why...

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  • JohnJohnson
    Banned
    • Jul 2005
    • 320

    #46
    Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

    Originally posted by Kashanova
    tell me who shoots the most shots, who plays second most mins, takes most ft's and shots under 70%, if ginobli and horry aren't on the spurs they don't win the chip, the system of the spurs is great cause they have all pieces that make it suceed k.g would do better in this system since he's more versatile and is way better then TD. and i wasnt comparing football and basketball just too very overrated players that happen to be in different sports
    People need to stop making excuses for KG. "If he had Duncan's teammates..." Come on now, KG has been in the league about 8 years now. The excuses need to stop. He's a great player, but he's no Tim Duncan.

    "If the Spurs don't have Horry and Ginobili, they don't win the championship"

    If the Bulls don't have Jordan, they don't win the championship. Does that mean Jordan isn't the greatest of all time?

    Comment

    • Pointguard
      MVP
      • Jun 2005
      • 2977

      #47
      Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

      Originally posted by Kashanova
      Shaq has something duncan has there is nobody 1 on 1 who can guard but i've seen people who can guard TD this is a great advantage cause when shaq gets double team he can get others involve if someone locks duncan everyone else gets guarded, and i see your not even going to compare k.g which is good cause he's always been better
      Rarely does Duncan recieve 1v1 coverage, just like Shaq. Even Detroit, who had two very good defenders in Rasheed and Big Ben and with Duncan 80%, double teamed Duncan often.

      Maybe Shaq does have an advantage over Duncan in 1v1 scoring, though Duncan is still a top 3 scoring big man, but Duncan's advantage in almost every other area out-weights Shaq's advantage.

      And rarely do you see someone locking Duncan.

      As far as KG, he's probably more talented and as I said, he's the only player in the league you can make a case for. I give Duncan the advantage because of his rings but its a toss up.

      Comment

      • mvb34
        S**c*d* P**l C*-Ch*mp**n
        • Jul 2002
        • 8138

        #48
        Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

        Originally posted by Sarah
        Yeah, then why did they miss the playoffs seeing as he also has a good supporting cast behind him, Wally, Spree, Cassel, Hudson and others I don't know. If injuries is an excuse, SA is not immune to it. I guess thier is one thing Garnett doesn't have and Duncan have, leadership skills over Garnett. That weigh more than stats.
        Umm last yearr Minnesota team support cast was awful, you two guys was worry more about money then playing.. I like to see Duncan have to play with those types of issues
        http://www.twitch.tv/mikecharles34

        Comment

        • Sarah
          MVP
          • May 2003
          • 2609

          #49
          Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

          Originally posted by mvb34
          Umm last yearr Minnesota team support cast was awful, you two guys was worry more about money then playing.. I like to see Duncan have to play with those types of issues
          Well I think he did. When David Robinson retired, it was a major blow to the team but they still remain consistent against the best team in the West. Considering also that Parker was way more inconsistent that time compared now and Manu's gameplay is not yet that good compared now. They only have Malik Rose and Steve Kerr as the veterans and Rasho as a replacement for David Robinson in the middle. Though SA does have Bruce Bowen in the team and remained consistent as he is now. SA also suffered blows in the last 5 years but remained focus in thier goal. After Robinson retires, they don't have any big names in thier team except Duncan. NOW, they have big names, but not before running away with thier first championship without David Robinson in the middle.

          MIN was successful a year before Cassel and Spree came, and then made some noises the following year and then dissapeared. I guess we could blame Kevin McHale for hiring disruptive players, but then Spree is a pretty good name back then to pass.

          Comment

          • mvb34
            S**c*d* P**l C*-Ch*mp**n
            • Jul 2002
            • 8138

            #50
            Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

            Well I think he did. When David Robinson retired, it was a major blow to the team but they still remain consistent against the best team in the West. Considering also that Parker was way more inconsistent that time compared now and Manu's gameplay is not yet that good compared now. They only have Malik Rose and Steve Kerr as the veterans and Rasho as a replacement for David Robinson in the middle. Though SA does have Bruce Bowen in the team and remained consistent as he is now. SA also suffered blows in the last 5 years but remained focus in thier goal. After Robinson retires, they don't have any big names in thier team except Duncan. NOW, they have big names, but not before running away with thier first championship without David Robinson in the middle.
            Man what are you talking about Tim Duncan has never played where other teammates cried and quit on him. Thats what happen to KG last year..
            http://www.twitch.tv/mikecharles34

            Comment

            • Kashanova
              Hall Of Fame
              • Aug 2003
              • 12695

              #51
              Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

              Chesmistry messed up the t wolves season and as far as i know duncan has never had to go with these types of things and you made the arguement for me after robinson left duncan could not take the spurs to the promise land cause the players weren't consistent enough so it had nothing to do with td but now that ginobli and park are playing much better plus some additional pieces like barry udrih and some great plays by horry the spurs are champs. If duncan is with the t wolves this pass season there in the lottery top 5 pick in the draft, and jj we know k.g is no TD because k.g is way better then k.g the whole arguement of rings is so flawed cause not one player wins the championship its the team so being able to say if k.g has duncan teammates can be used, tim duncan has to be greatful that he landed in such a great organization cause if he's not with the spurs, and lands with phila, vancover, or boston i dont think gets even one ring

              Comment

              • Sarah
                MVP
                • May 2003
                • 2609

                #52
                Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                Originally posted by Kashanova
                Chesmistry messed up the t wolves season and as far as i know duncan has never had to go with these types of things and you made the arguement for me after robinson left duncan could not take the spurs to the promise land cause the players weren't consistent enough so it had nothing to do with td but now that ginobli and park are playing much better plus some additional pieces like barry udrih and some great plays by horry the spurs are champs. If duncan is with the t wolves this pass season there in the lottery top 5 pick in the draft, and jj we know k.g is no TD because k.g is way better then k.g the whole arguement of rings is so flawed cause not one player wins the championship its the team so being able to say if k.g has duncan teammates can be used, tim duncan has to be greatful that he landed in such a great organization cause if he's not with the spurs, and lands with phila, vancover, or boston i dont think gets even one ring

                Thier you go, chemistry is messed up. Where is the leader of MIN then? When the team needed him the most he wasn't able to lead them accordingly. During the time when I watch MIN play, I only see one player playing and pretty much no matter how good that player is, he can only do so much.

                Everybody knows that if you have a disgruntled player calling the play it is a dissaster, or if you have a solid player who can't be in the same page with you is still a disaster. They where doing fine a year before those old farts came, why did they allowed themselves to be messed up is beyond me.

                I guess that is where Greg come in, just like Belichick, he is willing to sacrifice anyone if they can't be on the same page with Duncan regardless of who or what they are.

                Put Duncan on another team like Philly, damn as if Manu is not good enough now he has AI to go along with him.

                Put Duncan and Greg on MIN and Wally will rock the world, and Hudson will be a solid PG/SG defender. Maybe with Greg, they could make something out of Olowokandi, and Fred Hoiberg will assume the role of Steve Kerr or Barry. Make Anthony Carter a consistent PG just enough to be able to call the right plays, and make Madsen a consistent defender/hustler. Whatever Greg did with SA is the same thing he will do with MIN if he and Duncan will be brought over to MIN. They will go deep in the playoffs but they won't win a championship since they needed some time to get along.

                I still beleive that MIN has the right pieces to be a contender, but they can't just play on the same page. Right now Duncan is still a better player because just like Garnett, he is an MVP just doing what he does best, and leading the team to 2 championships under his leadership. Now stop about that nonsensed you are trying to bring up about Manu and Barry and such because whatever they do on the court revolves around Duncan. How did I know? SA's gameplan revolve around Duncan.

                Plus if MIN wanted to succeed, most likely Hudson and Wally will play a major part of it unless they get traded. If they will really play exceptionally I wonder if that will also take away some star points out of Garnett. You know, instead of being a great player he will just be a good player because now he has to share the ball more just like what Duncan does best.

                Comment

                • mvb34
                  S**c*d* P**l C*-Ch*mp**n
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 8138

                  #53
                  Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                  Plus if MIN wanted to succeed, most likely Hudson and Wally will play a major part of it unless they get traded. If they will really play exceptionally I wonder if that will also take away some star points out of Garnett. You know, instead of being a great player he will just be a good player because now he has to share the ball more just like what Duncan does best.

                  Again what are you talking about?? KG shares the ball now he is 20-10-5 player
                  http://www.twitch.tv/mikecharles34

                  Comment

                  • garnettrules21
                    MVP
                    • Oct 2003
                    • 2392

                    #54
                    Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                    Originally posted by mvb34
                    Again what are you talking about?? KG shares the ball now he is 20-10-5 player
                    actually hes a 22-14-6 player, but yea if anything KG needs to be more selfish and take more shots, but he likes to get everyone else involved and i think sometimes that hurts the team. I think if he wanted to he could be a 26-29 ppg player if he would just get a little more selfish.

                    Comment

                    • Sarah
                      MVP
                      • May 2003
                      • 2609

                      #55
                      Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                      Originally posted by mvb34
                      Again what are you talking about?? KG shares the ball now he is 20-10-5 player
                      When did I say he doesn't share the ball. He does share the ball but they are not playing on the same page. Not making to the playoffs is an statement that what they are doing is not good enough as a team. I love Garnett but I won't put him ahead of Duncan yet. But then I don't look at stats if I wanted to judge a player (not that I judge Garnett or something). Duncan stats is very close to KG's stats while winning championships eventhough Duncan has a better career points per game. Hudson and Wally are way better players than what they showed last year. Wally alone has the capability to drop 20 points per game, now that is a huge chip off the back of KG. Hudson also can drop 10 to 15 points per game plus above average defensive skills. Now if only Garnett can bring the best out of these players on the same page as him just like before Spree and Sam came, oh HOU and PHX has every reason to be threathened.

                      But hey, it's all up to Garnett and whoever there coach would be.

                      Comment

                      • Kashanova
                        Hall Of Fame
                        • Aug 2003
                        • 12695

                        #56
                        Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                        Originally posted by Sarah
                        When did I say he doesn't share the ball. He does share the ball but they are not playing on the same page. Not making to the playoffs is an statement that what they are doing is not good enough as a team. I love Garnett but I won't put him ahead of Duncan yet. But then I don't look at stats if I wanted to judge a player (not that I judge Garnett or something). Duncan stats is very close to KG's stats while winning championships eventhough Duncan has a better career points per game. Hudson and Wally are way better players than what they showed last year. Wally alone has the capability to drop 20 points per game, now that is a huge chip off the back of KG. Hudson also can drop 10 to 15 points per game plus above average defensive skills. Now if only Garnett can bring the best out of these players on the same page as him just like before Spree and Sam came, oh HOU and PHX has every reason to be threathened.

                        But hey, it's all up to Garnett and whoever there coach would be.

                        WHOA WHOA WHOA!!!! Stop it right there duncan stats are no where near k.g's first of all k.g is a way better free throw shooter then duncan while duncan shoots under 70 k.g shots 81 percent, k.g is also a better rebounder then duncan while weighing almost 40 pounds less, not only is k.g a better rebounder he's also a better passer and gets others involved more then TD does, k.g also steals more then TD and shoots a better percentage of field goals now all this talk about k.g having to bring out the best in these players he's already shown he has both players having career years while in min

                        Comment

                        • JohnJohnson
                          Banned
                          • Jul 2005
                          • 320

                          #57
                          Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                          Originally posted by Kashanova
                          WHOA WHOA WHOA!!!! Stop it right there duncan stats are no where near k.g's first of all k.g is a way better free throw shooter then duncan while duncan shoots under 70 k.g shots 81 percent, k.g is also a better rebounder then duncan while weighing almost 40 pounds less, not only is k.g a better rebounder he's also a better passer and gets others involved more then TD does, k.g also steals more then TD and shoots a better percentage of field goals now all this talk about k.g having to bring out the best in these players he's already shown he has both players having career years while in min
                          Prime example of why you can't base everything on stats.

                          Comment

                          • Kashanova
                            Hall Of Fame
                            • Aug 2003
                            • 12695

                            #58
                            Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                            Originally posted by JohnJohnson
                            Prime example of why you can't base everything on stats.
                            Prime example why you do base it on stats when comparing two players to see which is better at the game posting stats is a great way to do it cause you see what he does and it's obvious that K.G. Performs better then T.D.

                            Comment

                            • fobbybobby23
                              Pro
                              • Sep 2004
                              • 825

                              #59
                              Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                              i agree with kash

                              KG > duncan

                              the reason why minny is struggling and san antonio isnt is easy, look at the coaches, the situation the team is/was in, the GM the management...

                              minny's failure can be attributed to so many different levels

                              and then look at minny's bench/team! coaching was part of the reason szczerbiak didn't have a more involved role, also take out duncan and garnett from both teams and compare them, san antonio creams minny at every position last season, it was no contest

                              Comment

                              • garnettrules21
                                MVP
                                • Oct 2003
                                • 2392

                                #60
                                Re: Your MVP candidates and why...

                                if you put garnett on the spurs and duncan on the wolves last year, the outcome would have been the exact same. ducan is really good but he wouldnt have taken the timberwolves and futher than garnett did. the spurs have an excellent team that meshed well, the timberwolves had two cry babies that should have helped the team, but ultimately hurt it. it really comes down to the team the player is surrounded by.

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